D76 shelf life

wizard717 · 01-13-2011

I have a little more then a half Gal. of D76 working solution.
It's about 4 month old and has been stored in a sealed black plastic container in a very cool basement work room.
I have a few rolls of of Arista 400 and a few rolls of Legacy 400 I'd like to process.
Do you think the D76 is still usable?

ibcrewin · 01-13-2011

I think the package says 6months in a sealed container and 2 months in an unsealed one. I say use it. If you're not 100% sure, shoot a sacrificial roll and find out!

jmcd · 01-13-2011

With long storage time D-76 changes pH (becomes more alkaline) and for a given development time, contrast increases.

nikon_sam · 01-13-2011

It should still be good and if you really want to know do what ibcrewin says and shoot a not-so-important roll and give it a go...

CK Dexter Haven · 01-13-2011

Why risk it? I recently used some old ID-11/D-76 and was quite disappointed by the results. Sealed, cool, all that. Based on that, i'm now only using 1L packets and mixing what i need for that particular day. There's nothing worse than having a shot on a negative you really like and being let down by the technical aspect. Well, there are many things worse, but you know what i mean.

Developer is cheap. Images aren't.

MRohlfing · 01-13-2011

Here is what Kodak says (look at page 7):
http://wwwuk.kodak.com/global/en/pro...bs/j78/j78.pdf

ibcrewin · 01-13-2011

Quick threadjack here: Page 7 says

To extend the useful capacity of D-76 Developer diluted
1:1—when processing two 36-exposure rolls in a 16-ounce
tank—increase the recommended time by about 10 percent

does that mean you can reuse it once if you increase the recommended time?

Freakscene · 01-13-2011

No; what they're saying is that normally in that amount of developer diluted 1+1 you should only develop one film, but you can get away with two if you increase the development time. If you re-use you'll get no image; there aren't enough chemicals in the solution to develop another 160 square inches of film.

Marty

nikon_sam · 01-13-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freakscene

No; what they're saying is that normally in that amount of developer diluted 1+1 you should only develop one film, but you can get away with two if you increase the development time. If you re-use you'll get no image; there aren't enough chemicals in the solution to develop another 160 square inches of film.

Marty

I going to have to disagree with this statement...

I've used D-76 diluted @ 1:1 twice...with a slight increase in developing time and all was/is fine...

These days I'm using Rodinal either at 1+50 or 1+100...mostly due to a one time use and I mix it up just before developing...
I don't have to worry about storing D-76 and if it's still good...
These days it's either Rodinal or HC-110...

ibcrewin · 01-13-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freakscene

No; what they're saying is that normally in that amount of developer diluted 1+1 you should only develop one film, but you can get away with two if you increase the development time. If you re-use you'll get no image; there aren't enough chemicals in the solution to develop another 160 square inches of film.

Marty

But if I use a 2 roll tank i'm also putting in 2x the amount of chemistry. I didn't see anything in the text that said I need x amount of developer per roll.

Ronald M · 01-13-2011

Full sealed containers are perfect for 6 months. If your plastic does not breath, and many do, it is good. If it has more than a slight brown tinge which is there as mixed, it is no good or at least not perfect.

I never use partial bottles as they are un predictable after even a few days and I don`t care what Kodak says. I use 4 oz bottles and scratch mix a quart at a time.

I have run very careful weekly tests for 6 months and stability is perfect. Partial bottles are DANGEROUS.

Freakscene · 01-13-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by ibcrewin

But if I use a 2 roll tank i'm also putting in 2x the amount of chemistry. I didn't see anything in the text that said I need x amount of developer per roll.

"You can develop one 135-3 roll (80 square inches)
in 473 mL (16 ounces) or two rolls together in 946 mL
(one quart) of diluted developer. If you process one
135-36 roll in a 237 mL (8-ounce) tank or two 135-36 rolls
in a 473 mL (16-ounce) tank, increase the development time

by 10 percent (see the following tables)."

I have good sensitometric data that shows that if you re-use D76 1+1 you get much thinner negs and that the developer has exhausted itself and passed the useful point of activity. D76 works by a superadditive relationship between metol and hydroquinone in the presence of sulfite - silver salts need an electron to develop to silver. The combination is superadditive under these circumstances because hydroquinone regenerates the metol that adsorbs to the silver salts and this regeneration allows it to continue developing. The hydroquinone stops regenerating the metol, development stops. This seems to be what happens if you over-use D76, but measuring exactly what happens is tricky.

Marty

zerobuttons · 01-13-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by wizard717

I have a little more then a half Gal. of D76 working solution.
It's about 4 month old and has been stored in a sealed black plastic container in a very cool basement work room.
I have a few rolls of of Arista 400 and a few rolls of Legacy 400 I'd like to process.
Do you think the D76 is still usable?

Since D76 chemically should be the same as ID-11, I take it that you can see it right away, when you pour the developer into a clear measuring container, if it´s good or bad.
I have found that my stock solution ID-11 turns dark yellow if it has been mixed up more than 5-6 months ago. So far, I have assumed that this is a sign that I shouldn´t use it.

If anyone here knows more about this colour shift in ID-11 and whether or not it can take place with D76, please comment.

Costo Kim · 01-15-2011

Quote:

I have a little more then a half Gal. of D76 working solution.
It's about 4 month old and has been stored in a sealed black plastic container in a very cool basement work room.

recently I had exactly the same situation
and I had to increase dev time ~10-15% b/c first batch came out slighty underdeveloped
(I diluted 1:1 just before usage)

Fotohuis · 01-15-2011

Crappy developer is the worst thing you can do. If 3,8 ltr./1 gallon is too much take the 1 ltr. packing of D76/ID11/or Fomadon P W37.
Putting a stock away for more then the regular time is asking for problems and non-consistency.
Good liquid developer concentrates in storage are Rodinal and HC-110. This is another way to go.