m9 vs m6
Old 2 Weeks Ago   #1
hrryxgg
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m9 vs m6

i love my m6. i enjoy shooting it.

i do not love having to cart film around; the cost of processing; etc.

i bought a fuji xpro2. i find the menu systems and settings really confusing and makes me appreciate the simplicity of the m6.

does the m9 replicate that simplicity?

what do folks think about images from m6 film vs m9?

can you easily download m9 images to your desktop? is there a need for some kind of conversion? or can you simply plug it into the laptop and download (i use apple, so like the photos applicaton)?

thoughts please? thank you
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #2
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I would first get a less costly digital camera to see if you like digital images or not.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #3
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The M9 is a lovely camera

Easy to use... just like a Film M
Simple Menu ...
Post processing really depends on which system you buy into
when I had an M8 M-E I used lightroom and really did very little PP

Raid does bring up a Good point... is Digi the way to go for you
if you were happy with the Xpro re: overall digital imagery , then go for it
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #4
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I have an M6 and an M9. The M9 is very easy to use, as Helen has said. For film, I love using the M6. For digital, I love using the M9. Apples and Oranges?
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #5
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M6 is not so different from any film M.
M9 is very different. You could get clean bw at ISO 2500.
Color is great at ISO 400, not so much grain.

You have to connect camera or card to computer to get pictures. If they are in JPEG1 nothing else is needed.

M9 is good aid to film photographer who can't handle film in large quantities. Menus are almost none!
BW is not as good as with film, color is fne. Lots of details on macro level are visible if exposure was taken with low ISO. Rendering is special, but sometimes feels outdated.
To me it is great camera for bright day and saturated colors or it is great bw camera at ISO higher than film ISO.
M9 batteries have very small capacity, yet they are terribly expensive. Under freezing temperatures the camera will eat batteries quick.
It is also slower camera. Shutter lag is present. M6 had none.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hrryxgg View Post
i love my m6. i enjoy shooting it.

i do not love having to cart film around; the cost of processing; etc.

i bought a fuji xpro2. i find the menu systems and settings really confusing and makes me appreciate the simplicity of the m6.

does the m9 replicate that simplicity?

thoughts please? thank you
I shoot both film and digital and from what I read the M9 is not a particularly adept digicam.

I don't think that digital can ever replace film. As you have noted one of the advantages of film is its simplicity; another is having fun with development; a third is the look different films give you. I realise that the company you chose - Fuji - has made it its business to copy b&w film styles, but even so they cannot really replace the look of film. Imitation is idiotic and unnecessary. Digital has other advantages: shoot semi-automatic and it is very useful for working fast; play around with HDR; and enjoy the convenience of zoom lenses.

Keep your M6 and acquire a mirrorless camera that is less demanding than the X-PRO 2 - something like an Olympus E-M5 Mark II with the 12-40 f/2.8 zoom lens. Just my opinion and advice . . .
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #7
David Hughes
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But the M9 feels very heavy to me. It might be worth looking at the weights if hauling it (and film) around is a problem. Also, I sometimes think the M9 is not very forgiving, for want of a better word.

Regards, David
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Hughes View Post
But the M9 feels very heavy to me. It might be worth looking at the weights if hauling it (and film) around is a problem. Also, I sometimes think the M9 is not very forgiving, for want of a better word.

Regards, David
M-E with Summarit-M 35 , battery and neck stripe is 831 gm.
M3 with Rigid 50 and film is 890 gm.
Both lenses with hoods and filters.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raid View Post
I would first get a less costly digital camera to see if you like digital images or not.
raid I think you are missing his question. he mainly wants to know if the M9's menu is simple to use. Is the M9 digitally as simple to use as his film M6.

Wish I had an M9 or better yet for me an M6 to answer his question.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #10
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I hardly ever need the menu on my XPro1. Like all my cameras, I shoot it in the same manner as an old A priority, AF camera. I have no use for any of the auto and preset features, I have programed the Fn button for iso, I will use the AF button to prefocus when I am using Manual focus but that's pretty rare. Treat it like an old camera or even your M6 and you will love it. Auto focus is best when you use the smallest focus square, and Spot Meter for AE and life will be good.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #11
hrryxgg
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actually, i have the xpro1. sorry.

can you be more specific about how you are using yours? this sounds exactly like what i would like to replicate.

thanks!
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #12
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and where is logtown?
i live in SF.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
The M9 is a lovely camera

Easy to use... just like a Film M
Simple Menu ...
Post processing really depends on which system you buy into
when I had an M8 M-E I used lightroom and really did very little PP

Raid does bring up a Good point... is Digi the way to go for you
if you were happy with the Xpro re: overall digital imagery , then go for it
Quote:
Originally Posted by raid View Post
I have an M6 and an M9. The M9 is very easy to use, as Helen has said. For film, I love using the M6. For digital, I love using the M9. Apples and Oranges?
I agree: my M9 is a lot closer to shooting a film Leica than your typical digital camera is. I haven't used the Xpro, so can't comment specifically. But for me, the two cameras closest to shooting with a film Leica are the M9 and my Fuji X100. The viewfinder in the latter is just fantastic! It's a lot like shooting with a film Leica except for its fixed 35mm focal length. The M9's menu system is simple and intuitive. I like it a lot. On a recent trip I took only an M7 and M9. I left the Nikon D700 and the rest of my digital gear home. Well, I did bring the Fuji X20. That's another camera I can recommend. Small, almost pocket size, and easy to use!

But let me assure you, I find the M9 easy and relaxing to use. No worries.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #14
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The M262 is vey much like shooting an M6, just without all the film changes, to the point I do not use my M6 (or M4) as much as I should. Love the colors and the raw file quality. The M9 works great to ISO 800 or so for color, but I take the M262 to ISO 3200 easily as needed with the f2 primes and the quality is awesome.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #15
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I think the advice to simplify your use of the Fuji you already have is good advice. Had I not bought an M9 in 2012 I was going to get the X-Pro 1. But that was an uncertain route, likely leading to a whole new stable of lenses, and worse, a camera body upgrade cycle. Once the M240 came out, which was heavier and less pretty, I was happy to go with the M9 for which I already had more than enough lenses. And with my M2 (and M6 and others) still in use and already accepting the inevitability of M9 successors I would not need, I was happy. The worst of the M9 is no advance lever to hang onto, and the thickness of the body when carrying it.

The metering is sort of the same as the M6, except you can't be as slack as you can be with the M6 and colour negative film, choosing a one or two stop dimmer area to lock exposure and get a good result. Think slides not colour negative. The 50 frame lines are awful and include much more than the M6 frame lines. You get used to that and the files are detailed enough to bear a little cropping.

Don't worry about digital. Get Lightroom and shoot DNG (raw) or even just jpegs if you want. With the DNG I will sharpen slightly, raise shadows, tweak exposure slightly, apply a subtle vignette and correct distortion of verticals. It's easy and quick and black and white jpegs are very nice. You can still adjust them too, but you don't have to do anything. I remember my first download of digital raw files. Bingo! Recognizable images. I was prepared for the shock of 110001010011111 but I needn't have worried.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #16
Duane Pandorf
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Whether you go with the M9 or another digital camera, the time you spent learning to properly develop your film won't be much differently than the time you will need to spend learning whatever software program you choose to "process" your digital files.

I don't think you will find a simpler digital camera than the M9. The beauty of digital is you can adjust the ISO and White Balance between shots vice having to shoot your entire roll of film to use a different film type or slower/faster ISO film.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #17
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I have both, the M6 is very similar to the M9 except that it is digital. The menus are very easy and simple to follow. I love my M9 and refused to move to the Ms that followed. Instead, I went back to the M3, M2, M5, and M6. Before Leica, I almost buy a FujiXpro-1, it has AF and looked like the Leicas. I read a review in Leica Rumors that said that the Xpro-2 is a copy (or try to copy) of the Leica M. Not sure.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #18
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M8 and M9 have a usb port to connect to a computer. Lost for some reason on later models.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hrryxgg View Post
i bought a fuji xpro2. i find the menu systems and settings really confusing and makes me appreciate the simplicity of the m6.
I own the Leica M6 and the Fuji X-Pro1. I also find the X-Pro1 menu systems and settings confusing. However, compared to the M6, all five of the digital cameras I have owned have had confusing menus and settings. That is just the nature of the beast.


Leica M6 & Fuji X-Pro1 by Narsuitus, on Flickr
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #20
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I still have an M9 and don'y worry about the high ISO 1600 is fine and all my lenses are quite fast you've already got the fuji for high ISO anyway, even if you went for a newer M I would be surprised if they are any better high ISO wise. On the other hand if i didn't have a lot invested in Leica lenses I would probably just get myself a xpro 1 or 2 with the smalllest prime.
For the price of a secondhand M9 you could have a lot of fun with quite a few fuji lenses!
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #21
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While I was able to set my Fujifilm cameras up for simplified use. I used the X-Pro 1 as I used my Zeiss Ikon M. I now use my X100T as I used my Canonet QL-17.

I suspect the M9 requires less (actually no) effort to use as you used your M6.

Personally I believe native use of one's M lenses is the most important factor when deciding between a Fujifilm and the M9. M lenses work well on the Fujifilm, but focusing on the M9 seems as though it would more natural.

The X-Pro 2 has a significantly higher signal-to-noise ratio and analog dynamic range.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
M-E with Summarit-M 35 , battery and neck stripe is 831 gm.
M3 with Rigid 50 and film is 890 gm.
Both lenses with hoods and filters.
Hi,

I'm not saying you're wrong but it still feels heavier to me. OTOH, it could be that I worry more about the M9 and project that fear on to the camera's weight...

Regards, David
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narsuitus View Post
I own the Leica M6 and the Fuji X-Pro1. I also find the X-Pro1 menu systems and settings confusing. However, compared to the M6, all five of the digital cameras I have owned have had confusing menus and settings. That is just the nature of the beast.


Leica M6 & Fuji X-Pro1 by Narsuitus, on Flickr
I own an M6, M9, and X Pro2... When people complain about menus, to me set it to RAW and auto WB and shoot away us Aperture Priority and use the exposure compensation.. never worry about menus I treat it pretty much like my M6 just as simple.. Don't over complicate it, just shoot man!
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #24
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Originally Posted by pepeguitarra View Post
I have both, the M6 is very similar to the M9 except that it is digital. The menus are very easy and simple to follow. I love my M9 and refused to move to the Ms that followed. Instead, I went back to the M3, M2, M5, and M6. Before Leica, I almost buy a FujiXpro-1, it has AF and looked like the Leicas. I read a review in Leica Rumors that said that the Xpro-2 is a copy (or try to copy) of the Leica M. Not sure.
Exactly. If you can afford M9 and are curious, try one. Cheaper digital cameras are a waste of time if you want something very similar to M6.

M8 is good if you are on a tighter budget.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #25
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Originally Posted by gb hill View Post
raid I think you are missing his question. he mainly wants to know if the M9's menu is simple to use. Is the M9 digitally as simple to use as his film M6.

Wish I had an M9 or better yet for me an M6 to answer his question.
The M9 is simple to use.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronald M View Post
M8 and M9 have a usb port to connect to a computer. Lost for some reason on later models.
Correct, I still have the cables in the bag.
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Hughes View Post
Hi,

I'm not saying you're wrong but it still feels heavier to me. OTOH, it could be that I worry more about the M9 and project that fear on to the camera's weight...

Regards, David
Heavier in terms of the charge on the pocket?
I have this every time I'm thinking of taking m-e out for street, candid.
Why I need 3K usd camera if M4-2 will handle this better?
Thinking of adding second m-e or getting m8 for it...
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 35photo View Post
I own an M6, M9, and X Pro2... When people complain about menus, to me set it to RAW and auto WB and shoot away us Aperture Priority and use the exposure compensation.. never worry about menus I treat it pretty much like my M6 just as simple.. Don't over complicate it, just shoot man!
Being you already invested in the Xpro2 I would replicate simplicity as much as you can. By setting up auto WB, 3 ISO options, pre selecting B&W with raw and choice of metering and working either in A or S mode, you rarely would need to go in to the menus just like your M6 and keep it simple as mentioned above. Force your self to use the XP2 with one lens and forget your M6 for awhile and you will be OK......
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narsuitus View Post
I own the Leica M6 and the Fuji X-Pro1. I also find the X-Pro1 menu systems and settings confusing. However, compared to the M6, all five of the digital cameras I have owned have had confusing menus and settings. That is just the nature of the beast.
Would you say the X-Pro1 is similar to the X10/X20/X100 menus, or very different from them? I have these, and find them reasonably easy to use. Two of my cameras that have menus that challenge me at times are my D700 camera and Leica D-Lux 6. The latter can leave me dumbfounded at times!
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #31
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The Fujis and the digital Ms are SUPERFICIALLY similar in that the SS and aperture can be set by use of dedicated dials.

The Fuji gets more complicated by needing to access the menu (or a function button) for things like metering and continuous shooting and the self timer

Both cameras will need you looking at a screen to select ISO (this can actually be done in the OVF on the fuji, but same difference and I digress)

For my OPINION the M9 is more simple than the X-Pro1 but the fuji is not so complicated that a little time playing with it won't enable one to familiarise themselves with it (the x-pro2 is a different story having many more features)


One area a film shooter will find themselves in a whole new world (no matter which camera) is the act of transferring to and editing of digital negatives on their computer

This is a area that has many opinions and thousands of words written about the best workflow, image editor etc etc

Although 'straight out of the camera jpegs' aren't the abomination and insult to the craft of photography that some would have you believe, the fact remains that shooting raw (which is dng on Leica and proprietary raf on the fujis) offers one more ability to correct, polish and modify the end result. This has several advantages over camera derived jpegs, more lattitude in exposure recovery, white balance modification and prep for print to name three

To go digital, be it raw or camera derived jpeg, there's no real meaningful* way around the fact that you'll need to be comfortable with transferring the images from the SD card to the computer.

To edit raw, it's necessary to have a raw convertor software, there are many different brands offering this type of software, the majority enabling you to try before you buy with a free trial period

There's many reasons to recommend a X-Pro1 over a m9 / there's many reasons to recommend a m9 over a x-pro1

For what it's worth... if the funds permit.. such decisions are often best taken with the heart

However, if one is entirely uncomfortable with the notion of transferring, editing, storing and printing digital images then (in my opinion) no digital camera will give one the satisfaction of working with film (with the proviso of course that one is comfortable doing this with film)

*one could of course pop the SD card into one of those instant print self service machines you find in malls, but personally I don't consider this to be a meaningful solution. Others mileage may vary...
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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #32
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Film - expensive; you pay someone else to process/interpret your negatives, unless, of course, if you develop & scan on your own
Digital - cheap; but you got to do everything yourself, unless you pay and develop your own processing presets

If you already have a Fuji, I say you stick with it. That way you get the pure Leica film experience and the robust Fuji digital experience. Best of both worlds.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #33
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These are my two cameras: M6 and M9. They are so good I have no desire to buy anything else. The M9 is just like a film M. Not good in high ISO and I don't see the pictures after I've taken them, yes the rear LCD is that bad - I use it only for settings anyway so no biggie. The only film M closer to the M9 i feel might be the M7 because of the A mode and the shuter speed dial that turns the same way of the M9. But since I have no interest in the M7 because all of its eletronics, M6 is the closest it gets to me to have no problems in handling - wether shooting film or digital. Go for it!


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Old 1 Week Ago   #34
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If you want a M6 in digital form, there is the M-D. No screen, no menus, no endless settings to make, just photography.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #35
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Hi,

Can't comment on the Fuji but I've noticed that - in the long term - I've sold all my complicated cameras, as the system's menus* get in the way, and kept the straight forward ones. Even to the point where I still have and use an elderly Leica Digilux 2, which is 5 megapixels and ought to be scrapped according to some...

So my votes for the M series.

Regards, David

* Why do they shove so much into the menus? Lots of film cameras survived and became classics with just the simplest of controls (Olympus XA or Konica A4 or Leica mini) or hardly any (Olympus mju's). A simple P&S digital with a decent prime lens would be great and please don't tell me there's one as I can't afford it.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #36
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Quote:
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* Why do they shove so much into the menus? .
Because the present-day consumer demands it all. If they simplify their menus they will get hammered on the Internet for "leaving out the essential <insert the pet hobbyhorse of poster> "or īdiotical implementation of <insert mini-niche wish of poster>"
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Old 1 Week Ago   #37
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The reason I shoot an M9 privately is mainly its simplicity. The menus are clear and there is a sensible amount of buttons.

I had a Sony A7S for a while, but every time I used it and had to adjust anything I felt a strong urge to smash the thing to bits...
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Old 1 Week Ago   #38
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and where is logtown?
i live in SF.
Logtown is a very small community just south of Placerville on Hwy 49.

Lately I've been using my XP1 for general photography. I have an 18-55 lens on it and I have it in Aperture Priority mode with the ISO set on Auto. I keep the WB on daylight as it gets fooled a lot on Auto. I also like the odd light that you get using the daylight setting at night. I have the AF on spot as well as the metering. There's a way to change the size of the AF area and I have it on the smallest, I focus and meter on what I want to capture and then recompose while holding down the half shutter position. There is a setting that lets you use the AF lock button for that but I've done it my way for so long that I don't seem to be able to adjust. I shoot in RAW/jpeg fine and set the color at B&W to see the image in BW but have the option for color with the RAW file. This takes up a lot more space on your card but I'm not a machine gunner so it's not been a problem. Hope this is some help. Steve
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Old 1 Week Ago   #39
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Posts: 516
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob-F View Post
Would you say the X-Pro1 is similar to the X10/X20/X100 menus, or very different from them?
I have never used the Fuji X10/X20/X100 so cannot comment on them. I have, however, used the menus on the Fuji S5, Canon G5/G11/G15, Olympus E-p1/E-p3, Hewlett Packard Photosmart M425, and the Vivitar Vivicam 3615.

My biggest problem with all of them is that I must put my glasses on to see the tiny menu. On the other hand, if I had to, I could use my Leica M6 with my eyes closed.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #40
narsuitus
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narsuitus is offline
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 516
Quote:
Originally Posted by 35photo View Post
... never worry about menus I treat it pretty much like my M6 just as simple...
Believe me, I try to ignore the menus. However, some digital cameras force me to go deep into the menu to perform simple tasks such as:

ˇ using the self timer
ˇ performing bracketing
ˇ telling the camera which lens I have mounted
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