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Old 08-08-2011   #41
Brian Sweeney
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The Sandisk reader is new, and supports the SDHC and SDXC standard.

I tried the format program with WIN7 and from SDCARD.ORG.

Two of the computers are less than 6 months old, bought after buying the M9.

I will try a new card when in.

If it were a DC line balance problem, it would have been obvious to me.

http://www.google.com/patents?id=JG0...page&q&f=false

Last edited by Brian Sweeney : 08-08-2011 at 02:36.
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Old 08-08-2011   #42
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Dear Brian,

No fair! You know what you're talking about! Are you SURE that the Internet is the right place for you?

As a matter of idle interest, do you get any extra recognition from the government for assigned patents? Kodak had a lovely custom of a silver dollar for every patent assigned to them by employees.

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Old 08-08-2011   #43
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The Internet... It was very different in the 1980s. Having custom chips made for my Network Interface Card was fun. That was the 1990s for me. Working in a research Lab for over 30 years has its pluses. Some of the work that I did was incorporated into the RFC's that define IP.

15 years ago I would have written a custom device driver to test the SD card, if I needed it for a project. This is what you get for using software that you did not even write yourself. These days, just wanted to see if the M9 was at fault, or if the Sandisk card had a problem. Since the card was never in my Leica M9, and it is supposed to work with WIN7 and XP computers but does not, I'm thinking the card is the problem.

Last edited by Brian Sweeney : 08-08-2011 at 11:45.
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Old 08-08-2011   #44
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I supplied all of the requested information requested to get the RMA, have not heard anything back.

- Your Phone Number.
xxx-xxx-xxxx
- Your complete physical address (No P.O. Box please)
Brian Sweeney
xxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx,xx
xxxxx-xx
USA
- What is written on the face of the card?
Sandisk Extreme Pro
SDHC I
8GB

- The Product code (Alpha Numeric Code ) which is at the back of the Card
BI1035716257G
- From where did you purchase this product?
Amazon.com,
Order filled by:
Beach Camera
80 Carter Drive
Edison, NJ

- Exact or approximate Date of Purchase of the card in the format of MM/DD/YYYY
08/03/2011
- How was the product packaged at the time of purchase?
Card was in black box, box-size plastic insert was intact and had to be cut open. SD card was in the jewel case as shown in the attached images.
- Are you getting the product replaced for the first time by SanDisk?
Yes: I have used Sandisk PCMCIA memory cards, 1GByte SD cards, 2GByte SD cards, 4GByte SD cards without problems.
- Do you have any important data on the product?
NO: I tested the card before actual use, and found it would not work reliably on my computer.
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Hi Brian
Old 08-08-2011   #45
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Hi Brian

re: custom chips

Were they ATM or Ethernet? Chances are they were made by me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Sweeney View Post
The Internet... It was very different in the 1980s. Having custom chips made for my Network Interface Card was fun. That was the 1990s for me. Working in a research Lab for over 30 years has its pluses. Some of the work that I did was incorporated into the RFC's that define IP.

15 years ago I would have written a custom device driver to test the SD card, if I needed it for a project. This is what you get for using software that you did not even write yourself. These days, just wanted to see if the M9 was at fault, or if the Sandisk card had a problem. Since the card was never in my Leica M9, and it is supposed to work with WIN7 and XP computers but does not, I'm thinking the card is the problem.
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Old 08-08-2011   #46
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ATM.

Transwitch and PMC Framing chips, LSI ATMizer 64360 and 64363. We had an ATM NIC built around the LSI ATMizer and MUSIC 1480 CAM chip in ~1995.

I've worked with SONET/SDH and ATM since 1990. I had an OC-12 NIC in 1996. Running with Phar Lap extended DOS.

This SD card is the most "screwed-up" memory card that I have ever seen. And I remember Bubble memory and CORE. And worked with code from the IBM 7094 Stretch, with the ECC that was later proven ineffective.

Last edited by Brian Sweeney : 08-08-2011 at 13:24.
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ok
Old 08-08-2011   #47
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ok

I did the ANA5910/30/40 ASICs through TSMC, using PMC Sierra PHYs, on at least the OC-3 card.

I thought you meant early early, like mid '80s Seeq Ethernet NICs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Sweeney View Post
ATM.

Transwitch and PMC Framing chips, LSI ATMizer 64360 and 64363. We had an ATM NIC built around the LSI ATMizer and MUSIC 1480 CAM chip in ~1995.

I've worked with SONET/SDH and ATM since 1990. I had an OC-12 NIC in 1996. Running with Phar Lap extended DOS.

This SD card is the most "screwed-up" memory card that I have ever seen. And I remember Bubble memory and CORE. And worked with code from the IBM 7094 Stretch, with the ECC that was later proven ineffective.
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Old 08-08-2011   #48
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Ethernet didn't use single-mode optical at the time. Our interest was from the optical layer up, single-mode. They were still trying to decide if ATM would be 64 byte or 32 byte cells when we started.

So- Ted, when are you going to try a Sandisk UHS card in your Leica...

One tip off on this card: the box states that it uses "Enhanced Super-Parallel Processing" to attain it's speed. The SD card specification states that many of the registers can only be accessed when the transfer is idle, that register values are not valid while the buffers are being written. I spent a most of the 1980's working parallel computers, and interlocks when accessing data could be tricky. I wonder if that is why the card runs into trouble when data is being simultaneously written from the camera while the user is chimping.
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In 1996
Old 08-08-2011   #49
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In 1996

we were shipping pre 802.3z MMF, and SMF (1300nm) 64-bit 66Mhz PCI cards (GbE), as well as switches.

I don't have a digital Leica, and I don't use Sandisk cards (the kids have mine), I use Kingston, Adata, Transcend, and PQI Class 6 and Class 10 SDHC.

No UHS-1 or SDXC for me at this time. But at the same time, I wouldn't buy or use a camera today that didn't support them

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Sweeney View Post
Ethernet didn't use single-mode optical at the time. Our interest was from the optical layer up, single-mode. They were still trying to decide if ATM would be 64 byte or 32 byte cells when we started.

So- Ted, when are you going to try a Sandisk UHS card in your Leica...

One tip off on this card: the box states that it uses "Enhanced Super-Parallel Processing" to attain it's speed. The SD card specification states that many of the registers can only be accessed when the transfer is idle, that register values are not valid while the buffers are being written. I spent a most of the 1980's working parallel computers, and interlocks when accessing data could be tricky. I wonder if that is why the card runs into trouble when data is being simultaneously written from the camera while the user is chimping.
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sandisk ESP
Old 08-08-2011   #50
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sandisk ESP

Seems to work well in the D7000:

http://glamourphotography.co/gear/uh...-32gb-45mbsec/


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Sweeney View Post
Ethernet didn't use single-mode optical at the time. Our interest was from the optical layer up, single-mode. They were still trying to decide if ATM would be 64 byte or 32 byte cells when we started.

So- Ted, when are you going to try a Sandisk UHS card in your Leica...

One tip off on this card: the box states that it uses "Enhanced Super-Parallel Processing" to attain it's speed. The SD card specification states that many of the registers can only be accessed when the transfer is idle, that register values are not valid while the buffers are being written. I spent a most of the 1980's working parallel computers, and interlocks when accessing data could be tricky. I wonder if that is why the card runs into trouble when data is being simultaneously written from the camera while the user is chimping.
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Old 08-08-2011   #51
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I don't have one of those, or would try the card in it. My Nikon DSLR uses PCMCIA cards, and the Sandisk drives work fine in it. a 110MByte card- woohoo. My first Sandisk card was a 4MByte PCMCIA card for the Kodak DC50. Never had a problem.

Too bad Leica could not use a CF card the the M8/M9. I prefer parallel interfaces.
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Old 08-08-2011   #52
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http://forums.sandisk.com/t5/Mobile-...em/td-p/231994

http://forums.sandisk.com/t5/Mobile-...or/td-p/239610

Google search on Sandisk problems- this thread sounds a lot like what happened to mine.

And Nikon with a MAC:

http://forums.sandisk.com/t5/Mobile-...rd/td-p/213727

and...

Ouch. I haven't even gotten the RMA number yet.

http://forums.sandisk.com/t5/Mobile-...ent/m-p/240556

Last edited by Brian Sweeney : 08-08-2011 at 17:10.
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Old 08-08-2011   #53
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DOH!

According to the Sandisk "Check your product compatibil​ity here" Wizard:

http://forums.sandisk.com/t5/Product...re/td-p/227682

Don't use their cards in your Leica. Not even on the list.
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yeah, I noticed that too
Old 08-08-2011   #54
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yeah, I noticed that too

And likewise, the Sandisk card is not on the M9's compatibility list.

However, both vendors have mentioned the other companies in the past - e.g. Leica recommending older Ultra or Extreme cards, and Sandisk PRs with Sandisk having Leica (no model #s) mentioned in there with Canon and Nikon and other vendors.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Sweeney View Post
DOH!

According to the Sandisk "Check your product compatibil​ity here" Wizard:

http://forums.sandisk.com/t5/Product...re/td-p/227682

Don't use their cards in your Leica. Not even on the list.
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Old 08-08-2011   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Sweeney View Post
DOH!

According to the Sandisk "Check your product compatibil​ity here" Wizard:

http://forums.sandisk.com/t5/Product...re/td-p/227682

Don't use their cards in your Leica. Not even on the list.



This is a little like finding out that the latest version of Tri-X isn't compatible with your M7!

Bizzare IMO.
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Old 08-08-2011   #56
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I think that this is a case where technology has just marched on.

If I had an M8 or M9 now, I'd just stock up on FAT32 SDHC Class 10 cards, non UHS-1.

My old Lumix LX3 will never use SDHC cards, and I've kept a stash of cards for it, as it still works fine. Epson RD1s will never use SDXC cards, and folks are dealing with that.

We already know that the M8 and M9 are not UHS-1 host devices, so the UHS-1 max transfer speed of 104MBytes/sec. will never be achieved. Just get a good class 10 SDHC card and be happy cards are cheaper than for Nikon D7000 users who want the fastest speed. Slows you down. Helps you think and compose as the camera slowly empties it's buffer ...
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Old 08-08-2011   #57
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I just checked the Sandisk compatibility wizard and it lists some cards as compatible with the Nikon D700 that are not on Nikon's compatibility list. It just might pay to stick to what the manufacturer of your camera says is compatible. I think I will be sticking to the Extreme III which is fast enough and has not caused any problems, touch wood , so far.

Bob

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Old 08-09-2011   #58
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The test of the card with the Nikon D7000.

http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/con...=7-11133-11187

The article does make reference to a "Formatting Quirk" on the 16Gb and 32GB card that caused a reduction in speed. It also states that even if your camera does not support UHS-1, you might still be interested for faster off-loads to your computer.
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good reviews
Old 08-09-2011   #59
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good reviews

Yes, if one has a pci-e based expresscard reader, or usb3 reader, it could speed up card to computer transfers.

However, the tomshardware benchmarks show that these UHS-1 cards can also be slower in some types of reads and writes, than non-UHS-1 class 10 cards, and provides this note:

"Users who donít need 40 MB/s write speeds, but insist on the highest possible minimum transfer speeds, should still consider some of the more established (existing) products."

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...i,2940-12.html

There's also the OS/driver issue. If you're lucky, and are able to reliably use the UHS-1 SDHC card in FAT32 mode in your Leica M8/M9 or whatever non D7000 camera, then you have to hope your OS/drivers/card reader setup will recognize it in that format, and not expect it to be an sdxc exfat formatted card, and want to erase it ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Sweeney View Post
The test of the card with the Nikon D7000.

http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/con...=7-11133-11187

The article does make reference to a "Formatting Quirk" on the 16Gb and 32GB card that caused a reduction in speed. It also states that even if your camera does not support UHS-1, you might still be interested for faster off-loads to your computer.
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Old 08-09-2011   #60
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Hmmm...it appears to this non-geek dumbass that saving photos on digital cameras is getting more complex.

Brian, are you convinced that the M9 problems with the card is attributable to it's (the card) incompatibility? Does Leica have this information to make a statement?
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Old 08-09-2011   #61
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I never used this card in an M9, and have never had a problem with an SD card before.

This problem lies with the design of the Sandisk card.

And they want me to try to go through Beach Camera before giving me an RMA!

Thanks for emailing SanDisk Technical Support. It is our goal to make sure you have all the resources you need to get the most from your product.

As the card was purchased on 08/03/2011 it been less then 30 days since you are using the product, I would request you to get back to place of purchase for the replacment of the card as most of the retail stores have 30 days of store warranty. In case they refuse to do so you can contact us back for replacment.

Please refer to your My SanDisk at http://kb.sandisk.com anytime to see all of your incident history and product registration information. You can log in using your email address as your login and the password that you created.

Also, you can visit http://kb.sandisk.com, our online keyword searchable Knowledgebase, to easily find answers to your Technical Support and Customer Service questions for all of SanDisk's products. Simply enter your search terms and our Knowledgebase will search an extensive database of commonly asked questions as well as our online forums at http://www.sandisk.com/sandisk-support/forums to provide you with the most complete answers possible.

Best regards,
Hanna Kaur
SanDisk Technical Support
Customer By Email (Brian Sweeney) 08/07/2011 01:46 PM
request for RMA on 8GByte Extreme Pro




SO MUCH FOR THE SANDISK WARRANTY OR HAVING ANY INTEREST IN THEIR DEFECTIVE CARDS!
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Old 08-09-2011   #62
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I bought this card online, through Amazon.com, order filled by Beach Camera.

I would have to mail it to them, and can cut out the "middle-man" by getting the RMA from Sandisk NOW and sending the card to you.

Please supply me with an RMA number for your defective card.

I have never seen an SD card as bad as this one. It cannot be used with a Windows computer. Visits to your user forum and searching the web indicates that this series of cards is flawed.

If I am "just out $30", so be it. I will just credit it to never using Sandisk again.

Otherwise send me an RMA.

Brian Sweeney


So why would anyone find it irritating that a lifetime warranty does not take effect until after 30 days of using a card.
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Old 08-09-2011   #63
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That gives me an idea.

I can try the card in my Atari 400. It still works, 16KBytes of RAM and all. I have Defender on cassette tape, still loads. But I bought it for Star Raiders. Love that game.

I have Pacman somewhere for it.
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Old 08-09-2011   #64
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I really like this thread - so enlightiening!
Never spend a thought on the SD cards until now.

Thanks for this! (Going through my SD card stock, sorting cards and planning to stock on some…)
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Achtung, try the following:
Old 08-09-2011   #65
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Achtung, try the following:

This problem is an epidemic over on the Leica website.
First of all there are a huge amount of San Disk phonies on the market.
The copies are so good experts have been fooled.
If you have a Mac with a card reader insert card, go to Disc Utilities
and select and run REPAIR DISC.
See if it works now.
If not, reformat it in a Nikon or Canon DSLR and try it WITHOUT reformatting in the M-9.
I have made several M-9 unreadable cards work with these methods.
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Old 08-10-2011   #66
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Hi all,

I'm facing some issues with my SanDisk Extreme III - 32 GB - Class 10 - SDHC card on my M9

I've been using this card since around 7 months with no problems but of late i get "no memory card inserted" or "no images in folder" errors

The camera writes the images to the card - when i hit Play, the camera tells me folder contains no images

Sometimes when i switch the camera on, it tells me "no memory card inserted"

I did not update to firmware v2

I just formatted the card last night, will try again this evening to see if it works normally and write an update here

Cheers,
Hari

edit - i forgot to mention that i formatted the card on my laptop and not on the M9
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Old 08-10-2011   #67
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Just to re-assert on this longish thread: I never used this card in my Leica M9.

If the card cannot be successfully reformatted using Win7 Pro and the format utility from SDCARD.ORG, the problem is with the design of the card. It should not have these problems.

The SN number from the card was supplied to Sandisk, and the card was bought from a seller featured on the Sandisk website as legit. I do not think it is counterfeit, unless Sandisk themselves was fooled by their supplier.

Hari- thankyou for the information, and let us know how the card works after formatting it in your computer.
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Old 08-10-2011   #68
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So I was using an older Sandisk PCMCIA memory card, bought in 1998, so old that it is "Made in the USA". Works fine, I use it for embedded systems that have a PCMCIA slot. I use an even older card with my Nikon E3 DSLR. Never a problem formatting that card in the E3 or in a Win98 machine.

The Sandisk motto on the card is "More memory, More Possibilities".

That motto seems to take on new meaning with the way that their SD cards screw-up.
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Old 08-10-2011   #69
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So in my M8 I have been using Sandisk sdhc class 10 cards with 30mb/s speed and just purchased two more... However when the cards arrived they say sdhc uhs-1 and "hd video" on them but are still rated class 10 and 30mb/s... If the speed is the same aren't they the same card? I don't want to return them to Amazon if I don't have to...
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Old 08-10-2011   #70
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If you decide to try them in the M8, please post back on the experience. The card worked in my M8, and all of the files transferred to my Inspiron 1750. The problems started when I used the computer to format the card. After that point, it stopped working with everything. I consider the card as the problem, and am waiting for an RMA.
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Hard to know
Old 08-10-2011   #71
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Hard to know

There are reports of success and failures with both of the cards you mention, but fewer failures reported with the Extreme Video and III, vs Extreme Pro, relative to time on market, and as you mention both are rated at the same peak speeds.

I'd go with the Extreme III or Extreme Video Class 10 non UHS-1, if you must go with Sandisk at this time.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyne View Post
So in my M8 I have been using Sandisk sdhc class 10 cards with 30mb/s speed and just purchased two more... However when the cards arrived they say sdhc uhs-1 and "hd video" on them but are still rated class 10 and 30mb/s... If the speed is the same aren't they the same card? I don't want to return them to Amazon if I don't have to...
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Old 08-10-2011   #72
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I'm not the only one having problems with this card, and it has problems with other brands of cameras in addition to Leica.

http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Flash-...rBy=addOneStar
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Old 08-10-2011   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ampguy View Post
There are reports of success and failures with both of the cards you mention, but fewer failures reported with the Extreme Video and III, vs Extreme Pro, relative to time on market, and as you mention both are rated at the same peak speeds.

I'd go with the Extreme III or Extreme Video Class 10 non UHS-1, if you must go with Sandisk at this time.
Ugh. No need to go with Sandisk. Used them in the past with no issues but headed to San Fran, Yosemite, Sydney and India.... want to have something I trust... what is a good brand and type to select? I guess I will do a search but I leave in three weeks so even though its somewhat last minute I was hoping to test before I go...
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cards that work
Old 08-10-2011   #74
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cards that work

I put about 25K shots on my M8 using Sandisk extreme II and IIIs, Transcend, Kinston, PQI, Adata and other 2GB-8GB class 4, 6, and 10 speed cards. Never any errors, but I never did things like pop the card before writing was done, or pop the battery while writing, just normal regular use.

Also no computer issues reading them with Windows XP, 7 home, 7 Pro, OSX 10.6.6, linux. Always formatted them in the M8, read them in the computers, re-formatted them back in the camera for re-use.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyne View Post
Ugh. No need to go with Sandisk. Used them in the past with no issues but headed to San Fran, Yosemite, Sydney and India.... want to have something I trust... what is a good brand and type to select? I guess I will do a search but I leave in three weeks so even though its somewhat last minute I was hoping to test before I go...
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Old 08-10-2011   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ampguy View Post
I put about 25K shots on my M8 using Sandisk extreme II and IIIs, Transcend, Kinston, PQI, Adata and other 2GB-8GB class 4, 6, and 10 speed cards. Never any errors, but I never did things like pop the card before writing was done, or pop the battery while writing, just normal regular use.

Also no computer issues reading them with Windows XP, 7 home, 7 Pro, OSX 10.6.6, linux. Always formatted them in the M8, read them in the computers, re-formatted them back in the camera for re-use.
Precisely the same do/ did I.
I use Sandisk cards exclusively (CF, SD and SDHC) my most used cards in the M8.2 and M9 are 8GB SanDisk Extreme 30MB/s class 10 cards, which I use interchangeably in the M8.2, M9, Ricoh GRDIII.

I always, always format a fresh card in camera before use - always.
I never had an issue, that could be related to cards so far.

Before a major shooting this summer, I stocked up on SanDisk cards, while this above mentioned type was not available, I had to revert to the newer SanDisk HD video type in 16GB size.
I stocked on them as a precaution, if I run out of space and backup, but never really used them in the field.
They did work without issues though as mobile storage of data with Mac OS X 10.6.

I always use a SanDisk MicroMate card reader (model number: SDDR-113).
I got two of these card readers in a package with a SD card a few years ago, but can't find them anywhere in the shops anymore. It is the most compact SD Card to USB reader, I could find and always worked without issues, despite being thrown unprotected into bags, fallen on floors, etc Ö
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Old 08-11-2011   #76
Brian Sweeney
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I believe that the Sandisk SD cards in the "UHS-1" class are the problem.

I use slower Sandisk and PNY cards in my M8 and M9 without problems.
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Old 08-11-2011   #77
TheGodParticle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGodParticle View Post
Hi all,

I'm facing some issues with my SanDisk Extreme III - 32 GB - Class 10 - SDHC card on my M9

I've been using this card since around 7 months with no problems but of late i get "no memory card inserted" or "no images in folder" errors

The camera writes the images to the card - when i hit Play, the camera tells me folder contains no images

Sometimes when i switch the camera on, it tells me "no memory card inserted"

I did not update to firmware v2

I just formatted the card last night, will try again this evening to see if it works normally and write an update here

Cheers,
Hari

edit - i forgot to mention that i formatted the card on my laptop and not on the M9

Hi all,

The card seems to work just fine now. But i'll hafta buy another card anyway as i dont trust this one anymore ...

Cheers,
Hari
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Old 08-11-2011   #78
Brian Sweeney
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Started the process on Sunday. Filled out the first questionnaire. I agree to have my name shared with the Shipping Company. Now my request for an RMA can proceed to the next department. Four days into it, and the RMA almost ready to be submitted for consideration.

VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV

Dear Brian,

Thanks for emailing SanDisk Technical Support. It is our goal to make sure you have all the resources you need to get the most from your product.

Please provide the following information in order to continue with the replacement process:

In order to process your RMA and create a pre paid shipping label for your use we will need to share your name and address with our shipping provider. Do you agree to this?

Once RMA is created, the RMA department will review the request within 24-48 hours. If the RMA gets approved, you will receive 2 emails. The first email will have the return instructions and RMA number. The second email will have the link for the complimentary UPS Shipping label.

Please print the label within 10 days for it will expire after that. Once the label is printed, please put your SanDisk product in a padded envelope without any accessories, then tape the shipping label on top of it. You can also use a UPS envelope available at most of the drop boxes and UPS Stores. Drop off the package to any UPS drop box or store. Once we receive the product, please allow 7-10 business days for processing then we will ship out the new product.

Please refer to your My SanDisk at http://kb.sandisk.com anytime to see all of your incident history and product registration information. You can log in using your email address as your login and the password that you created.

Also, you can visit http://kb.sandisk.com, our online keyword searchable Knowledgebase, to easily find answers to your Technical Support and Customer Service questions for all of SanDisk's products. Simply enter your search terms and our Knowledgebase will search an extensive database of commonly asked questions as well as our online forums at http://www.sandisk.com/sandisk-support/forums to provide you with the most complete answers possible.

Best regards,
Hanna Kaur
SanDisk Technical Support
Customer By Email (Brian Sweeney) 08/09/2011 11:18 AM
request for RMA on 8GByte Extreme Pro
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Old 08-11-2011   #79
dave lackey
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Brian, forgive my ignorance, but what is an RMA?
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Peace, Love and Happiness...



Dave
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Old 08-11-2011   #80
Brian Sweeney
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RMA: Return to Manufacturer Authorization.

I'm used to these things taking a day. With the Nintendo DSI the RMA was 1-day, pre-paid shipping envelope was in my mailbox in three days, and a new DSI arrived within a week.

Sandisk must be inundated with returns.
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