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Old 04-05-2012   #41
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I disagree. It's more expensive than some better performing AF cameras, sure. I find the IQ, handling, lens quality, etc etc, to make it more than worth the price. My experience (I own the 35 and the 18, not exp with the 60 but it's on the way). I do agree that the AF is a weakness, in that it could be both faster and consistent. It's not confusing to us that understood what we were getting and why??

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Originally Posted by Aristophanes View Post
I tried the X-Pro 1 in the camera store and, as I like to do when I go in in the evening and talk to the sales staff, I asked them to dim the lights to check out the low-light performance.

For an AF camera, the AF is not very good. For a very expensive camera, the AF is not very good. In fact, it wasn't very good in better light. Too many shots were a struggle. Used the 35mm lens at various apertures. I tried some manual focus...ugh.

So I took a Nikon D3100 out and tried the same and the D3100 blew the AF of the X-Pro 1 out of the water. No contest, the smaller Nikon DSLR won handily.

They did not have a Ricoh GXR for me to try as comparison. They were sold out of the Fuji X100's.

My conclusion is that the X-Pro 1 is an AF cameras by design, and the AF lags considerably what one would expect for the investment.

It was also bigger and heavier than I thought. Lenses look to be excellent and much cheaper than M-mount. Lens + body may be more compact than a DSLR, but giving up the DSLR's advantages like bang-on PDAF is a serious concern for the price of the X-Pro 1.

Confusing camera.
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Old 04-05-2012   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcsang View Post
As an FYI - the Canon 5D was about $3300 for the body only - I can honestly say the AF system was no better on that body.

Not trying to "justify" Fuji's lack of a really good AF system (to be honest, I wish all cameras had the AF system of Nikon.. they seem to have nailed it) but my comment re: 5D is more to compare the fact that there are cameras that can and do cost a lot more which have equally "craptacular" AF systems

Cheers,
Dave
That's sad. Maybe you should switch to Nikon . AF in low light is always a huge challenge but I've had better performance in club lighting with my D50 and D90 in past years but their hi ISO performance can't touch the xpro1. Don't get me wrong, I really like this camera in many many ways. I just wish that low light focusing was more reliable and I could leave the dSLR at home.
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Old 04-05-2012   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperB View Post
That's sad. Maybe you should switch to Nikon . AF in low light is always a huge challenge but I've had better performance in club lighting with my D50 and D90 in past years but their hi ISO performance can't touch the xpro1. Don't get me wrong, I really like this camera in many many ways. I just wish that low light focusing was more reliable and I could leave the dSLR at home.
I already did switch to Nikon... 3 years ago - with the D700s I own. That's how I know how good and bad AF accuracy can be; even among the big players who "know" what they're doing in the game

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Dave
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Old 04-05-2012   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjamin Marks View Post
Inexcusable? Just watch this: Fuji: I excuse you. There. That wasn't so bad, was it? Honestly, AF failure in a coal mine? Doesn't seem like much of an Achilles Heel to me.

Sorry: [/SnarkOFF] I guess if I was a concert-photographer, I would want to know about this limitation so I could plan around it. But isn't that the same as any other camera, regardless of price point?

BTW, I really like the photos you did make, even within the camera's limitations. I wonder if the answer to this isn't to use a fast RF lens like the C/V 35/1.2 and to avoid the autofocus issue altogether. Wouldn't prefocus work better in this situation anyway due to low light?
Even prefocus would be tough at very shallow DOF when band members are moving around a lot. It would be great for performers who are more static onstage. Norah Jones, Ray LaMontagne, Jann Arden and Sarah McLachlan come to mind. Bands, not so much.
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Old 04-05-2012   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcsang View Post
I already did switch to Nikon... 3 years ago - with the D700s I own. That's how I know how good and bad AF accuracy can be; even among the big players who "know" what they're doing in the game

Cheers,
Dave
If you are saying that the AF in a D700 can miss focus in dim light, I'll vouch for that. No AF system I have tried is perfect 100% of the time. On a lot of occasions the fault was mine for not having selected the correct AF configuration. It takes time to get to know a particular camera's AF system and have it properly set for the shooting conditions you are in.

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Old 04-05-2012   #46
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OK, never mind, then.

Even the D700's vaunted AF has failed to impress me in low-light environments (& even Canonphiles acknowledge the shortcomings of the 5D, Marks I & II), all of which really makes me wish Leica would just get on w/it & put a good modern sensor in the M10.

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I rechecked the camera settings and I had remembered to set the AF to area not multi. :0)It was exposure I hadn't changed to spot metering. Apologies for error. I too, use single spot AF for concert photography with my Nikons.
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Old 04-05-2012   #47
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How much does a camera body have to cost to actually work well out of the box? I mean, would it cost two grand a body to work for both Norah Jones AND Anti-flag?

(I know some of you find it working quite well for how you shoot. Good for you. But if Fuji techs are telling people that the "AF issue" will be fixed in future firmware upgrades, then the company is admitting they have released a horse from the starting gate that is simply not fit to race. Now Fuji corporate has to stand behind their tech and admit their charade, or say that the guy misspoke, and try to convince people like the OP that there's no problem at all. Tough position. That they stepped right into.)
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Old 04-05-2012   #48
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I found my D700 was excellent in low light. Perfect? No! But scary good. Just because you can find limitations in that system, doesn't mean that the camera that costs almost as much (X-1) isn't far far behind it.
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Old 04-05-2012   #49
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Quote:
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Also, I'll quickly note that the focussing speed will surely be upgraded through the next few firmware updates - the x100 started off as a slow focuser but after a few little updates it's truly quite impressive now. Focusses better than my 5d in most situations.
We don't know that, necessarily. The XP1 already has the benefit of the X100's year of firmware development. The X100 can also have AF optimized for a single, light lens.
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Old 04-05-2012   #50
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re: AF vs SLRs, I've never had a SLR with a fast prime that was legitimately slow to focus in low light from near to far using single point middle and recomposing. Not saying it was always dead on in accuracy, but everything from the Elan 7e to 5D to the D700 to my new 645N has been fast.
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Old 04-05-2012   #51
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Well, ideally the body would be free. I think people just have different expectations/definitions of "good" or acceptable AF. And as the OP or anyone who shoots shows knows, dark performance venues just happen to be 1 of the most demanding environments for autofocus. Per willie_901's post, anyone expecting the AF on these little cameras to perform the same as the AF on a big dSLR is fooling themselves. Size matters because accurate AF requires processing power, which requires space. I haven't been keeping up w/what Fuji has been saying about this, but shame on them if they actually led people to believe that the X-Pro1's AF would be as fast & accurate as a D700.

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How much does a camera body have to cost to actually work well out of the box? I mean, would it cost two grand a body to work for both Norah Jones AND Anti-flag?

(I know some of you find it working quite well for how you shoot. Good for you. But if Fuji techs are telling people that the "AF issue" will be fixed in future firmware upgrades, then the company is admitting they have released a horse from the starting gate that is simply not fit to race. Now Fuji corporate has to stand behind their tech and admit their charade, or say that the guy misspoke, and try to convince people like the OP that there's no problem at all. Tough position. That they stepped right into.)
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Old 04-05-2012   #52
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manual focus is the only way i've ever shot in conditions like that. more accurate, faster, etc. i only use AF with any camera for good light, happy snap conditions.
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Old 04-05-2012   #53
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Great shots but I do agree with you regarding its focusing issues. I would hope Fuji would address this in the firmware upgrade.
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Old 04-05-2012   #54
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I'm not sure that having slower AF than a lot of cameras some people prefer means it's not "working quite well out of the box". There seems to be a lot more people who don't own the camera complaining that it's not a good camera than those who do. I wouldn't mind the focusing being the best of any camera ever made by human hands. I'd also like it to be a lot faster than it is now. But I can't say I've missed a shot with it. I do think that the motor/lens combo is slower than I'm used to nowadays. But I'd also not expect faster in low light (nor more accurate and decisive) and I'm not missing shots. That doesn't mean you shouldn't, but there are really not a lot of cameras around that handle that well, and I don't believe I've read anything from Fuji claiming as such.

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Originally Posted by dreilly View Post
How much does a camera body have to cost to actually work well out of the box? I mean, would it cost two grand a body to work for both Norah Jones AND Anti-flag?

(I know some of you find it working quite well for how you shoot. Good for you. But if Fuji techs are telling people that the "AF issue" will be fixed in future firmware upgrades, then the company is admitting they have released a horse from the starting gate that is simply not fit to race. Now Fuji corporate has to stand behind their tech and admit their charade, or say that the guy misspoke, and try to convince people like the OP that there's no problem at all. Tough position. That they stepped right into.)
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Old 04-05-2012   #55
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There seems to be a lot more people who don't own the camera complaining that it's not a good camera than those who do.
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Old 04-05-2012   #56
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It's funny to observe how criticizing anything Fuji (and look at that price tag) gets so many so defensive of the products, that at best can be called beta. When something that just launched already gets posts about hoped-for firmware updates, there's something not totally right. But it's swearing in church to call it by its name. But the truth is this is an AF camera that doesn't do AF very well. Nor MF. For more than €2000 euro.
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Old 04-05-2012   #57
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I have tested this camera in a shop like the OP did. No chance to get a shot in focus. Im pretty disappointed because I was to buy it for night shots in clubs and bars where my friends playing music. So Ill do my "quick and dirty" bar shots with a Leica M3 or a CLE in the future too. Metering the scene first, usually 1/8 sec. with f 4 and HP5, and klick it away.
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Old 04-05-2012   #58
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Last night's Fuji adventure here was trying to photograph dancing. I found it fine for slower dances, not at all fine for lively ones. The only other autofocus system I've used to any extent, though, is a Contax G2 so I really haven't anything to make meaningful comparisons to. For me it's just "not fine" relative to some aspirational system that may or may not exist. It's faster than manual focus but that says little.

It was initially more frustrating since with manual focus you focus & the focus point stays put. With the Fuji it was refocusing every time. My solution: put it in manual focus mode & adjust to using the AF-L button to focus rather than the shutter button. I found that a more useable system. It's possible the time to focus lock is a bit longer that way but I see no reason it should be true and it may be my imagination.
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Old 04-05-2012   #59
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I didn't know you could focus using the AE-L/AF-L button, & definitely not in M(anual?) mode! There's nothing in the instruction manual about this feature (maybe it was lost in translation from the Japanese). Thanks for the discovery.

I was just complaining to a mutual friend how when the camera is set for S (& I think C) mode AF, pressing the AE-L/AF-L button (even when it's set for AF or AF + AE lock) doesn't actually focus the camera, you still have to 1/2-press the shutter release 1st & simultaneously push the AE-L/AF-L button to lock focus. Most inconvenient & counterintuitive compared to the G2 or any dSLR. Using this "autofocus while in ostensibly manual focus mode" method seems the most G2-like solution, though it does appear to be noticeably slower in focusing.

P.S., welcome to RFF.

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Last night's Fuji adventure here was trying to photograph dancing. I found it fine for slower dances, not at all fine for lively ones. The only other autofocus system I've used to any extent, though, is a Contax G2 so I really haven't anything to make meaningful comparisons to. For me it's just "not fine" relative to some aspirational system that may or may not exist. It's faster than manual focus but that says little.

It was initially more frustrating since with manual focus you focus & the focus point stays put. With the Fuji it was refocusing every time. My solution: put it in manual focus mode & adjust to using the AF-L button to focus rather than the shutter button. I found that a more useable system. It's possible the time to focus lock is a bit longer that way but I see no reason it should be true and it may be my imagination.
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Old 04-05-2012   #60
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On people complaining about a camera they don't own: for months and months there have been threads littering RFF about a non-RF camera that was greeted as the second coming of Barnack by a bunch of people that had never touched or seen the brick itself. At one apex of the hype, someone even seriously wrote to the effect that "we don't know it doesn't have a mechanical rangefinder". How's that different than the current outcry? Well, now we have actual reports of performance limitations and a tacit admission by Fuji that all is not golden.

If someone wants to give me an X-1 Pro I'd be happy to test it out. I'm sure I would find it charming, like my X100. But until then, the religious overblown hype and the irrational defense of a not-fully-baked product whose AF won't allow the photog to take advantage of its great high ISO potential in critical situations will keep my dollars right where they are (owed to my credit card for other camera purchases, natch!)
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Old 04-05-2012   #61
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Quote:
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On people complaining about a camera they don't own: for months and months there have been threads littering RFF about a non-RF camera that was greeted as the second coming of Barnack by a bunch of people that had never touched or seen the brick itself. At one apex of the hype, someone even seriously wrote to the effect that "we don't know it doesn't have a mechanical rangefinder". How's that different than the current outcry? Well, now we have actual reports of performance limitations and a tacit admission by Fuji that all is not golden.

If someone wants to give me an X-1 Pro I'd be happy to test it out. I'm sure I would find it charming, like my X100. But until then, the religious overblown hype and the irrational defense of a not-fully-baked product whose AF won't allow the photog to take advantage of its great high ISO potential in critical situations will keep my dollars right where they are (owed to my credit card for other camera purchases, natch!)
thumbs up! :-) except for the credit card debt. :-(
i pay cash. for everything. if i can't afford to pay cash, i don't buy.

seems to me that many people today want the camera to do everything ... determine and set focus, exposure, wind the shutter, etc. and to do it all with near perfect accuracy all the time, no matter what the circumstances.

i want the camera to do nothing other than what i tell it, when i tell it to. thank the godz there are still cameras that will do that or i'd have to make one.
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Old 04-05-2012   #62
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Quote:
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I didn't know you could focus using the AE-L/AF-L button, & definitely not in M(anual?) mode (there's nothing in the manual)! I was just complaining to a mutual friend how when the camera is set for S (& I think C) mode AF, pressing the AE-L/AF-L button (even when it's set for AF lock) doesn't actually focus the camera, you still have to 1/2-press the shutter release & simultaneously push the AE-L/AF-L button to lock focus. Most inconvenient & counterintuitive compared to the G2 or any dSLR. Using this "autofocus while in ostensibly manual focus mode" method seems the most G2-like solution.

P.S., welcome to RFF.
Chris, I think if it's in S or C the AE-L/AF-L works as an AE-L button then to focus/focus lock you have to depress the shutter button half way. In M mode, it's the other way around -- the AE-L/AF-L is a focus lock and you lock the exposure with a half depressed shutter button. I like that much, much better since a half-depressed shutter button is how I lock the exposure on every other camera I own with a coupled meter.

As for Achilles's heel -- well, it got him in the end, but Achilles was still quite a badass . The autofocus on this camera does not excite me -- it isn't garbage, but it doesn't excite me. But I definitely am excited about:

The 35/1.4 -- this lens is something else.
ISO 3200
The size & weight
The results I get from M lenses on this body are much, much better than the results I got from M lenses on the M8 (with the caveat that I've not yet used any really wide lenses on it).
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Old 04-05-2012   #63
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John:

Actually, after going to the manual & testing it & in S or C modes, I've found that the AE-L/AF-L button can (when set to do so in Shooting Menu 4) work as a AF-L button, but it only locks when you've already focused using the shutter release, it does not work as an AF + AF-L button like every other camera I've used that has an AF-L button (G2 & D700 included). As I wrote above, this is seems stupid & counterintuitve, IMHO, & is currently my only real complaint in my less than 24 hours as an X-Pro1 owner (perhaps my expectations are unusually low because I was traumatized by being 1 of the 1st M8 buyers). Now that we have this other option that you've discovered/stumbled upon, I can wait for Fuji to fix this oversight in future firmware updates (along w/the aperture blade chatter annoyance, @ least when in OVF mode) rather than immediately emailing a complaint to the proper channels.

Not sure how excited I can get over any new camera, but the 18/2 seems more than good enough for me. I agree that ISO 3200 & even 6400 (equal to 2500 on the M9) is nice, as is something resembling accurate auto white balance. Great to hear that your experience w/mounting M lenses is positive.

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Chris, I think if it's in S or C the AE-L/AF-L works as an AE-L button then to focus/focus lock you have to depress the shutter button half way. In M mode, it's the other way around -- the AE-L/AF-L is a focus lock and you lock the exposure with a half depressed shutter button. I like that much, much better since a half-depressed shutter button is how I lock the exposure on every other camera I own with a coupled meter.

As for Achilles's heel -- well, it got him in the end, but Achilles was still quite a badass . The autofocus on this camera does not excite me -- it isn't garbage, but it doesn't excite me. But I definitely am excited about:

The 35/1.4 -- this lens is something else.
ISO 3200
The size & weight
The results I get from M lenses on this body are much, much better than the results I got from M lenses on the M8 (with the caveat that I've not yet used any really wide lenses on it).
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Old 04-05-2012   #64
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Two weeks ago I did MF with a Jupiter 3 on an M8.2 at the performance of McCartney. Since I thought I would miss quite some shots, because of the shalow DOF, I did a lot of shooting and it turned out that was the best way to go, leaving me with enough sharp shots. Of course not only focussing but also the camera's lightmeter was in manual mode.





this one shot with the 135mm Canon ltm lens
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Old 04-05-2012   #65
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Do you recall in which AF mode the demo was set, "Area" or "Multi"? So far, it seems that setting the AF mode to Area in the X-Pro1's Shooting menu + setting the focus mode switch on the front to S (Single AF) is the most like using a RF or "single point" + "single servo" on a Nikon dSLR. With these settings, the X-Pro1's AF appears to work reasonably quickly & accurately (but more like my old Kyocera Contax G2 than an autofocus SLR) in decent to bad light, @ least in my current "test drive" use.
I use the camera with single point focus. Have no problems.

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Originally Posted by gavinlg View Post
Make sure you pick points of contrast to focus on. So for instance when you have a guy standing with stage lights behind him, try to focus on the side of his head, which is shadowed, contrasting with the bright stage lights behind him, instead of trying to focus on his face which is one big low contrast shadow. Same with any AF camera, although mirrorless cameras take a little more care with this.
This makes it way easier. Pick points of contrast.



And one more things I do which helps:
I switch to manual focus, then hit the AF-L button. Even in manual focus it causes the camera to auto focus. You can see in the DoF scale if it found the right spot or not. This works really well in low light. In fact it work so well I do it in daylight. It's the quickest way to focus and it works well. Then you also don't have to worry about the camera picking a new focus point when you half press the shutter.



So to recap. When doing these 3 things I haven't had problems:
1. Single point AF
2. Pick points of contrast
3. Use manual focus but still have the camera do it for you via AF-L.
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Old 04-05-2012   #66
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I should add. According to this post via fuji rumours, Fuji is working on a firmware update to address this:

"John Smith is also testing the X PRO 1. And he got in touch with Fuji to talk about the AF issue: “called Fuji Canada about this AF problem and Gerry, the person at the camera technical support centre, reassured me that Fuji is working on improving the camera. Firmware updates are on the way. I just wish to pass my thanks to Fuji for its concerns for the customers.I was very impressed by the knowledge and helpfulness that I received. ” (via FujiRumors.com)."

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/new-...-the-af-issue/
http://johnsmith-johnsimages.blogspo...titchface.html
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Old 04-05-2012   #67
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It's funny to observe how criticizing anything Fuji (and look at that price tag) gets so many so defensive of the products, that at best can be called beta. When something that just launched already gets posts about hoped-for firmware updates, there's something not totally right. But it's swearing in church to call it by its name. But the truth is this is an AF camera that doesn't do AF very well. Nor MF. For more than 2000 euro.
Ha... I could have sworn your post was about the Leica M8 circa early 2007.

I'm not "defensive" although I can see and totally understand how people can put that label on ANYONE who says they "like" or can "accept" a particular thing (in this case a camera) but it is, as I said in my blog post/review on the Fuji X-Pro1 "Your Mileage May Vary" - if you like it, good for you, if you don't like it, good for you too. There are many many many options out there for all of us now when it comes to digital cameras and no one camera is anywhere near perfect. Find the one that suits your needs and grab it - if it's not available yet, then sit tight with what you have and hope that one of the companies will introduce/produce your dream camera sooner rather than later

Cheers,
Dave
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Old 04-05-2012   #68
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Per my exchange w/JHutchins, may I ask how you figured this out? Messing w/the camera? Prior experience w/the X100 or something? Because it's not mentioned in the manual (@ least the English version) & seems to be counterintuitive (why should an AF-L button do anything when you're Manual focus mode?).

Thanks, Chris

Edit: My bad, it is mentioned in the manual (page 45) , but it still wouldn't naturally occur to me to look in the M section for how to use the AF-L button (this may account for my incompetence to practice corporate law). My other complaint about the AE-L/AF-L button not focusing in S or C mode still stands, however.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nickw View Post
I switch to manual focus, then hit the AF-L button. Even in manual focus it causes the camera to auto focus. You can see in the DoF scale if it found the right spot or not. This works really well in low light. In fact it work so well I do it in daylight. It's the quickest way to focus and it works well. Then you also don't have to worry about the camera picking a new focus point when you half press the shutter.
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Old 04-05-2012   #69
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Originally Posted by furcafe View Post
Per my exchange w/JHutchins, may I ask how you figured this out? Messing w/the camera? Prior experience w/the X100 or something? Because it's not mentioned in the manual (@ least the English version) & seems to be counterintuitive (why should an AF-L button do anything when you're Manual focus mode?).

Thanks, Chris
Chris,

I figured this out after switching the camera from "S" (single) or "C" (continuous) to "M" (manual) focus and having it in "EVF" mode - I noted that something pops up in the EVF within the viewfinder - it says ""AF-L One-Touch AF".

It's not intuitive but it is rather cool once you figure it out

Cheers,
Dave
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Old 04-05-2012   #70
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Dave:

Ha! I guess these modern cameras are like video games: 1/2 the "fun" is finding the Easter eggs.

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Chris,

I figured this out after switching the camera from "S" (single) or "C" (continuous) to "M" (manual) focus and having it in "EVF" mode - I noted that something pops up in the EVF within the viewfinder - it says ""AF-L One-Touch AF".

It's not intuitive but it is rather cool once you figure it out

Cheers,
Dave
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Old 04-05-2012   #71
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Welcome to the internet.
Indeed.

Sure, fanboys fan, and trolls troll. On DPR, the trolls, or at least insincere posters, overwhelm the reasonable AND the fanboys. You're on a Fuji forum/thread? Imagine, those who like Fuji and expect to like their next camera! The audacity. The diff, in my experience, is, the "fanboys" generally have a reasonable approach. They accept and acknowledge the shortcomings of that camera. Doesn't mean they think it's perfect - and generally, they say so - but rather, the troll will ONly say how imperfect it is, then unfairly compare it to every camera around. Sort of kitchen-sinking it. When a "fanboy" objects to "the AF is total ****e", it doesn't mean they're apologists, couldn't it just be that it's not THAT bad? Are there other aspects of the camera that might exceptional, even? Sure. Just like with many other camera models from other mfgr's. A fanboy - to satisfy the reciprocal of the troll - would go farther, like "the AF is the best ever and Fuji is the best company!". But, generally, they don't. Do they?

So which is the more zealous? I can suggest with great confidence that on the Fuji forums I've lurked and posted, there is a great more "trollish" types than there are true "fanboys". You may not agree, but a quick glance through even just the titles of threads sort of makes my case for me. And they're certainly the more extreme, unreasonable, and vocal.

In that context, I can excuse them ("fanboys") for not making it easy for comments such as "the Fuji is the worst 18mm lens produced this millenium" to be thrown around w/o objection. Again, no one is saying the AF on the XP1 is great, or that the X10 doesn't have orbs.

By all (non-troll) accounts, DPR has become a quasi-joke, when it comes to threads about popular cams. It's inundated with unhelpful and absurd postings and threads. It's mindlessly confrontational and does little to facilitate reasonable discourse. It's basically a playground. I would really hate for RFF to go that direction. The End.

p.s. Jsrockit, this isn't directed at you, i am curtailing this in response to other postings on here, in general!

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Old 04-05-2012   #72
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Originally Posted by furcafe View Post
Dave:

Ha! I guess these modern cameras are like video games: 1/2 the "fun" is finding the Easter eggs.
HA !!

I hear if you push "up-up-left-right-down-left-up" while pressing the AF-L/AE-L button you get an extra life and unlimited weapons !!

Dave
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Old 04-05-2012   #73
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I was actually hoping that the stupid Q button would turn me into a William Eggleston avatar & render me invisible to bystanders when shooting on the street.

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HA !!

I hear if you push "up-up-left-right-down-left-up" while pressing the AF-L/AE-L button you get an extra life and unlimited weapons !!

Dave
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Old 04-05-2012   #74
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Quote:
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John:

Actually, after going to the manual & testing it & in S or C modes, I've found that the AE-L/AF-L button can (when set to do so in Shooting Menu 4) work as a AF-L button, but it only locks when you've already focused using the shutter release, it does not work as an AF + AF-L button like every other camera I've used that has an AF-L button (G2 & D700 included). As I wrote above, this is seems stupid & counterintuitve, IMHO, & is currently my only real complaint in my less than 24 hours as an X-Pro1 owner (perhaps my expectations are unusually low because I was traumatized by being 1 of the 1st M8 buyers). Now that we have this other option that you've discovered/stumbled upon, I can wait for Fuji to fix this oversight in future firmware updates (along w/the aperture blade chatter annoyance, @ least when in OVF mode) rather than immediately emailing a complaint to the proper channels.

Not sure how excited I can get over any new camera, but the 18/2 seems more than good enough for me. I agree that ISO 3200 & even 6400 (equal to 2500 on the M9) is nice, as is something resembling accurate auto white balance. Great to hear that your experience w/mounting M lenses is positive.
Chris,

If you turn off the live view altogether (View Mode button) the aperture chatter goes away when you're using the optical viewfinder. I agree, it is irksome & I'd like to see it just plain gone. I can live with the brightness variations/adjustments in the EVF that I see using M lenses and I think a lot of other people would agree that it's not at all bad and far, far better than that skittering bug sound. I would download that firmware revision in a heartbeat or even pay for some jailbreak firmware modification.

And I'm looking forward to getting the 18/2. I'm hoping the shop here gets some more lenses before Folk Fest starts next week. The 60 I'm leaning against getting any time soon as I'm such a slave to the 75 lux and I'm finding that I *can* focus it pretty easily on the Fuji. Oh, the other advantage to leaving it in "Manual" focus mode and using the AF-L button to focus -- you can bring up the focus magnifier only when it's in M so when you're frequently swapping out to manual focus lenses that you might want to occasionally use the magnifier for (cough -- 75 Summilux -- cough) it's easier.
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Old 04-05-2012   #75
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Quote:
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I was actually hoping that the stupid Q button would turn me into a William Eggleston avatar & render me invisible to bystanders when shooting on the street.
heh.. the "Q" button stands for "quirky" ; as in, there are quirky things about the camera - but like most quirky things, I accept them, love them, hug them and take them home and name them "George"

Cheers,
Dave
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Old 04-05-2012   #76
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Not sure about that, maybe your 35/1.4 is just quieter (the X100's built-in lens is). Even when live view is switched off & OVF is selected (not eye control auto) via the View Mode button, the camera will still chatter away. Try this: turn the camera on w/it set to OVF only, & then hold it away from your eye & pan the lens between areas of differing brightness. You should be able to clearly hear the chatter. If you're backlit & point the lens at your face you can even see them opening & closing as you move the camera around. The only thing that makes me a little pessimistic about a firmware fix is that this appears to be related to how the camera adjusts the brightness of the OVF framelines (makes sense considering it's also electronically generated).

Thanks for the tip re: focus magnifier in M mode. Might try it w/the Noctilux, too, when that day comes.

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Chris,

If you turn off the live view altogether (View Mode button) the aperture chatter goes away when you're using the optical viewfinder. I agree, it is irksome & I'd like to see it just plain gone. I can live with the brightness variations/adjustments in the EVF that I see using M lenses and I think a lot of other people would agree that it's not at all bad and far, far better than that skittering bug sound. I would download that firmware revision in a heartbeat or even pay for some jailbreak firmware modification.
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Old 04-05-2012   #77
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Sorry, you also have to have power save turned on (default is off). It definitely goes away. My lens is quite noisy.
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Old 04-05-2012   #78
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Doh, another hidden "feature." It's like the cameras are programmed by videogamers & the instruction manuals are written by contracts attorneys.

Thanks again.

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Sorry, you also have to have power save turned on (default is off). It definitely goes away. My lens is quite noisy.
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Old 04-05-2012   #79
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This is exactly the same thing with the x100. Like exactly. Everyone denouncing the camera, saying it was useless and that autofocus was terrible. In reality - the x100 AF wasn't too bad to begin with, and now it's great. Give fuji a bit of time to sort the camera out. For now, learn how to use it how it is. Simple. It's not supposed to be a foolproof camera, or a point and shoot.
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Old 04-05-2012   #80
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Quote:
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My other complaint about the AE-L/AF-L button not focusing in S or C mode still stands, however.
Treat the AF-L button as a lock button. First AF where you want it to be, and then press the AF-L button. Now the focus is locked at that distance.

It's really not that hard, and works very well if you just play ball and use it the way it's supposed to be used.
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