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Old 04-22-2009   #81
paul beard
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Originally Posted by wolves3012 View Post
Yes, that's the second catch. It is spring-loaded towards the speed selector (i.e. to the right as you hold the camera normally). I don't recommend taking it apart since you'd have to remove the RF/VF block first. The little cam under the slow-speed mechanism pushes that flat bar to the left at the end of the time and so releases the second curtain. It doesn't move very far at all, couple of mm. Taking the slow-speed mechanism out means that catch never gets pushed aside, so the second curtain cannot release.
Ah. can it be moved manually (to the left, not front to back? That might account for some of my confusion)? I didn't mess with it yesterday, thought I would give it a rest but fortified with this, I may take it up again.

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Old 04-22-2009   #82
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Aha. Diddling that lever works great. That means the second curtain isn't kaput. But for some reason, I cannot get that cam under the slow speed assembly to trip it. And it's pretty hard to see under there so I can see what's missing . . . .

OK, what seems at least as important as the position of the ring gear and its cam is the position of the cam on the spring shaft. I've had some almost successes getting this all fitted together but either the second curtain fails to close or the ring gear runs past its place. I'm not sure the gears aren't out of mesh as one of the problems I have experienced is the end of the spring comes out of the shaft (there's not much to hold it in place). So I expect there's one problem that's outside the scope of these instructions ;-)

Last edited by paul beard : 04-22-2009 at 21:34.
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Old 04-23-2009   #83
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Aha. Diddling that lever works great. That means the second curtain isn't kaput. But for some reason, I cannot get that cam under the slow speed assembly to trip it. And it's pretty hard to see under there so I can see what's missing . . . .

OK, what seems at least as important as the position of the ring gear and its cam is the position of the cam on the spring shaft. I've had some almost successes getting this all fitted together but either the second curtain fails to close or the ring gear runs past its place. I'm not sure the gears aren't out of mesh as one of the problems I have experienced is the end of the spring comes out of the shaft (there's not much to hold it in place). So I expect there's one problem that's outside the scope of these instructions ;-)
Coincidentally I've just had the exact same thing happen on a Zorki 3M, which has an identical mechanism! Here's how you set it up:

First, pop the spring off its post so there's no tension at all. Next, take a look at the cam. Turn the gears until the point of the cam is at 1 O'clock when the mechanism is held as fitted. Cock the shutter and set 1/60th speed. Fit the mechanism, carefully so as not to move the cam.

Now you need to mark the exact position the pin ought to be - don't worry about where it actually is. Mark the ring (not the gear!) where the top arm of the speed selector is (the aluminium part). The pin is supposed to be JUST contacting this to its right (as you look down on it, camera held lens-mount away from you).

Hold the ring gear still, in case the speed selector tries to move it. Trip the shutter. Now turn the ring gear SLOWLY in its normal direction (clockwise) until the second curtain closes. This establishes the exact point the cam operates. Mark the ring gear against the previous mark then take the mechanism out again.

Now, line up the marks again exactly. The next bit I did by eyeballing but a better way would be to mark the cam-gear and frame somehow. You now have the ability to line up the cam to its exact operating position and you also know where the pin OUGHT to be. The gearing between the ring gear and cam gear doesn't have an even relationship (like 2:1 or 3:1 or such). This means that turning the ring gear clockwise will, eventually, bring the cam-gear marks AND the pin into line with the ring mark. Start turning....

When you reach to correct position, wind two turns (of the ring gear) further and pop the spring back on. Now turn two turns backwards again and refit as per the sticky instructions. Hopefully - job done! If not, you may have to adjust the position again :-(
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Zorki: 1e (x2), 2C, 3M, 4, 4K, 5, 6
FED: NKVD, 1g, 2e, 3a, 3b, 4L (x2), 5B, 5C
Kiev 4, 4A
Leica IIIC
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Last edited by wolves3012 : 04-23-2009 at 01:34. Reason: typos
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Old 04-23-2009   #84
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Originally Posted by wolves3012 View Post
Coincidentally I've just had the exact same thing happen on a Zorki 3M, which has an identical mechanism! Here's how you set it up:

First, pop the spring off its post so there's no tension at all. Next, take a look at the cam. Turn the gears until the point of the cam is at 1 O'clock when the mechanism is held as fitted. Cock the shutter and set 1/60th speed. Fit the mechanism, carefully so as not to move the cam.

Now you need to mark the exact position the pin ought to be - don't worry about where it actually is. Mark the ring (not the gear!) where the top arm of the speed selector is (the aluminium part). The pin is supposed to be JUST contacting this to its right (as you look down on it, camera held lens-mount away from you).

Hold the ring gear still, in case the speed selector tries to move it. Trip the shutter. Now turn the ring gear SLOWLY in its normal direction (clockwise) until the second curtain closes. This establishes the exact point the cam operates. Mark the ring gear against the previous mark then take the mechanism out again.

Now, line up the marks again exactly. The next bit I did by eyeballing but a better way would be to mark the cam-gear and frame somehow. You now have the ability to line up the cam to its exact operating position and you also know where the pin OUGHT to be. The gearing between the ring gear and cam gear doesn't have an even relationship (like 2:1 or 3:1 or such). This means that turning the ring gear clockwise will, eventually, bring the cam-gear marks AND the pin into line with the ring mark. Start turning....

When you reach to correct position, wind two turns (of the ring gear) further and pop the spring back on. Now turn two turns backwards again and refit as per the sticky instructions. Hopefully - job done! If not, you may have to adjust the position again :-(
This is just what I was looking for. Here's what's wrong now :-(

I follow the steps, get the ring marked, trip the shutter, turn the cam, turn it some more, keep turning it, feel some slight resistance as it turns but the second shutter never closes, trip it by hand with small screwdriver, go through it all again, this time the shutter opens and closes @ 1/60th, cock and trip, first shutter opens, turn the cam, keep on, no resistance this time . . . .

It is turning, as I can see it. Is the second shutter lever adjustable? It seems to work sometimes. Is it on a spring that isn't doing it's job? is the cam going over it and missing (can't quite see that well)?
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Old 04-23-2009   #85
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This is just what I was looking for. Here's what's wrong now :-(

I follow the steps, get the ring marked, trip the shutter, turn the cam, turn it some more, keep turning it, feel some slight resistance as it turns but the second shutter never closes, trip it by hand with small screwdriver, go through it all again, this time the shutter opens and closes @ 1/60th, cock and trip, first shutter opens, turn the cam, keep on, no resistance this time . . . .

It is turning, as I can see it. Is the second shutter lever adjustable? It seems to work sometimes. Is it on a spring that isn't doing it's job? is the cam going over it and missing (can't quite see that well)?
Hmm...well it's damned hard to see in there, I agree! Maybe the cam is missing the lever. The lever is on a spring, yes, pushed towards the curtain latch. That's why it always holds the second curtain until the cam pushes it back. That lever isn't adjustable as such. Maybe you have to remove the VF block to see things better. It's a bit extreme but you've come this far...it'd be a shame not to solve it!

Does that lever move freely and is it springing towards the catch (to the right)? I'm guessing it must be, since it's doing the correct job. I can only think that the cam is missing it and passing over the top. Does the cam look flat and square-on to its shaft? Is the whole mechanism sitting properly on its mounting, not mis-aligned and sitting too high?
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Zorki: 1e (x2), 2C, 3M, 4, 4K, 5, 6
FED: NKVD, 1g, 2e, 3a, 3b, 4L (x2), 5B, 5C
Kiev 4, 4A
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Last edited by wolves3012 : 04-23-2009 at 12:39.
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Old 04-23-2009   #86
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Hmm...well it's damned hard to see in there, I agree! Maybe the cam is missing the lever. The lever is on a spring, yes, pushed towards the curtain latch. That's why it always holds the second curtain until the cam pushes it back. That lever isn't adjustable as such. Maybe you have to remove the VF block to see things better. It's a bit extreme but you've come this far...it'd be a shame not to solve it!

Does that lever move freely and is it springing towards the catch (to the right)? I'm guessing it must be, since it's doing the correct job. I can only think that the cam is missing it and passing over the top. Does the cam look flat and square-on to its shaft? Is the whole mechanism sitting properly on its mounting, not mis-aligned and sitting too high?
Perseverance wins again. I think the slow speed assembly was just not sitting in the right place. If I make an effort to make sure it's seated as far forward as it will go, all is good. Shutter curtains open and shut as they should at the fast speeds.

Now to address the end of the cam shaft and how to get the spring back on it. The end of it is making it hard to seat the end of the spring and the spring has uncoiled itself a bit. If it's not one damned thing, it's another . . .

I am trying to hold the end of the spring to the cam shaft with a little JB weld. No idea if it will work or where I will find a suitable spring if I have trashed this one.
Thanks for the detailed replies. Might want to add this procedure to the PDF version.

Last edited by paul beard : 04-23-2009 at 18:12.
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Old 04-25-2009   #87
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OK, so any suggestions on what to replace the spring with? It has uncoiled enough and the end of the cam shaft is chewed up enough to make it not re-usable. My favorite purveyor of the otherwise unobtainable and obscure is closed tomorrow so it will have to wait til Monday to see if some other spring can be worked in there.

Advice to novice camera repairers: that spring doesn't need a lot of handling and keenly resents rough handling.
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Old 04-30-2009   #88
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So how about a small saw-cut to restore the shaft? Or did you mean the cam itself is chewed up? As for the spring - hmm - spring wire but I haven't a clue where to suggest! I think if I dig around I have a spare escapement, I know I did have one!
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Old 04-30-2009   #89
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I think if I dig around I have a spare escapement, I know I did have one!
Update: Yes, I have a spare one. Needs a good clean-and-lube but it's a worker. PM me if you want it.
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Old 05-03-2009   #90
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Thanks a lot Wolves. It will be very useful for me.
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Old 05-04-2009   #91
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Just got a Zorki 4 off eBay. As expected, the shutter hung up on the slower speeds. I followed your instructions, and managed to take apart the camera, fix it, and get it back together within 2 hours (best of all, no screws left over). Works like a charm now....thanks for this informative thread!
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Old 08-12-2009   #92
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I have a beat up Zorki 4 which I'd like to CLA, but what is stopping me is the lack of the proper lubricants, and the huge waste of time required to find some suitable ones around here.

If there's a kind soul who can send me a tiny bottle of each of the lubricants needed, I would much prefer giving money (or trading for some Rollei Retro 100 rolls) to a fellow RFFer than buying huge oil bottles which will stay on a shelf forever.
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Old 09-17-2009   #93
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Thanks for the guide. It helped a lot. I just got a Zorki 4 with shutter problems on the slower speeds. I took it apart, added a little oil and now I'm trying to put it all back together.

The problem is I got stuck on the slow speed mechanism. I managed to wind and fit the mechanism back on, and the cam seems to operate correctly...but the pawl doesn't catch the 2nd curtain pin. It seems to stay too low, and the pin just rolls over it... if i hold it a little higher it works. Did it have a shim or something that I lost?

P.S: I didn't disassemble the speed selector.
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Old 09-18-2009   #94
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Thanks for the guide. It helped a lot. I just got a Zorki 4 with shutter problems on the slower speeds. I took it apart, added a little oil and now I'm trying to put it all back together.

The problem is I got stuck on the slow speed mechanism. I managed to wind and fit the mechanism back on, and the cam seems to operate correctly...but the pawl doesn't catch the 2nd curtain pin. It seems to stay too low, and the pin just rolls over it... if i hold it a little higher it works. Did it have a shim or something that I lost?

P.S: I didn't disassemble the speed selector.
There aren't normally any shims, no. If it work when sitting a little higher, you could try adding a couple of thin washers or try and bend the cam a fraction to make it engage better.
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Zorki: 1e (x2), 2C, 3M, 4, 4K, 5, 6
FED: NKVD, 1g, 2e, 3a, 3b, 4L (x2), 5B, 5C
Kiev 4, 4A
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Old 12-30-2009   #95
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it was gr8!! keep it up.
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Old 02-11-2010   #96
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Many thanks for the excellent thread, wolves3012. Without it I'd probably be still trying to unscrew the disc on top of the wind spindle the wrong way!

I'm stripping down my own 4k for a full CLA, and got as far as trying to remove the shutter crate from the shell, but then hit a wall. The crate was absolutely solid due to the glue you mention on the light seal string. I took off the shield which covers the curtain tensioners in the hope of getting better leverage, and found that KMZ had been so generous with the glue that it had extruded out between the shell and the crate front-plate over a length of more than an inch.

The only solvent I could find that softens the glue is acetone, and it has taken about 90 minutes of acetone application alternating with leverage with a thin-bladed screwdriver to finally free it up, but not before some over-enthusiastic leverage early on had bent both the shell and the crate front-plate! It will need a bit of serious precision work to check the mount alignment after the crate front-plate is straightened. Fortunately I have the tools.

I don't know if this problem is common, but I thought I had better add it to the thread as a warning. Acetone works eventually but take your time - and lever gently!

Steve.
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Old 02-13-2010   #97
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Many thanks for the excellent thread, wolves3012. Without it I'd probably be still trying to unscrew the disc on top of the wind spindle the wrong way!

I'm stripping down my own 4k for a full CLA, and got as far as trying to remove the shutter crate from the shell, but then hit a wall. The crate was absolutely solid due to the glue you mention on the light seal string. I took off the shield which covers the curtain tensioners in the hope of getting better leverage, and found that KMZ had been so generous with the glue that it had extruded out between the shell and the crate front-plate over a length of more than an inch.

The only solvent I could find that softens the glue is acetone, and it has taken about 90 minutes of acetone application alternating with leverage with a thin-bladed screwdriver to finally free it up, but not before some over-enthusiastic leverage early on had bent both the shell and the crate front-plate! It will need a bit of serious precision work to check the mount alignment after the crate front-plate is straightened. Fortunately I have the tools.

I don't know if this problem is common, but I thought I had better add it to the thread as a warning. Acetone works eventually but take your time - and lever gently!

Steve.
The one I did came apart easily. I have a spare shell and crate if you want them (the one in some of the pics was the "parts" body). You'd pretty much have to swap everything over though...
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Zorki: 1e (x2), 2C, 3M, 4, 4K, 5, 6
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Old 02-14-2010   #98
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Thanks for the generous offer. I think I should be OK, but if not I'll certainly let you know. I'm stripping the camera down to a bare shutter-crate, so once I've straightened the front-plate by eye and straight-edge, I'll fit it to the crate and check with a depth micrometer if the distance from the 'mount' to the film-plane is equal at all points and adjust if necessary. At the same time I will check the 'register' with the shims and lens-mount fitted.

I will have at least one question to ask in a day or so, but a bit outside the areas covered in this thread so far (concerning rear baffle plate). I will put it in a new thread rather than make this one too long and unwieldy, unless you think it would be better here.

Steve.
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Old 02-16-2011   #99
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I have an issue with my zorki 4 winder, sometimes when I wind it feels as if it doesn't catch and it takes quite a few winds to get friction again. I have noticed that this occurs predominately after I try to set the film counter. What specific area should I look at if I try to CLA the camera?
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Old 02-17-2011   #100
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I have an issue with my zorki 4 winder, sometimes when I wind it feels as if it doesn't catch and it takes quite a few winds to get friction again. I have noticed that this occurs predominately after I try to set the film counter. What specific area should I look at if I try to CLA the camera?
Firstly, check your technique setting the counter. Either hold the winder knob firmly or cock the shutter before setting the counter. Having said that, the counter isn't linked to anything, mechanically, except being friction-coupled to the winder knob.

Generally, you set the counter after loading film and you'll have most likely re-wound a film before that (stating the obvious). Therefore, is the camera going back into "advance" properly? If it's not, I'd look at the bit about flushing out the dog-clutch inside the sprocket and adding some oil (check out the precautions too, it'll run out of the bottom of the sprocket area).

Hope that helps!
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Zorki: 1e (x2), 2C, 3M, 4, 4K, 5, 6
FED: NKVD, 1g, 2e, 3a, 3b, 4L (x2), 5B, 5C
Kiev 4, 4A
Leica IIIC
Yashica Minister III
Zenith C, Zenit C, Zenit E
Minolta XG-M, XD-5, Z1
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Old 02-25-2011   #101
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Firstly, check your technique setting the counter. Either hold the winder knob firmly or cock the shutter before setting the counter. Having said that, the counter isn't linked to anything, mechanically, except being friction-coupled to the winder knob.

Generally, you set the counter after loading film and you'll have most likely re-wound a film before that (stating the obvious). Therefore, is the camera going back into "advance" properly? If it's not, I'd look at the bit about flushing out the dog-clutch inside the sprocket and adding some oil (check out the precautions too, it'll run out of the bottom of the sprocket area).

Hope that helps!
So after some experimentation I have given up on setting the counter and I just keep on using until I run out. I find that after I rewind the film there are times when the advance will not work properly however it takes a bit of fiddling with the shutter disengaging ring and a bit of turning of the advance before the camera regains friction.

Is the dog clutch the lever at the bottom of the camera?
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Old 02-26-2011   #102
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So after some experimentation I have given up on setting the counter and I just keep on using until I run out. I find that after I rewind the film there are times when the advance will not work properly however it takes a bit of fiddling with the shutter disengaging ring and a bit of turning of the advance before the camera regains friction.

Is the dog clutch the lever at the bottom of the camera?
The dog clutch is inside the sprocket assembly, at the top of it. It's not easy to get to without a total stripdown, unfortunately
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Zorki: 1e (x2), 2C, 3M, 4, 4K, 5, 6
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Leica IIIC
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Old 03-02-2011   #103
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Just my luck, now I have a problem that really can't be ignored, I think something must have bumped the rangefinder in my bag because now it does not focus properly. I was just wondering should I do the infinity adjustment first or the close distance first or does it not really matter what order I do it in?
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Old 03-06-2011   #104
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Just my luck, now I have a problem that really can't be ignored, I think something must have bumped the rangefinder in my bag because now it does not focus properly. I was just wondering should I do the infinity adjustment first or the close distance first or does it not really matter what order I do it in?
I'd set the infinity first but don't be too fussy because the close-up affects the infinity and vice-versa. You have to, kind of, refine the accuracy at each end of the scale in stages until both ends are correct.

If you've bumped it out of alignment, it's anyone's guess as to what part moved but it just might be the RF sensor tip.
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Zorki: 1e (x2), 2C, 3M, 4, 4K, 5, 6
FED: NKVD, 1g, 2e, 3a, 3b, 4L (x2), 5B, 5C
Kiev 4, 4A
Leica IIIC
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Minolta XG-M, XD-5, Z1
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Zorki 4 2nd curtain doesn't move
Old 10-12-2011   #105
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Zorki 4 2nd curtain doesn't move

I got hold of a Zorki 4 with a shutter problem: the second curtain doesn't move. To my delight I found this thread with the excellent description how to dismantle the camera. This gave me the confidence to have a go at a repair.

I got as far as part 2, refitting the slow speed mechanism up to: " If anything fouls up, STOP and ascertain why, DON'T continue to wind!". Repeated the re-assembly several times, paying careful attention not to trap the 2nd curtain closing lever under the cam of the slow speed mechanism: same thing every time: can only wind about 20% of the way. (Btw, if I manually operate the 2nd curtain closing lever, the curtain does move OK).

Any suggestions?
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Old 10-15-2011   #106
Ron (Netherlands)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jab View Post
I got hold of a Zorki 4 with a shutter problem: the second curtain doesn't move. To my delight I found this thread with the excellent description how to dismantle the camera. This gave me the confidence to have a go at a repair.

I got as far as part 2, refitting the slow speed mechanism up to: " If anything fouls up, STOP and ascertain why, DON'T continue to wind!". Repeated the re-assembly several times, paying careful attention not to trap the 2nd curtain closing lever under the cam of the slow speed mechanism: same thing every time: can only wind about 20% of the way. (Btw, if I manually operate the 2nd curtain closing lever, the curtain does move OK).

Any suggestions?
It might be easier when the shutter is cocked and the speed is set at 1/125 sec

did you rewind the slowspeed mechanism about 2 1/2 times counter clockwise before reinstalling?

I'm just working on two 4K's and putting back the slow speed mechanism is really the easiest part
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Last edited by Ron (Netherlands) : 10-15-2011 at 05:20.
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Old 02-25-2012   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jab View Post
I got hold of a Zorki 4 with a shutter problem: the second curtain doesn't move. To my delight I found this thread with the excellent description how to dismantle the camera. This gave me the confidence to have a go at a repair.

I got as far as part 2, refitting the slow speed mechanism up to: " If anything fouls up, STOP and ascertain why, DON'T continue to wind!". Repeated the re-assembly several times, paying careful attention not to trap the 2nd curtain closing lever under the cam of the slow speed mechanism: same thing every time: can only wind about 20% of the way. (Btw, if I manually operate the 2nd curtain closing lever, the curtain does move OK).

Any suggestions?
Please post a photo of your escapement. It is most suffering from a wrong engagement position beteween the O ring and the cam driving cog wheel. Take a VERY close look at the wonderful photos at the beginning.
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Old 12-18-2012   #108
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Great guide for CLA, might attempt it one day. However, before completely disassembling the camera, I would like to ask one question. When I look into the viewfinder, the RF patch is way off to the right. It makes focusing annoying, as I have to tilt the camera away from the subject. The alignment however is perfectly fine at both infinity and 1 m. Is this a fixable problem, or just one of the design quirks of the Zorki 4k? Thank you.
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Old 12-22-2012   #109
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Originally Posted by julspeter View Post
Great guide for CLA, might attempt it one day. However, before completely disassembling the camera, I would like to ask one question. When I look into the viewfinder, the RF patch is way off to the right. It makes focusing annoying, as I have to tilt the camera away from the subject. The alignment however is perfectly fine at both infinity and 1 m. Is this a fixable problem, or just one of the design quirks of the Zorki 4k? Thank you.
It should not be off to the right, it should be pretty much central. However, I really can't see how this can be wrong unless the two prisms of the VF block are misaligned - if they are, you will not be able to do anything about it because they're cemented together.

Sorry for the slow reply, I only just noticed this question.
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Old 06-25-2013   #110
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Any idea where the pdf version went? All the links fail.
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Old 06-27-2013   #111
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Any idea where the pdf version went? All the links fail.
The sticky is quite old, I presume the PDF version links have been lost over time. I don't think I even have a copy of it now, not that is was my creation to start with.
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Old 02-22-2014   #112
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Since it seemed quite hard to get a new blade spring for my Z4K (the ones from the Z4 don't fit) and mine had a broken pin - I made one myself from blade material. Guess what, it works!
The blade material I used came from an old floppy-diskette housing (see last pic).



Here is how it works (old spring on top of the new one):


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Old 08-29-2014   #113
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Hi ! Can't find the PDF for download??
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Old 08-31-2014   #114
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Thanks Wolves3012, very informative, pity the pdf has disappeared !! Striped it down to the shutter cage then bottled it !! In the process of the rebuild now, will let you know how it goes !!
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Old 09-23-2014   #115
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I just picked up a Zorki 4 (not K) from ebay for my own amusement.
It's in very good condition and from the serial number, appears to have been manufactured in 1967.

This is a very interesting thread, and using it as a guide I will probably at least partly strip the camera to clean and lubricate it.
The camera was advertised as working and the shutter and aperture diaphragm seem to work OK.

It does, however, have a couple of problems.
First, the self timer appears to be stuck "on" (i.e. in the down position), and nothing I do seems to want to release it.
It may be operator error, but how do I release it? The shutter fires OK normally, without any delay, it's just that I cannot reset the self timer lever.

The other thing is that the focus ring on the Jupiter 8 lens is really stiff, in fact the lens unscrews from the body as you try to focus.
I read the Jupiter 8 overhaul instructions and the two halves of the lens should simply unscrew, but they are so tight I'm afraid of damaging something in my efforts to unscrew the lens barrel.
I noticed that a couple of people suggest warming the lens to make it easier to unscrew, but what is the safest way to do this, and how warm does it need to be?

Thanks in advance for any help,
Regards
Brian
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Old 09-23-2014   #116
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Welcome to RFF. I am not an expert but I know a little about this. the Zorki 4 can be a fine camera. I think the self timer is supposed to be down and it has to be wound to the up position to work. Also, the Jupiter 8 is usually a fine lens and not too hard to service. Try putting it in an oven at the very lowest setting with the door left open a little. Check it often to see how it heats up. Rubber gloves might give you a better grip on it. Good Luck. Joe
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Old 09-26-2014   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian G View Post
First, the self timer appears to be stuck "on" (i.e. in the down position), and nothing I do seems to want to release it.
It may be operator error, but how do I release it? The shutter fires OK normally, without any delay, it's just that I cannot reset the self timer lever.
If it is indeed cocked, it should be released by pressing the small silver button which is just above the self timer lever on the camera front. The self timer is not being released by pressing the shutter release button on top, even if everything works correct. This is different from most other cameras...

Normal procedure would be to cock the shutter, then cock the self timer, then press the small self timer release button on front. Self timer will run and trip the shutter after a couple of seconds.

But you can also cock the self timer before the shutter, no problem. And you can release the shutter without using the already cocked self timer using normal shutter release button on top, also no problem. The self timer mechanism is fairly independent from the rest.

Normal position for the self timer lever on Zorki cameras is pointing up while not cocked. On FED cameras, it's usually pointing down in uncocked position. This is how they left the factory (and how the cases are designed). But on both FEDs and Zorkis, the lever can easily be mounted either way, so the lever pointing down on your Zorki does not necessarily mean it's actually cocked.

If you can push the lever anti-clockwise, you are cocking it. If you can't, it will be cocked already. Try pushing the lever anti-clockwise and also pressing the button on top of the self timer lever, then you will see (if it works). If you can't push the lever without force, it's cocked already. If it is cocked and does not release with the small button, probably the release mechanism is not properly adjusted. This happens quite frequently, unfortunately. The release mechanism for the self timer is rather primitive, but not particularly reliable...
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Old 09-27-2014   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Livesteamer View Post
Welcome to RFF. I am not an expert but I know a little about this. the Zorki 4 can be a fine camera. I think the self timer is supposed to be down and it has to be wound to the up position to work. Also, the Jupiter 8 is usually a fine lens and not too hard to service. Try putting it in an oven at the very lowest setting with the door left open a little. Check it often to see how it heats up. Rubber gloves might give you a better grip on it. Good Luck. Joe
Thank you both for the replies.
For self timer issue see below.

I'll try gently warming the lens and then try and unscrew it, since the really stiff focus ring is an issue which needs to be fixed.

Regarding the self timer;
I jiggled the timer lever a little and the self timer has now started working OK.
Set by pushing it anti-clockwise and release using the silver button on the front.
I guess it may have been a bit sticky through lack of use, but it now seems to be OK, not that I'm likely to use it myself.
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Old 10-01-2014   #119
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As a follow up,

I tried the lens in an oven for a while and got it as hot as I thought was safe.
I couldn't touch it with bare hands, had to use a cloth.
I tried unscrewing the two halves, twisting as hard as I could, but it would not move.
I was afraid of damaging it if I went any further.

The bad news is, the heating and cooling has made the focus ring even stiffer than before.
Before I could turn it a little, but now I cannot turn it at all.
I'm guessing the stiffness is due to old grease which has gone hard and the heating has softened it and it's run into some place it wasn't previously.
Can I undo any of the small screws to get anything apart?
I have some jewellers screwdrivers.
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Old 10-01-2014   #120
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Can I undo any of the small screws to get anything apart?
Undoing any of the small grub screws will not take the lens apart. But you should be able to access a part of the helicoid once the focus ring and the aluminium cover beneath are removed (which you should be able to remove when the small grub screws are taken away).

Be careful not to lose them - and when re-assembling, be very careful not to over-tighten them. The threads for these screws in the aluminium parts are soft like warm butter...

Get yourself some wooden toothpicks, lighter fluid and cotton swabs.

Once you removed the outer parts, try to scratch off as much of the old grease from the accessible part of the helicoid using a toothpick.

When done, put a drop of lighter fluid as close to the point where the outer and inner helicoid parts meet and let it seep into the threads for a while. This should soften the old grease a bit and hopefully you'll be able to move again.

If so, move focus thread a couple of times, take off residue of old grease from accessible helicoid threads with toothpicks and cotton swabs. Repeat procedure a couple of times; maybe you'll need another drop or two of lighter fluid.

Slowly, but surely you should be able to get out most of the old grease this way without disassembling the helicoid. When the focus threads move freely, let the lens alone for a while so that the rest of the lighter fluid can evaporate completely. If lens gets stiff again, go on with above procedure.

If it stays free, re-grease with some acid-free, non-bleeding grease. Work fresh grease into the threads by putting some on the threads and then moving focus threads a couple of times. Don't take too much grease for this - you need very little. Just use enough that focus moves smoothly. If you take too much grease, or grease has too high viscosity, focus ring will not move easily and you might again screw off the lens from the body while focusing.
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