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Old 09-08-2016   #41
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Originally Posted by k__43 View Post
So one thought ..
If one winds the film back as far as it goes when the release was not activated and then keeps the finger on the rewind thus not allowing the film to unwind again and the only slightly losen the pressure on the rewind while advancing should solve the problem temporarily then, right? (just giving the film some bit extra tension.)
Assuming the theory is that normal canisters provide a bit of extra pull tension that IXMOOs do not have


Btw. my daylight loader I use for IXMOOs is not able to count sprockets with thin films either.
That solves the problem, I tried this approach.

So now my question is if this is a mechanical problem that can be addressed or a design flaw of the M4? Since the M4 baseplate was designed to open IXMOO canister I think Leica did some tests when introducing the new take-up spool system that came with the M4.
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Old 09-08-2016   #42
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Interesting results. Could the pressure plate be part of this trouble? Would a thin film need a slightly different pressure plate setting? Just thinking out loud. Joe
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Old 09-09-2016   #43
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That solves the problem, I tried this approach.

So now my question is if this is a mechanical problem that can be addressed or a design flaw of the M4? Since the M4 baseplate was designed to open IXMOO canister I think Leica did some tests when introducing the new take-up spool system that came with the M4.
My M2 with the old style take up has the same problem. Maybe it is indeed the pressure plate that is not pressing enough?
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Old 09-11-2016   #44
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My M2 with the old style take up has the same problem. Maybe it is indeed the pressure plate that is not pressing enough?
In this case the film might curl very slightly and then frames would be very slightly out of focus in the upper and lower part of the frame.
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Old 09-14-2016   #45
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One more observation ... when advancing the film the sprocket wheel rotates smoothly until the last moment when the advance lever almost has reached it`s final point. At this moment the sprocket wheel rotates very slightly backwards (more like a very brief jump) before stopping in the final position. Is that normal?
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Old 09-14-2016   #46
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Looks like some gear is missing a tooth there. Does that repeat at regular intervals, or randomly?
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Old 09-14-2016   #47
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Looks like some gear is missing a tooth there. Does that repeat at regular intervals, or randomly?
Every frame, with backdoor closed and removed.
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Old 01-18-2017   #48
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Just to dig up an old thread for a bit of a rehash.

I received a "user" M4 recently, and all was going well until the last roll where I had a bonus sprocket gap between frames. I remembered this thread and thought it might have the answer but while reading it I think I worked out what happened...
Typically I load the camera, advance of shoot a blank, check the rewind spins and then I'm done. But this time (mainly cause it's a new to me camera) I was playing around with it, and wound the rewind knob until it didn't wind anymore, like you would at the beginning of the roll to take up the tension. When I let it go the tension spun out of the film and the rewind knob spun pretty quickly. The gap is at this point (I developed the film that night and remembered playing with it between the two images) and I'm guessing that the tension coming out of the roll pushed the film over the sprockets. It was only in the one place.

I'm using Fomapan 400 bulk rolled onto generic plastic cassettes (gotta get me some IXMOO's). Interestingly the felt is not so tight on that cassette as I had a bit of a light leak on the first frame from the light getting trough the trap (it was a 35 degree day in the midday sun, sunny 22!).

Gabor, did you find the cause of your issue?
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Old 01-18-2017   #49
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I think you reproduced my result but in a different way. In the IXMOO the film is not hold back by any friction of the cassette opening (felt tip) since the IXMOO cassette is in OPEN position inside the camera once the base plate has been locked. What happens in my case is that every other frame the film "jumps" exactly one hole over the sprocket wheel, widening the frame gap by that distance. My explanation is that the tension of the film is increased inside the IXMOO canister by advancing it lets say for two frames and then since nothing holds it back releases the tension like a coiled spring, which makes it jumping over the sprocket wheel.
In my case it also happened with films that have a very thin film base but are in standard film canister (with felt tip). I did not have this problem of irregular gaps with standard film (eg Delta400) in standard film canister.

My camera is in for service at DAG since last year and I hope that Don can figure out a solution.


Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelwj View Post
Just to dig up an old thread for a bit of a rehash.

I received a "user" M4 recently, and all was going well until the last roll where I had a bonus sprocket gap between frames. I remembered this thread and thought it might have the answer but while reading it I think I worked out what happened...
Typically I load the camera, advance of shoot a blank, check the rewind spins and then I'm done. But this time (mainly cause it's a new to me camera) I was playing around with it, and wound the rewind knob until it didn't wind anymore, like you would at the beginning of the roll to take up the tension. When I let it go the tension spun out of the film and the rewind knob spun pretty quickly. The gap is at this point (I developed the film that night and remembered playing with it between the two images) and I'm guessing that the tension coming out of the roll pushed the film over the sprockets. It was only in the one place.

I'm using Fomapan 400 bulk rolled onto generic plastic cassettes (gotta get me some IXMOO's). Interestingly the felt is not so tight on that cassette as I had a bit of a light leak on the first frame from the light getting trough the trap (it was a 35 degree day in the midday sun, sunny 22!).

Gabor, did you find the cause of your issue?
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #50
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UPDATE: After some more time waiting for my camera to return from DAG the problem is solved now. The take-up spool (mechanism?) was worn and needed to be replaced.
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