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View Poll Results: Ever bought Leica new? lens or body only
yes in the last 10 years 206 45.68%
yes more than 10 years ago 52 11.53%
No 193 42.79%
Voters: 451. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-05-2016   #41
Rayt
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All my current Leica bodies both film and digital were bought used. And 3 of my lenses were bought new 21, 35, 50 all latest Summilux.
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Old 01-05-2016   #42
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One time only, a pretty souvenir from New York City a brand new Leica MP .75 from Ken Hansen. Enjoying it till this day! Would probably never buy a new Leica again, especially a digital one with astronomical prices....
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Old 01-05-2016   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by photomoof View Post
What did you expect, please be honest, not many new buyers?

For the record:
2 - M4 black chrome
2 - M6 first production, black chrome, one 50 f2 and one 75 f1.4
2 - M6 TTL Millenium and matching serial # 50 f2.8 Elmar lenses
Maybe a motor, could have been used.

All gone now...
Got to admit I expected a lot less new buying from this forums membership.
It's still a very tiny percentage of Leica's sales though. It's probably the same on other boards so I don't believe hobbyists and the odd pro are Leica's target. There must be a lot of gear bought new just sitting in drawers etc doing nothing.
I would personally never buy new simply because I don't believe they offer value for money. I'm the same with cars though so it's nothing new being a tight a@@@. The last new items I bought were all Nikon.
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Old 01-05-2016   #44
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No, never. Would not.
If one does not want to have the latest and newest, there is no need. There is so much good used material on the market.

We should value old things. I am not young myself

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Old 01-05-2016   #45
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I bought an m8, 35cron aspherical, summarit75, 21elmarit.
All were purchased new 2weeks before I bought them 21 and 75 never mounted.
The camera had a card with a dozen or so out of focus images.
The fellah bought it all during a cruise. I paid $7500. Sold all the lenses, kept the body, and pocketed $500.
I preferred my Biogon 35 and could live with the Heliar75 although the summarit is beautiful.

My inly dealer purchase was an FLE lux35 in 2012.
An xpro1 arrived that same week. I returned the Lux and sold my m8's.
Never conected with the M9 and the M240 was too late. I'm more than content to use fuji for digital and a bessa and older m for my two rangefinder lenses.

If I ever have the dough and loose any more common sense,.... I could buy an S2 and adapter to shoot old contax 645 lenses.
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Old 01-05-2016   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobbylon View Post
Got to admit I expected a lot less new buying from this forums membership.
It's still a very tiny percentage of Leica's sales though. It's probably the same on other boards so I don't believe hobbyists and the odd pro are Leica's target. There must be a lot of gear bought new just sitting in drawers etc doing nothing.
I would personally never buy new simply because I don't believe they offer value for money. I'm the same with cars though so it's nothing new being a tight a@@@. The last new items I bought were all Nikon.

I think there's a false premise here, and that is that Leica makes development and production decisions based on a typical Leica consumer (who we probably really can safely assume is quite well off and who may or may not take photography especially seriously).

Just about *every* manufacturer, and almost certainly every manufacturer of branded goods, has a diverse customer base, some of whom are quite price sensitive and some of whom aren't. This is why economists draw demand curves as downward sloping. A demand curve is meant to sketch out the relationship between price and sales and at extremely high prices only a few units will be sold but as price drops more and more people think -- oh yeah, at that price I'll take the plunge -- and the number of sales increases. The demand curve is the sum of the behavior of many individuals, some of whom are spectacularly wealthy and would buy even if the price were many times what it is and some of whom are not and would only buy if the price were much, much lower than it is. The really important consumers for any manufacturer, though, are the marginal ones. The consumers who would be gained or lost by a particular decision being made by the firm. With one exception, those are the customers that a manufacturer is thinking about as it makes development decisions -- the ones who are on the edge of buying or not buying who might be gained or lost as a result of the decision. And I suspect many of those people are, well, the sort of people who hang out here. I know that I have been on the edge a couple of times (and once bought a new Leica body and another time decided not to buy a new Leica body -- but did buy one used. More about that later).

And I think that shows in Leica's observed behavior, because notwithstanding all the gripey threads, Leica really does act like a company that's trying to win photographers. That requires producing expensive products (and probably more so for a company like Leica which undoubtedly has a much higher cost structure than a company like Nikon). Somewhat oddball photographers to be sure but looking at all but the special editions, the new products being developed by Leica seem like things that are good faith attempts to win the business of people who are enthusiastic about photography.

The special editions are different of course -- those are maybe best explained as price discrimination. As I mentioned above, there are some people who would still buy a Leica even if it were vastly more expensive than it is. But a Leica MP (type 240) has a price and the Queen of England, with all her billions, doesn't have to pay any more for it than I would even though for me the purchase would involve an awful lot of economizing in other areas of my life, maybe more than I could manage and she'd not even notice the lost money. Many companies think, "Gosh, wouldn't it be great if we could charge a fortune to the folks who would pay a fortune without losing all the customers we'd lose if we charged that fortune for all our cameras?" And when those companies think that they start producing special editions -- the idea being make a few changes to differentiate the product from the less fancy one and charge an outrageous price for it. The marginal customers will still buy the normal product at the normal price, the ones who are not price sensitive can buy the fancy version. Production of special editions doesn't mean that a company has abandoned the man in the street user, it means it's trying to keep the man in the street while still making as much as it possibly can off the inhabitants of West Egg.

Finally, even folks who don't buy new Leicas matter in Leica's calculus. The existence of a robust market for used equipment makes the resale value of a Leica higher than it would be if there were no such market. That is something that can be capitalized in the price. You can charge more for a camera that ten years down the road will sell for 20% of its original cost than you can for a camera that ten years down the road will sell for 2% of its original cost. Again, the reason is the marginal user. Someone who's just on the edge of buying might decide to take the plunge instead of pass if he is confident that he can recapture some of what he spent when he goes to sell it (or replace an older model with a newer one if he can sell the older one for enough that the new one seems affordable).

So the fact that many -- maybe even most -- Leicas sell to exceptionally wealthy people is not all that relevant. When it comes to the day to day concerns that drive the direction of the company, what matters are expansions or contractions in sales as a result of the decisions made and those expansions or contractions are, by definition, the marginal purchaser -- the guy who's on the edge, trying to decide whether to buy or not buy.
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Old 01-05-2016   #47
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interesting post thx
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Old 01-06-2016   #48
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Never, besides, almost all Leica bodies or lenses I'm interested in, are out of production, with some patience you save 30-50% on retail esp on Leica digital bodies. Almost fell for the SL as a universal does it all camera, I think it's a fantastic camera, but I couldn't justify paying full retail for it.
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Old 01-06-2016   #49
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M8, M8-2 & M9 - all 'new but ex-demo' therefore reduced in price, and as they are used professionally I reclaim the tax so cheaper still. The warranty is potentially worth paying for.

Absolutely new, yes, the 21SEM and worth every penny.
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Old 01-06-2016   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jschrader View Post
If one does not want to have the latest and newest, there is no need. There is so much good used material on the market.
Quote:
Originally Posted by photomoof
For work I always buy new bodies if I can, or at least new enough that they have never been serviced.
I agree with both of these comments.

For work, new. Unless it's a backup body that's a great combination of price and condition/history. For me, quite happy to buy used now. Much like used cars there are some amazing bargains with just the right amount of use out there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pgk
...and as they are used professionally I reclaim the tax so cheaper still. The warranty is potentially worth paying for.
^^^ That is the reason to buy new work gear in my opinion.
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Old 01-06-2016   #51
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Doh. Forgot to answer the original question

M8 and M9.

I don't use Leica for work now so unless that changes I wouldn't do it again.
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Old 01-06-2016   #52
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M8 (3 of them as the first two suffered sudden death) and D-lux 2.
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Old 01-06-2016   #53
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M6TTL bought new, I still have it. Thinking about it in retrospect this was driven by the arrival of a bonus that made the purchase acceptable within the economics of the family.
I have bought eyesight correction lenses new also but have lost them all!
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Old 01-06-2016   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dralowid View Post
M6TTL bought new, I still have it. Thinking about it in retrospect this was driven by the arrival of a bonus that made the purchase acceptable within the economics of the family.
I have bought eyesight correction lenses new also but have lost them all!
off topic but do you mean correction lenses for Leica?
If so I just read a tip as I've just started using them myself.
A dab of clear nail varnish on the eyepiece thread will secure the lens.
when you need to seperate a drip of acetone into the thread will unlock it.
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Old 01-06-2016   #55
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A little more than 5 years ago I bought my X1 new.
Before I bought my M7.0,58 and a couple of lenses used.
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Old 01-06-2016   #56
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No, so far I haven't. The price point has simply been too high.

Leica has received my money for things like 6-bit coding, though.
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Old 01-06-2016   #57
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Summicron Asph. 28/2
Summilux Asph. 50/1.4
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Old 01-06-2016   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobbylon View Post
off topic but do you mean correction lenses for Leica?
If so I just read a tip as I've just started using them myself.
A dab of clear nail varnish on the eyepiece thread will secure the lens.
when you need to seperate a drip of acetone into the thread will unlock it.
I do indeed and at around £60 new not cheap. Thanks for the tip but I've lost them all and now, as I get older, my distance sight improves...
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Old 01-06-2016   #59
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MP in 2003.

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Old 01-06-2016   #60
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There was a time, pre-digital, where buying a new Leica M body made a lot of sense to people. Buying a second body most times lead to buying a used one and having it CLA'd if need be. As you know, in the age of film, those bodies lasted forever. One usually bought a film camera and had it for years and years. Fathers passed them on to their children and so on. Obsolescence really didn't exist. Nikon even made sure their lenses remained compatible with newer bodies. It was a tool. No one expected digital to ultimately change the game as much as it did.
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Old 01-06-2016   #61
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MP and 50 cron
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Old 01-06-2016   #62
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No, I have never bought a new Leica lens or camera. The Standard Leica was bought used. The other "ones" too.
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Old 01-06-2016   #63
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I don't think used market hurts Leica. It provide a chance for people to enter and try the brand without the high prices. Once you are hooked, you either continue to buy used or maybe they have a product that you are willing to buy new down the road.

There are tons of people who would still buy Canon 5d2 today to enter the FF DSLR world. Used market present another opportunity for the brand to lure would be Fan or people who wants to try before buy in and so on.
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Old 01-06-2016   #64
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Romantic? Personal opinion might vary Photomoof, but I knew quite a lot of friends growing up getting the family's or father's camera. I got quite a few medium format cameras, including 16mm and 8mm film cameras.
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Old 01-06-2016   #65
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Not yet and (probably) never will
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Old 01-06-2016   #66
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M9P and M-P Typ 240 bodies. Also, an open box 24mm 3.8 Elmar M. All of my other lenses, and my M6TTL, were bought used.
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Old 01-06-2016   #67
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Old 01-06-2016   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6x7 View Post
Does a "never used collector's item" count? No, it does not. It was "only" a 1980 M4-P, bought in 2010.
Mine was newer. A 1981 M4-P bought in 2004
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Old 01-06-2016   #69
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New Summicron 50/2 purchased in late 1990s.
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Old 01-06-2016   #70
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Bought grey market new, back when the Mark/$ or Euro/$ exchange rates made that a really good deal:
M6TTL 0.58x (right when the Euro came out and briefly tanked compared to the $, got a 1.25x thrown in for free!)
35/2 ASPH
24/2.8 ASPH and finder.

Used? Everything else except the CV lenses.
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Old 01-06-2016   #71
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I've always bought used. It would be wonderful to buy Leica products new, and I'd like to support the company directly, but it's especially hard to justify it with the Canadian dollar at a 14-year low. When I look at the exchange rates between Cdn $ / US $ / Euro, it's really really painful.

In a year or two the situation will likely be different and I might re-consider.
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Old 01-06-2016   #72
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Actually I have a feeling that I contributed substantially to Leica's financial revival... Still, the feeling of opening a new box of Leica gear does give a mild Adrenalin rush, there is no denying it...
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Old 01-06-2016   #73
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Quote:
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Actually I have a feeling that I contributed substantially to Leica's financial revival... Still, the feeling of opening a new box of Leica gear does give a mild Adrenalin rush, there is no denying it...
I think you probably did!
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Old 01-06-2016   #74
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I just bought a new Leica M-E. It broke:P haha. I guess that all i want is to shoot with film leicas but i dont have the time to develop no more. And send the film away takes away all the fun.
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Old 01-06-2016   #75
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M4 and M6 new. Summilux and Summicron new. Best purchases were all used, especially the IIIb. yours FPJ
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Old 01-06-2016   #76
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All used. In fact, I don't think I've ever bought any camera related item over 100€ new. Second-hand is amazing.
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Old 01-06-2016   #77
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bought both about equally.

Well worn item usually work great. Old pristine items, use caution. There are exceptions.
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Old 01-07-2016   #78
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I bought my M6ttl in 2001 new when there was a 200 USD rebate. It was my first Leica and it will probably be the last new item that I purchase from Leica. Two weeks ago I bought an M6ttl Black Paint Millennium for around the same price that I paid for my original M6ttl.

I don't have any problem buying anything new from Leica, I just don't think that they will make any new cameras or lenses that I will want to purchase .

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Old 01-07-2016   #79
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Old 01-08-2016   #80
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ZM 25mm. Does that count?
Last new purchase was a Nikon 17-55 about 7 years ago.
Only other new lens purchase was in 1984/5. A zoom for my Fujica stx-1.
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