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View Poll Results: What is Your Favorite Digital Rangefinder Camera?
Epson RD1 family - all models 47 17.28%
Leica M8 / 8u 22 8.09%
Leica M8.2 9 3.31%
Leica M9 41 15.07%
Leica M9-P 22 8.09%
Leica MM 48 17.65%
Leica M-E 8 2.94%
Leica M240 aka M aka M10 53 19.49%
Leica M-P 19 6.99%
Leica M60 3 1.10%
Voters: 272. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-10-2015   #41
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It's interesting that the M10 seems to be kicking butt in this poll ... I didn't think it had gained that much favor since it's release personally.
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Old 01-11-2015   #42
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I have the M9 (two) and the M10-240 (that's nearly the Hollywood zip code) and I haven't voted yet because I can't decide. I really identify with what Pioneer put up, as I first encountered the M9 in a similar stage of photography-life and I agree with all his points. I got an M 6 months ago (see, there's another ambiguity about the M nomenclature) and the M9s have been in the cupboard since, or rather now they are in Melbourne getting their corroded sensors replaced (must get around to voting in that poll too) and I really miss them. I continue to use the M because its advantages, that everyone mentions, essentially makes it a more practical camera. I do prefer the M9 files though and wish somehow Leica made an M9-2 with the shutter and RF of the M and a non-corroding CCD sensor and perhaps offering an optional lower magnification viewfinder for use with wider lenses.
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Old 01-11-2015   #43
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Out of the Leica cameras I have only used the M8. I guess it makes it my favourite.
The poll now includes also the Epson R-D1 family, which is what brought me to rangefinders (not just digital rangefinders). It's a special camera, but the M8 is more convenient largely thanks to its smaller crop factor.
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Old 01-11-2015   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CameraQuest View Post
Misnaming a camera the "M" in the face of 60's years of what, close to a 600,000 + M's before it, is the real misnomer.

Instead of mindlessly following official the Leica misnomer Metropolis style,
it would b good to see more Leica owners appreciating Leica's heritage and wake up
to protest this bad PR foolishness and lack of awareness of all the M's that preceded THE M.

Stephen
I'm sure calling the M3 the M3 instead of the iv f gave the same reactions.
I think I qualify as a traditionalist, but I don't see the problem.
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Old 01-11-2015   #45
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I have used only the M8 and the M9. The M9 is more versatile, and it has a FF sensor. The M8 allows faster back to back photos due to the shorter buffer time. Both are great cameras to me. One day, I will add the latest model digital Leica.
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Old 01-11-2015   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CameraQuest View Post
Misnaming a camera the "M" in the face of 60's years of what, close to a 600,000 + M's before it, is the real misnomer.

Instead of mindlessly following official the Leica misnomer Metropolis style,
it would b good to see more Leica owners appreciating Leica's heritage and wake up
to protest this bad PR foolishness and lack of awareness of all the M's that preceded THE M.

Stephen
It is the manufacturers' prerogative to set the names of their products as they choose. Leica chose to simplify the naming of all their products with a model name and a type name, for example Leica X typ 113, Leica M typ 240. It allows easier identification of models when there are several model lines being produced, for instance the M, the X, the S, and the T models lines in current Leica production.

These naming changes are inevitably a bit messy when first done, and traditionalists always balk at change. But Leica is a modern, thriving company with expanding product lines ... not just a historical artifact and heritage ... so change is inevitable. :-)

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Old 01-11-2015   #47
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To elaborate: Leica regards this camera as a new chapter in the M story. (see 100 Jahre Leica, page 81 : "Traditionsbruch") thus thenchangemin naming convetion is logical.
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Old 01-11-2015   #48
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I'm sure calling the M3 the M3 instead of the iv f gave the same reactions.
I think I qualify as a traditionalist, but I don't see the problem.

And then the M2 came out and then the M1, then the M4, then the M5. So nothing necessarily makes numeric sense in the world of Leica

BTW I voted Monochrom - or MM as you call it.
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Old 01-11-2015   #50
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And then the M2 came out and then the M1, then the M4, then the M5. So nothing necessarily makes numeric sense in the world of Leica

BTW I voted Monochrom - or MM as you call it.
From time to time , when I am feeling lazy- it is a Putsism..
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Digital Rf should be more popular!
Old 01-11-2015   #51
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Digital Rf should be more popular!

I cast my vote for the only digital RF I've actually owned... The RD1-X it was very nice to use. I will say if they ever come out with a Zeiss Ikon Zm digital with one of those amazing low light Sony sensors I'd shoot exclusively rangefinder and sell my Nikon gear no questions asked. I don't see why they haven't yet.. Ziess has a great selection of rangefinder lenses ready to go!

That would be my favorite Digital rangefinder for sure.
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Old 01-11-2015   #52
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Originally Posted by EpicRavenLord View Post
I cast my vote for the only digital RF I've actually owned... The RD1-X it was very nice to use. I will say if they ever come out with a Zeiss Ikon Zm digital with one of those amazing low light Sony sensors I'd shoot exclusively rangefinder and sell my Nikon gear no questions asked. I don't see why they haven't yet.. Ziess has a great selection of rangefinder lenses ready to go!

That would be my favorite Digital rangefinder for sure.


I've said it before and I'll say it again ... shoehorn a foveon sensor into the old RD-1 and I would never need another camera!

(and I wouldn't care about the crop sensor)
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Old 01-11-2015   #53
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With the incidence angle of a Foveon sensor APS-C wouldn't be small enough. I think it would need to be half as small again...
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Old 01-12-2015   #54
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I've said it before and I'll say it again ... shoehorn a foveon sensor into the old RD-1 and I would never need another camera!

(and I wouldn't care about the crop sensor)
... yep, that would be a great bit of kit, I've always liked that sensor ... and judging by the results of these polls the RD1 is clearly the peoples' favorite digital RF camera
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Old 01-12-2015   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CameraQuest View Post
Poll originally started by Raid.

This is a new version with more voting options.

Votes have been reset to zero.

Stephen
1. If you are going to lump all RD-1 models together, you should lump all color M9 into a single line and M 240 variants together into another.

2. By the poll, 73% of people prefer Leica products to Epson, and the overwhelming majority of them prefer the 24x36mm sensors.

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Old 01-12-2015   #56
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1. If you are going to lump all RD-1 models together, you should lump all color M9 into a single line and M 240 variants together into another.

2. By the poll, 73% of people prefer Leica products to Epson, and the overwhelming majority of them prefer the 24x36mm sensors.

Dante
Agreed. The M9, M9-P, and M-E are the same family with identical IQ and near identical ergonomics. The M240 and M-P240 are also about the same. Same with the M8 family.
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Old 01-12-2015   #57
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Agreed. The M9, M9-P, and M-E are the same family with identical IQ and near identical ergonomics. The M240 and M-P240 are also about the same. Same with the M8 family.
Well, I don't agree. As I understand it, the poll is not about which digital RF sensor one prefers, but about the camera as a whole.

E.g. the missing frameline selector makes the ME a totally different camera as the M9 for me. I really miss the selector on my M240. You might not care about it, but some do, and so it it justified, to count them separate. The Epsons could be two groups for the same reason. Two with the swiveling screen and the one without. Sometimes small technical differences make the big difference if one loves or hates a product.

Anyway, even if you put all Epsons in one block and also group similar Leicas, it is very impressive, how many people prefer the images or handling of the old and outdated Epson.
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Old 01-12-2015   #58
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Anyway, even if you put all Epsons in one block and also group similar Leicas, it is very impressive, how many people prefer the images or handling of the old and outdated Epson.
Except for the complicated dial on top and loud shutter, Epson and Cosina got it right the first time.

Many consider the RD1 family to handle substantially better than the digital Leica rangefinders. I am one of them.

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Old 01-12-2015   #59
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The Epson, just for it's retro features.
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Old 01-12-2015   #60
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The Epson R-D1, for the 1:1 finder, the wind on lever, I can hide the Display, the dials give a fun element.
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Can't agree due to one thing.
Old 01-12-2015   #61
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Can't agree due to one thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith View Post
I've said it before and I'll say it again ... shoehorn a foveon sensor into the old RD-1 and I would never need another camera!

(and I wouldn't care about the crop sensor)
Given the nature of rangefinder photography the sensor would have to be a lowlight beast... The foveon is not. Slap an A7s full frame sensor into an Ikon Zm ... And fear no light... Or lack there of.
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Old 01-12-2015   #62
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Originally Posted by EpicRavenLord View Post
Given the nature of rangefinder photography the sensor would have to be a lowlight beast... The foveon is not. Slap an A7s full frame sensor into an Ikon Zm ... And fear no light... Or lack there of.


I agree that the foveon is no low light wonder but it's black and white output is unmatched IMO and is usable up to 6400 in the little Sigmas with the correct post processing. I think it has a better monochrome output than the MM. It can be stretched to 1600 in colour provided your exposure is accurate and I love the handling of the Epson.
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Old 01-12-2015   #63
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The problem with the Foveon sensor is that due to its construction in three layers the pixels are quite deep. Thus it has quite narrow incidence angles. This will produce problems on short register cameras like rangefinders. If the sensor is any reasonable size, there will be severe vignetting and colour shift effects towards the edges and corners.
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Old 01-12-2015   #64
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My MM is good to 10,000 and the little 18MP sensor because there is no color has been compared to a 36MP camera (d800) when talking sharpness.
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Old 01-12-2015   #65
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I think its interesting that the M Typ 240 is considered a favorite camera in this poll but is not considered a good value in the concurrent "best value" poll. The Epson RD1 cameras are considered favorably in both polls which makes both polls only relevant in the RFF community.
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Old 01-12-2015   #66
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It makes you realise that if Cosina and Epson dared to be different and released a revamped version of the RD-1 with a full frame sensor it would have a waiting market. Especially with the current disillusionment with Leica!
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Old 01-12-2015   #67
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It makes you realise that if Cosina and Epson dared to be different and released a revamped version of the RD-1 with a full frame sensor it would have a waiting market. Especially with the current disillusionment with Leica!

+1 I would buy one. A refreshed RD-1 would be awesome.
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Old 01-12-2015   #68
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I'm not disillusioned with Leica. My MM is by far my favorite camera and the one I shoot all of my personal work with.

Ralph Gibson's words could have been mine when he said this about the MM.
"This camera will do anything I am capable of doing. I will never get to the end of what this instrument can perform."-Ralph Gibson
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If I had the Cash
Old 01-12-2015   #69
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If I had the Cash

Don't get me wrong… I'd buy the M240 and a couple Leica f/1.4 lenses if I had the money for it. Shooting ISO 2000-3200 on the 240 with little noise is very doable. But with my style of shooting I like having clean files at ISO 4000 as an "affordable" option. .. thats why I have a Nikon Df.
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Old 01-12-2015   #70
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I'm not disillusioned with Leica. My MM is by far my favorite camera and the one I shoot all of my personal work with.

Ralph Gibson's words could have been mine when he said this about the MM.
"This camera will do anything I am capable of doing. I will never get to the end of what this instrument can perform."-Ralph Gibson

I could say that about my $45.00 Fed2 I bought in 2006!
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Old 01-13-2015   #71
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I could say that about my $45.00 Fed2 I bought in 2006!
Then you got off cheap.

Finding the equipment that matches the way you see and work is priceless.
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Old 01-13-2015   #72
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The Epson R-D1, for the 1:1 finder, the wind on lever, I can hide the Display, the dials give a fun element.
... I'm that shallow the wind-on lever and the Art Deco dials were enough to convince me
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Old 01-13-2015   #73
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gosh, just got through posting infavor of rd1 on the 'best value' thread and could not believe that my measley 6mp rd1 is running ahead of all M's here! wow! guess i made a decent choice...had enough money left over to buy a 21 elmarit, 75 summarit, the tiny leica type 112 and a few nice dinners. love my rd1. i find myself reaching for it more and more and leaving the excellent rx1 behind. more to photography than mp's, no?
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Old 01-13-2015   #74
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Given the nature of rangefinder photography the sensor would have to be a lowlight beast... The foveon is not. Slap an A7s full frame sensor into an Ikon Zm ... And fear no light... Or lack there of.
I'd want BOTH

(Keith's Foveon R-D1 and the digital ZI with A7s type sensor (re-stacked for RF glass)).
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Old 01-14-2015   #75
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I don't have any interest in Foveon as there are too simply many issues and downsides with it at the moment and the latest bayer sensors seem to do a bang up job.

I think the M240 is terrific but perhaps for the next generation Leica could offer a choice of a 16mp super-clean high-ISO version and a 40mp super-detailed one

The main problem is that I could see the years of arguments between the two sides re: the 40mp lot saying that scaled down their picture is just as good as the 16mp one.......
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Old 01-14-2015   #76
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They haven't made the one I want yet. Either a Contax G3D or Voigtlander R3D please.
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Old 01-14-2015   #77
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M 240, because that's what I have
What he said.

If cash were to fall out the sky, I would get a black M-P to back up the M240 with. I do not want the M-P badly enough to sell/trade the M240 I have and pay the difference for a new M-P though.
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Old 01-14-2015   #78
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M 240, because that's what I have
What he said.

If cash were to fall out the sky, I would get a black M-P to back up the M240 with. I do not want the M-P badly enough to sell/trade the M240 I have and pay the difference for a new M-P though.
What he said, and what you said too...

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Old 01-17-2015   #79
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I just answered M8U as it is the camera I have but I still don't find my favourite camera in the list as it will appear within next 5years to come .
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Old 01-29-2015   #80
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I'm extremely happy with my M9, but I also missing sometimes old good Epson R-D1s, which I used to have for a few years.
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