Help me decide: 50mm Summilux, Nokton or Canon?

[Gabriel M.A.]

OK, I may have much GAS, and may spend way too much on it, but there are limits.

My camera shop has "lent" me, through Monday, this lens. I will be shooting with it almost exclusively, and when not it may be only to compare with what I already have...

I have the opportunity to acquire a beautiful 50mm chrome Summilux (a pseudo-titanium looking one from 1959), with its shade and all, if I exchange a lens + change; flawless.

Or for the same amount of change, I could get a brand new, black 50mm Nokton.

Or for the same amount of change, and lots of patience, I could find a 50mm Canon f/1.4

Or I could just stick to my good old 50mm Summarit f/1.5 and Canon f/1.2 (which is on its way)

If while you vote, if you could post a picture that shows what you like best about your choice, that would be most helpful!

And please help me here: let's stick to the choices above -- I don't want to be any more cornfused!

[dcsang]

In the not too distant past I would have said "get the Nokton" only because it's brand new for the same money... but now.. after having felt/tried the Summicron, I would take the chance on a good condition Summilux.

I'm not sure how big the Summilux is but I've heard the Nokton is quite honking

Dave

[Brian Sweeney]

Which lens do you have to exchange? If the Summilix is flawless, and we are talking the Summarit+ $300, I would do it. The early Summilux may not be much better than the Summarit, but condition is everything and the Summilux gets the name recognition. It will hold its value. A near mint early Summilux is probably in the $800~$900 range.

[naturephoto1]

First of all, am I correct that the lenses that you are considering are for your Leica M6?

The next question that arises, and the Leica M series camera are certainly designed for low conditions, do you require a f1.4 or even the f1.2 Canon lens that you have on order?

As far as I know, Leica has made improvements to the Summilux M (certainly the Aspherical) since 1959. When I used my Canon F series SLRs, I used an f1.4 50mm lens. When I swithced to my Leica R4S and SP models and all the subsequent models since up through the R8 I opted for the Summicron f2.0 50mm, 35mm, and 90mm lenses. I know that this is opening up a can of worms that you did not want to consider, but the Summicron f2.0 will be a smaller and lighter lens option than any of the Summilux 50mm lenses.

If you need the speed for low light conditions (and maybe a slight???) improvement in lens performance (which is questionable) consider the Summilux, otherwise, consider the Summicron 50mm lens for a smaller and lighter package. I am not sure of the lens speed of the Nokton.

If the decision is to go with a Summilux 50mm lens, try to find out the cost of a more current version. You may be able to get a newer and more current and better? performing lens than the one that you are testing.

Rich

richard@nelridge.com
http://www.nelridge.com

[rover]

Well, if you are looking to use the lens wide open, the more modern the formula the better, therefore I would lean towards the Nokton or Summilux, though the Canon 50/1.4 is also good.

If you want a specific "look" does your Summarit fit the bill? I look at my Canon 50/1.5 as a general purpose lens, not a low light lens, and this is why I want a Summarit.

The Canon 50/1.2 gives you lots of light, no substitute for that.

And, often I will choose a Summicron 50 at 2.0 and 1/15s over a faster lens at 1/30s because it is just better.

OK, for argument sake I will vote for the Lux

[RayPA]

Of the group, I only know the Nokton (for now), and despite a growing collection of 50mm lenses, I can't see parting with it. It gets my vote.

[StuartR]

I said summilux, but that would only be my preference. To put it another way, if you care about build quality, vintage looks to your image (wide open anyway), and something more than sheer performance, get the summilux. If you want the most modern lens with the highest contrast and resolution and are less concerned with bokeh and glow, get the nokton. If you really like Canon, get the Canon...it is probably between the two...good build quality, but neither the character of the very old summilux nor the super modern performance of the Nokton.

[RayPA]

OK, I guess this is where we start seeing some images made with these lenses. I'll offer up...

Two low-light shots with the Nokton:
Teens and Magazine
Red Robin Martinis

[Gabriel M.A.]

Thanks guys, for the responses so far. Ok, to address a few of your questions:
- Yes, this is for my Leica M-mount
- I have the option to return a mint Hasselblad lens (that's why this is so wrenching)
- I already own a latest-formula, tabbed 50mm Summicron-M
- I love shooting wide-open, and the f/1.4 would be shot at f/1.4 99% of the time
- I may sell the Summarit if I get the Summilux (they'd be redundant)
- Among my top priorities: good "bokeh" with concentrated points of light, flare resistance, "stealth", and close focusing distance.

All of this for "one lousy" stop...

[Gabriel M.A.]

Wow, excellent samples, RayPA. Hmmm...

[furcafe]

Pix taken w/Canon 50/1.4 Lens:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/furcafe...14lensc196168/

Pix taken w/CV 50/1.5 Nokton:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/furcafe...der5015nokton/

[lawrence]

The Canon 50mm f1.2 is a weird beast. Out-of-focus highlights appear disc-like and can be rather distracting. It's also rather soft wide open (see attachment)...I ended up selling mine.

[RayPA]

Originally Posted by lawrence

The Canon 50mm f1.2 is a weird beast. Out-of-focus highlights appear disc-like and can be rather distracting. It's also rather soft wide open (see attachment)...I ended up selling mine.

Wow! that is unusual looking!

[rover]

The Canon 50/1.2 is soft, but that can be nice

[Stephanie Brim]

If you didn't have the 'cron, I'd say to get the 'lux. But since you do, you may be happier getting the Nokton or the Canon. Considering my own monetary situations as of late, I'd probably save the rest for film. :P

[Hektor]

gabrielma,

1. stop the indecicision and fuzzy thinking

2. sell the canon.

3. buy a noctilux.

4. take more pictures.

;-) john c. (iv'e caught joe's anti-caps disease)

[johne]

For a thorough evaluation of the Canon 1.2, see Roger Hicks, "Canon's 50mm f1/2 Rangerfinder Lens" in Shutterbug, Sept 2005, p. 156. For another rare lens, might want to look at the work of Jacques Zekkar on the Leica site. He used a rare Thambar, Just a comment. JOhne

[aizan]

summilux, like elliott erwitt.

[Brian Sweeney]

This is from my Canon 50mm F1.2 wide-open:
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/phot...at=3204&page=1

The previous shot with it looks strange, I did not get results like that.

And this one, wide-open and at closest focus with a nice background. Shot into the sun.
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/foru...achmentid=6105

[Beniliam]

Why dont buy a russian replica of the Sonnar 1.5 of Contax II/III?

[Brian Sweeney]

Well, I have a Jupiter-3.The focus was off my more than 1ft at 5ft. I backed the lens module out of the mount by more than a mm, using a 15x loop to judge focus at the film gate, and now need to fix-up the RF coupling. The lens looks sharp. The mount is awful.

[peter_n]

Closest focus for an earlier version Summilux is somewhere between 0.9M and 1.0M. When you consider the FOV of a 50mm that is adequate. The Elmar-M has a closest focus of 0.7M but I don't think I've ever used it that close.

[Gabriel M.A.]

I voted myself just because I got tired of clicking on the link.

I thank those who have provided samples. I hadn't seen such good samples taken with a Nokton nor the Canon 1.2.

I'm not going the Jupiter/Contax/Nikon/Noctilux route; that's just too much. I need some focus, however little that may be.

I got my Canon f/1.2 lens today, and I was very very excited; excellent coatings, overall, smaller than I had thought; a pain to unmount from an M-mount body. Unfortunately, there seems to be some smudge or haze in the rear element; when shining bright light, you don't see it, but peripheral, you can see it plainly; looks like a fingerprint, as if somebody had taken it apart and managed to touch the inside of the rear element with the finger.

Anyway...too much to ponder. So where is the winning lottery ticket?

[DoxLeica]

Hi,
I saw this late and have few pix to scan right now but I uses all three at one time or another...the Nokton for 3 years and the others as recently as 1996. Over a 45 year stint in photography, the Nokton is a clear winner. Keep that Hassy lens...they'll be in favor again...and buy more CV lenses later on. Now, the CV 40 is a winner too...maybe my all time favorite for Leica mount lense. My 21-40-75 could cover 90% of what I want to shoot. But, the Nokton can do it too with "zoom feet." Good luck with that Nok!
John