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Old 01-25-2017   #41
fjolnir
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColSebastianMoran View Post
The Fuji Macro goes to 1:2, slightly awkward for shooting 35mm negatives because you want .6x, not .5x, to fill the frame. Have you put the Fuji Macro on your extension tube?
Here is XF60mm at 1:2. I don't have a file using the tubes right now, but it was really bad. This guy had similar results: XF60mm with tubes vs XF60mm with Raynox. As you can see in those, it's fine at 0.5x, and then even with the smaller macro tube, the corners are a blurry mess.

I sold mine already (thankfully at a higher price than I bought it for), so I can't test further.
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Old 01-25-2017   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColSebastianMoran View Post
Fuji 60mm Macro shot has way less contrast than Sony Macro.
Yeah, the other image had levels adjustments applied, oops. Here it is unprocessed.
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Old 02-06-2017   #43
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Final update, El-Nikkor 75mm didn't cut it either, so I gave up on this, and picked up a Minolta 5400 for $200. The results are better than even the Sony, so I'm happy.
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Old 02-28-2017   #44
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I'm sharing below the way I'm using a Sony A7r to scan negatives, in case it can be useful to someone. Basically, it's not very different from what other guys are doing by using a BEOON, only without a BEOON (can't find it used..). Instead, I'm using my enlarger, to which the camera is mounted by means of a cheap accessory after removing the enlarger's head. See photo below. By using either close-up lenses or extension tubes & an old Nikon 50 1.8, I can fill whole of the 36 Mp FF sensor with a 35mm negative including black border. The scans I get are way better than those I used to get from my Epson 4490 and Reflecta 7200 Professional.
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Old 06-19-2017   #45
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Here's my setup for 35mm. Sony A7, Nikon PB-4 Bellows, the terrific APO Rodagon D 1:1 lens, a Beseler Dual-Mode Duplicator for illumination. (The "Vello" cord triggers the Beseler flash through Wein Safe-Sync.) Sony "RemoteCameraControl" app allows tethered shooting, auto-import into Lightroom.

by the way, see this thread on illuminating color negatives with Cyan/Magenta light to offset the color mask.

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Old 06-19-2017   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIkhail View Post
I am curious: does scanning with camera rather than with dedicated scanner, as Nikon Coolscan for example, give you better quality, or is it faster, or both? I mean, what's the reason to do that?
Thank you.
Faster with plenty of resolution with camera-scan (with 24MPx and a good macro lens).

On the other hand, color adjustment for color negatives is tough. Might be easier with the scanning software for a dedicated film scanner.

At this point, I'm quite happy with camera-scan results.
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Old 06-20-2017   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CliveC View Post
I really don't see why going from FF to APS-C would necessarily be lower quality in this application. It all goes down to the lens.
Agreed.

Film scanning is one application where the increased in sensor area compared to APS-C is least important.
  • You control the signal-to noise ratio by increasing the signal (external lighting)
  • The potential increase in dynamic range is essentially moot

In fact, for media with 4:5, 1:3.5, 1:2 or 1:1 aspect ratios, m4/3 camera bodies may be better (less cropping).

I don't think DOF differences are relevant.

After lens compatibility/availability I think pixel density is the most important parameter.
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Old 06-20-2017   #48
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I thought I might try camera scanning with my Nex 7 and Nikon 55 Micro, but after considering how many shots per roll actually warrant scanning, the speed advantage did not seem so compelling. I decided instead to buy a new film scanner.

B&H now has the Plustek 8200i SE on sale for $275, so I opted for that solution. The prospect of a simple, compact approach with no setup time appeals to me.

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Old 06-20-2017   #49
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I turned the camera/scanner at right angles to make it more ergonomic:
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Old 06-20-2017   #50
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I "scanned" using a Nikon D7000 and nikkor 55mm f3.5 micro for a long time with excellent results. Once I went FF with a Nikon D610 I bought a AFS 60mm micro to replace the older lens. No difference in the results between the two combos. The newer 60mm is a much better lens though.
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Old 06-20-2017   #51
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Timely. I've just acquired a Beoon and intend to scan my 35mm (only) negs using either a Leica M240 or a Fuji X-T1. The latter of course with its M mount adapter. In choosing a suitable lens I'm a little confused with choice.

Given the above, what lens you advise ?

Thank you
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Old 06-21-2017   #52
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There could be many lenses to choose from.

Figure out what mount you want.

Decide if you want AF.

Decide how close the camera will be to the media, then choose appropriate focal lengths.

Create a budget.

Spend some time hunting down data-driven lens reviews. Good copy lenses use optical designs that are optimized for close-up work.
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Old 06-21-2017   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willie_901 View Post
There could be many lenses to choose from.

Figure out what mount you want.

Decide if you want AF.

Decide how close the camera will be to the media, then choose appropriate focal lengths.

Create a budget.

Spend some time hunting down data-driven lens reviews. Good copy lenses use optical designs that are optimized for close-up work.
There's absolutely no useful information in this comment.
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Old 06-21-2017   #54
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You will need a Leica-mount lens, either M or LTM, to work with the BEOON. My BEOON setup uses a Fuji X-E2 and a 50/2.8 Schneider Componon S enlarging lens (M39 thread). I am _very_ happy with the results.

The BEOON was designed for a 35mm film camera (24x36 sensor) and a 50mm lens. If you change the sensor size to APSC (or anything else) or change the lens focal length it is unlikely that the extension tubes that come with the BEOON will let you fill the sensor frame with the image of the negative. Every combination of the four tubes I tried was either too long to too short. I calculated the necessary length by interpolation and eventually found a 40mm tube that works for me. YMMV
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Old 06-21-2017   #55
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Thank you for the response. Very interesting and much appreciated.
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Old 06-21-2017   #56
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I used to scan my negatives with my Nikon D90 and the 40mm Micro Nikkor. The results where a lot better from what I get now with my Epson V600, but it used to take longer to get a scan, from setting the negative in the holder I made, taking a couple of shots to get the optimal exposure, taking the shot and inverting later in photoshop.
With the scanner I get things done faster, but with lesser quality.
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Old 06-21-2017   #57
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Has anyone tried copying with a Printing Nikkor?

http://coinimaging.com/printing-nikkor_105.html
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Old 06-21-2017   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PKR View Post
Has anyone tried copying with a Printing Nikkor?

http://coinimaging.com/printing-nikkor_105.html
Looks nearly impossible to find one at ebay. But there are macro lenses that do a great job even at 2.8.
Here is what the Micro Nikkor 40mm can do at about 4-5 cm from the 135 film plane (single frame, no stacking):


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Old 06-22-2017   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fjolnir View Post
There's absolutely no useful information in this comment.
Just as your question was ambiguous. If I had recommended the most expensive lens when your budget is limited; a mount you prefer not use; choose MF when you need AF –*that response would have been equally useless.
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Old 06-22-2017   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willie_901 View Post
Just as your question was ambiguous. If I had recommended the most expensive lens when your budget is limited; a mount you prefer not use; choose MF when you need AF –*that response would have been equally useless.
It certainly would have been
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Old 06-22-2017   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nikos72 View Post
Looks nearly impossible to find one at ebay. But there are macro lenses that do a great job even at 2.8.
Here is what the Micro Nikkor 40mm can do at about 4-5 cm from the 135 film plane (single frame, no stacking):
I had one for a while. It was lifted from my repairman's shop by an employee. I haven't been able to replace it. I think images made from a Printing Nikkor would hold up well to some of the lower priced film scanners. Once you compare them to those done on a Creo IQ series scanner it's a different story. Wet scans done on an Epson flat bed can be good for some things. I wonder if the coping technique with a really good lens could / would be better? It certainly would be a lot faster.
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Old 07-07-2017   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug A View Post
You will need a Leica-mount lens, either M or LTM, to work with the BEOON. My BEOON setup uses a Fuji X-E2 and a 50/2.8 Schneider Componon S enlarging lens (M39 thread). I am _very_ happy with the results.

The BEOON was designed for a 35mm film camera (24x36 sensor) and a 50mm lens. If you change the sensor size to APSC (or anything else) or change the lens focal length it is unlikely that the extension tubes that come with the BEOON will let you fill the sensor frame with the image of the negative. Every combination of the four tubes I tried was either too long to too short. I calculated the necessary length by interpolation and eventually found a 40mm tube that works for me. YMMV
Arrived today. I've found that using my Fuji XT-1 with a Summicron 50mm, 1:1 mask and the "C" extension tube enables me to fill the frame. The results are extremely impressive and close to my Minolta Multi Pro scans. Considerably quicker to use. I have a Schneider Componon S 50mm on order which I'm hopeful will further improve matters. I've also found that using the "Scanhancer" diffusers from the Minolta are great for holding the highlights.

This has been a great buy.
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Old 07-07-2017   #63
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My suggestion for lens for camera scanning: Be attentive to the optimal magnification for which the lens is designed. In my testing, while many lenses will produce adequate quality in the center way outside their design range, it's in the optimal range that edges/corners are good. Edge/corner quality might not matter much for a portrait of an insect, but will matter for scanning the full frame of a 35mm negative.

To scan 35mm with APS camera you'll want 1:1.5 for the full frame and closer to 1:1 if you are cropping.

As I understand things... Very roughly..

Optimal at magnifications greater than 1:1
- Specialized macro lenses (Photar, Luminar, short focal length bellows lenses)
- Reversed lenses

Optimal at 1:1
- APO Rodagon D 1:1 75mm f/4
- Olympus 80mm f/4 bellows lens (some models w/ fine focus adjustment on lens)
- Any others? Many "macro" lenses will go to 1:1, but this isn't their design optimum.

Optimal at 1:2 to 1:5
- APO Rodagon D 2x 75mm f/4.5 is designed for 1:2
- Most any "macro" lens, including the micro-Nikkors

Optimal at 1:3 to 1:10 (designed for making enlargements of negatives)
- Most enlarging lenses (e.g. 50mm El-Nikkor or Sch Componon S)

Optimal at non-macro distances 1:10 to 1:infinity
- Most non-macro lenses

To scan a negative in parts and stitch, might need more than 1:1, say 2:1. Also to scan 16mm or other small negatives. For this, reverse the above optimal ratios and reverse the lens.

A site with good tests of many macro lenses and detailed charts is coinimaging.com. Look for the green line showing sharpness loss at corners. Here for example, the chart for Minolta 50mm f/3.5 bellows lens, where the corners are equal to center at 1:1.5 on up to 1:4 and probably beyond (green curve, lower is better). This looks like an excellent choice for scanning 35mm with an APS camera, but it's apparently hard to find.



Friends, do I have the above listing about right? Any suggestions or additions?
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Old 07-07-2017   #64
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If I were to go down this road again, I would want an autofocus macro lens from the camera manufacturer. I tried copying negatives with a Fuji XE2, Olympus OM bellows, and Olympus macro lens, and found it very difficult to focus. I gave up and went with a film scanner. I know others have had a better experience, but it just didn't work for me.
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Old 07-07-2017   #65
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Don't forget that if you use a lens designed to cover a 24x36mm negative with a 16x24mm APSC sensor you are not using the corners of the lens coverage.


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Old 07-07-2017   #66
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I find it very easy to focus the X-E2 using the Focus Peak Highlight option under Manual Focus Assist. I focus with the f/2.8 lens wide open and stop down to shoot.


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Old 07-07-2017   #67
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I've just started with my Pentax K1, Pentax 100 macro and using pixelshift. Only done 1 frame so far, and that just laid on the light box, but was actually reasonably impressive e for a first go. More in next couple of weeks

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