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CSC : Digital Compact System Cameras - This new category of digital Compact System Cameras with interchangeable lenses was mislabeled for a time as "Mirrorless Cameras" by those forgetting about "Mirrorless" Rangefinder cameras.  Such confusion is easily understandable, since interchangeable rangefinder cameras were only recently introduced in 1932.  hmm.    CSC or Compact System Camera is probably the best category description to date, although I am fond of the old RFF desigation of  CEVIL  indicating Compact Electronic Viewfidner Interchangeable Lens.   This forum is here at RFF because via adapters these cameras offer an inexpensive way to use rangefinder lenses on digital cameras -- in addition of just about every 35mm SLR lens you can think of.  All  offer the photo enthusiast an incredible array of adopted lenses which was not possible before these new digital formats.   This group continues to grow in popularity and new camera models! 

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An interchangeable lens version of the Leica Q... October?
Old 08-26-2015   #1
jsrockit
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An interchangeable lens version of the Leica Q... October?

Rumor Here:

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/comi...lus-in-october
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Old 08-26-2015   #2
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totally applaud leica for thinking outside the box. totally dont understand leica if indeed this is not compatible with with their singular indisputable legacy, M lenses.
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Old 08-26-2015   #3
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I can't imagine that it will not be compatible in some form. It just won't be perfectly compatible.
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Old 08-26-2015   #4
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Just re-doing the Fuji X100-X-Pro1 roll-out model. Worked for fuji, why not leica?
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Old 08-26-2015   #5
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Leica marketers are not "dumm".
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Old 08-26-2015   #6
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Originally Posted by jsrockit View Post
Beautiful camera, but even Leica does not quite know what to make of it. Why it might be compelling to own @ 7k.

They show a gallery that looks like iPhone images. http://us.leica-camera.com/Photograp...LEICA-Q/Images
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Old 08-26-2015   #7
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I still have this fantasy that someone will make an AF digital camera that works with my pre-digital Nikon and Leica lenses, by moving the sensor instead of the lens to focus. Maybe Sony should tackle this problem and price the result in the neighborhood of this new Leica offering as a direct competitor, name it something like Sony LQ and put a big red dot on it. :-) For an extra $4K or so per camera one would think that this could be accomplished, and they almost have the necessary reputation to make the strategy work.
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Old 08-26-2015   #8
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Leica is moving on, as is life. The question is: what is going to distinguish them from other camera makers? Hopefully the quality of the glass and intelligent design. They cannot compete in sensors and electronics.
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Old 08-26-2015   #9
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Must be the same camera as

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/foru...d.php?t=150442

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Originally Posted by mfogiel View Post
Hopefully the quality of the glass and intelligent design. They cannot compete in sensors and electronics.
As the Q demonstrates, you are doing a mistake looking at sensor/electronics and optics separately. Plus, when it came out, the m240 sensor was state of the art.

Roland.
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Old 08-26-2015   #10
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Yawn......
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Old 08-26-2015   #11
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Yawn......
Glad you loved it that much sir.
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Old 08-26-2015   #12
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Quote:
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Should be a hit on Leica Fotopark.
At first I thought you were kidding, but no. If anyone wants to see embarrassing -- https://www.leica-fotopark.com/de/di...gories/FASHION

By the way, George, your work is well worth a look by anyone who has not already visited!
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Old 08-26-2015   #13
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totally applaud leica for thinking outside the box.
A camera with autofocus? Wow that's thinking out of the box!!!
Still I hope they do well, it is one if not THE last great classical brand and I would be sad if they disappear.

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Old 08-26-2015   #14
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A camera with autofocus? Wow that's thinking out of the box!!!
It is for a company that stuck with the M for as long as it has...
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Old 08-26-2015   #15
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At first I thought you were kidding, but no. If anyone wants to see embarrassing -- https://www.leica-fotopark.com/de/di...gories/FASHION
Yikes! That is embarrassingly reminiscent of 1980's camera club "open entry" contests. Who authorized that? Or has Leica suddenly grown self ironic?
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Old 08-26-2015   #16
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Leica marketers are not "dumm".
Yea, plenty of people with money in this world they are after.

"...bulkier than the Q or M lines, with an EVF... 50 mm f/2 Summicron lens and retail around $8,000 USD"...

I don't know, maybe it is APO Cron.
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Old 08-26-2015   #17
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Just re-doing the Fuji X100-X-Pro1 roll-out model. Worked for fuji, why not leica?
Price possibly?
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Old 08-26-2015   #18
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All the hot selling Japanese cameras are getting smaller, lighter and more featured. Bulkier??
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Old 08-26-2015   #19
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This probably kills any future fixed lens models beyond the 28mm Q.
That's a bummer. A leaf shutter 35cron or better still 40 or 50mm Suumicron fixed lens Q model would be fantastic.
I have my first $500 put into the piggy for that camera.
Really thought it might happen.
This is going to kill it!
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Old 08-26-2015   #20
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8 K $ ? Hmmm, ok lens included but the ones who already have M lenses? Hmmm, I'm confused...but still interesting to see Leica moving in new directions they didn't consider until a short time ago. Personally not so interested in this price level if I need to buy new lenses...
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Old 08-26-2015   #21
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8 K $ ? Hmmm, ok lens included but the ones who already have M lenses?
They buy a M body...

$8k just is going to be way too much for me.
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Old 08-26-2015   #22
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Many years ago, Leica was selling a lens with a free new VW car included!
$8000 (here) is "Leica Cheap" ... the new adjective on the market.
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Old 08-26-2015   #23
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If true, its good to see Leica adding to their camera lineup.
Time will tell how it works out.

Stephen
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Old 08-26-2015   #24
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It is for a company that stuck with the M for as long as it has...
It was a joke... Nevertheless, even if a company sticks with some classical product line forever (they probably will still produce M cameras for quite some time), this doesn't make a camera with an already old and perfected technology in it "thinking out of the box".

GLF
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Old 08-26-2015   #25
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As always, I look forward to seeing what Leica introduces.

I have learned never to say "I'll never buy one" because I've had to eat those words too often, but for the moment I'm quite content with my M-P, M4-2, and M-mount lens kit, X, etc, so my interest will be curiosity rather than actually considering for purchase.

That's the real problem. Leica already has such excellent gear in their users' hands that new products generally mean exploring/finding new markets.

G
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Old 08-26-2015   #26
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totally applaud leica for thinking outside the box. totally dont understand leica if indeed this is not compatible with with their singular indisputable legacy, M lenses.
Just a Sony A7 for photographers. The A7 series is groundbreaking, but I suspect many will pay for a more traditional approach, with a better menu system.. if any.. and eventually, a full line of excellent lenses. I think that this move is a matter of survival. The 'M' only shooter should welcome this. If done right, it will bring greater financial stability for Leica.
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Old 08-26-2015   #27
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No interest in this camera, especially with the 8K price tag. I am not sure at what price point I would be interested.

It could be the money I have already spent to own a couple of Leica digital and a couple of Leica film bodies along with the lenses is enough for me to say enough is enough.

When I need to use a auto focus camera in the meantime I will be happy to pick up the Pentax K5IIs
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Old 08-26-2015   #28
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If true, its good to see Leica adding to their camera lineup.
Time will tell how it works out.

Stephen
I think they will sell, after talking to a dealer friend. It is a beautiful camera.
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Old 08-26-2015   #29
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Jeez, remarkable with the next recession projected in a couple of years. If this is true. Has this been fact-checked?

Yet another move up into the luxury camera world.

No, it is not for the lower class I associate with and I am quite happy to stay put.
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Old 08-27-2015   #30
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Not interested in that price level, but...this make the M.type 240 more interesting.
I heard from one local dealer that he has client who bought that camera because they were told to be the "excellent camera" but they have not the experience and the desire to learn how to manual focus therefore a kind of disappointment. They will probably sell it for that new autofocus system which should make things easier for them...
Now where I live there are one year old M-type 240 at around 4 K eur with still one year warranty, maybe in a few month will become more affordable...just my free wheel thinking...
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Old 08-27-2015   #31
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I'm a bit skeptical about the price. 8K is a lot, twice the price of the Q, body only similar price to the M240 but without the complicated RF mechanism.

Also not crazy about the rumour of the SLR shape - the SLR hump has no advantage on a mirrorless other than to make the camera look more "professional" to people that don't know any better; you either get your nose against the screen or your nose against a screen and a thumb in your eye.
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Old 08-27-2015   #32
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If it was true then it's a RF less M which of course they can't call M (Messucher = Rangefinder) anymore, so they come out with a different line up the Q and then the Q+ w. interchangeable lens mount. And I highly doubt that it will be compatible with the M lenses. Is the flange to sensor distance identical?
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Old 08-27-2015   #33
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For what I have read I think this camera will be not aimed to the RF lovers (as many among us are) who probably already own M lenses but is (could be) an attempt to have a large customare basis, attracting the photographers interested in the Leica experience but not in the RF Ms.
Therefore two series, M (240 type) for RF lovers and this new model, same quality same price level I guess for the AF lovers. And the Q for simplicity lovers :-)

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Old 08-27-2015   #34
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Quote:
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And I highly doubt that it will be compatible with the M lenses. Is the flange to sensor distance identical?
If the T is compatible, then I can't see why this wouldn't be. And we don't know the flange to sensor distance yet because the camera doesn't exist.
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Old 08-27-2015   #35
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Wouldn't they just use the same flange as their T camera? Makes the most sense to me.
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Old 08-27-2015   #36
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Wouldn't they just use the same flange as their T camera? Makes the most sense to me.
That depends on if the T mount is FF compatible.
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Old 08-27-2015   #37
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Interesting rumor update... shaped like a Leicaflex?

http://petapixel.com/2015/08/26/rumo...up-its-sleeve/
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Old 08-27-2015   #38
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Interesting rumor update... shaped like a Leicaflex?
Simply upscaling the Q might make it too close to a M3 lineage design, and they probably will not want to compete with themselves, but with Sony and Fuji. Shaped like a M5 would be another option, but there are more people with a sentimental feeling towards the Leicaflex than towards the M5.
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Old 08-27-2015   #39
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... They cannot compete in sensors and electronics.
Which is a bit of a mystery to me. Toshiba and SONY provide the majority of pinned-diode sensor arrays. Leica is one of the few companies that attempts to compete. Everyone else uses similar photodiode-amplificatin and digitization technologies. The CFA and IR filter layers are a different story. These are passive optical components.

I never understood why Leica doesn't take advantage of these chip vendors. About five years ago back-side illuminated CMOS sensor technology became common. These sensor assemblies house all the most important electronic on a single chip. Expertise in electronics becomes moot. Expertise in getting the light to the sensor sites (optics) and the EVF signal processing (in the case of the Q) are relevant.
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Old 08-28-2015   #40
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Which is a bit of a mystery to me. Toshiba and SONY provide the majority of pinned-diode sensor arrays. Leica is one of the few companies that attempts to compete. Everyone else uses similar photodiode-amplificatin and digitization technologies. The CFA and IR filter layers are a different story. These are passive optical components.

I never understood why Leica doesn't take advantage of these chip vendors. About five years ago back-side illuminated CMOS sensor technology became common. These sensor assemblies house all the most important electronic on a single chip. Expertise in electronics becomes moot. Expertise in getting the light to the sensor sites (optics) and the EVF signal processing (in the case of the Q) are relevant.
For larger sensors (APS-C and up), BSI only became practical 2014 and later, while the M was released in 2012. ST Micro is also a major player in the image sensor fab market, as are Samsung and others. Newer large CMOSIS sensors (taped out at ST) have BSI as well. Also, we are talking Europe, were R&D is often co-funded by national and/or the European Governments.

To the areas of expertise that you mention (optics and EVF signal processing), I would like to add the high performance signal processing between sensor, image processor (for distortion correction, for instance) and image buffer. Most relevant for the Q and I suspect this new camera as well. Note also that Leica did pick a Japanese manufacturer for the M image processor.

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