Old 6 Days Ago   #201
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Originally Posted by SaveKodak View Post
Leica sensors make it harder to 'expose to the right', but this is actually a common and smart practice, especially when you're shooting fast. Nikon cameras have a degree of ISO invariance, so I frequently shoot 1/3rd to 1 stop down. It's not all that difference of exposing for the shadows and developing for the highlights on film, just the opposite since we're dealing with positives. Leica and Canon sensors are noisier or have been recently, making this practice difficult. But, when you can do it, it's useful and ensures a flexible file to work on in post.
I have no proof but I think that parts of the bad reputation of the Canon sensors for handling shadows comes from a massive use of ETTR. Problem is, that the camera has a jpg histogram. I tested it extensively with the 6D I had. I wanted to know how much light I can add when the histogram just started to clip and still rescue all the highlights in postprocessing. For the 6D I was able to add 1EV of light after the histogram clipped and I still had all the data in skys and clouds. When I added more light, the raw converter tried to rescue something but it didn't look good anymore.
If now people use ETTR according to the histogram they don't use a reserve on the right side and cause 1EV of problems on the left side.

With the M240 sensor you are still somewhat limited in getting lot's of EV out of the shadows. More important for me is, that I can expose normally without caring too much about blown highlights.

I personally don't understand it, why lot's of people ONLY see the shadow recovery capability when they talk about dynamic range.
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Old 6 Days Ago   #202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom.w.bn View Post
I have no proof but I think that parts of the bad reputation of the Canon sensors for handling shadows comes from a massive use of ETTR. Problem is, that the camera has a jpg histogram. I tested it extensively with the 6D I had. I wanted to know how much light I can add when the histogram just started to clip and still rescue all the highlights in postprocessing. For the 6D I was able to add 1EV of light after the histogram clipped and I still had all the data in skys and clouds. When I added more light, the raw converter tried to rescue something but it didn't look good anymore.
If now people use ETTR according to the histogram they don't use a reserve on the right side and cause 1EV of problems on the left side.

With the M240 sensor you are still somewhat limited in getting lot's of EV out of the shadows. More important for me is, that I can expose normally without caring too much about blown highlights.

I personally don't understand it, why lot's of people ONLY see the shadow recovery capability when they talk about dynamic range.
FWIW, and I probably shouldn't be quoting as what I have to say has nothing to do with Canon or Leica..

But the Fuji X range histograms are jpeg luminance based too

I wonder how many cameras are?
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Old 5 Days Ago   #203
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Old 5 Days Ago   #204
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Looks like the drive mode got moved to the menu...

https://instagram.com/p/BPIYRcnjnB3/

That'll annoy some
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Old 5 Days Ago   #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamjbonn View Post
Looks like the drive mode got moved to the menu...

https://instagram.com/p/BPIYRcnjnB3/

That'll annoy some
I use the self timer quite often from the tripod. Switching to self timer was very easy with the digital Leicas. If they put this in the menu only, then it's ok, as long as they don't copy the stupid Fuji implementation where the self timer is reset to no-self timer whenever the camera switches to standby.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #206
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Old 5 Days Ago   #207
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Originally Posted by tom.w.bn View Post
I use the self timer quite often from the tripod. Switching to self timer was very easy with the digital Leicas. If they put this in the menu only, then it's ok, as long as they don't copy the stupid Fuji implementation where the self timer is reset to no-self timer whenever the camera switches to standby.

I wonder if the self timer is a subset of the drive menu (makes sense)

I don't own a M, but I've never managed to use one, where I haven't put it into continuous mode whilst turning it on, at last once!

So maybe the power switch only does power now?

We'll find out soon enough....
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Old 5 Days Ago   #208
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Old 5 Days Ago   #209
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So is that a touch screen?
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Old 5 Days Ago   #210
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So is that a touch screen?
No, thank god.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #211
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I want one but I can't afford one. I'm feeling super alienated right now.

(sarcasm)
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Old 5 Days Ago   #212
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So how does one select menu items?
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Old 5 Days Ago   #213
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With the d-pad that the person above you photoshopped out.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #214
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Hmmm... that's helpful. I wonder what else they photoshopped in/out?
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Old 5 Days Ago   #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brennanphotoguy View Post
With the d-pad that the person above you photoshopped out.
for whatever reason he did that......
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Old 5 Days Ago   #216
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Originally Posted by olakiril View Post



it would have been funnier if you photoshopped out the screen but left the buttons.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #217
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Originally Posted by faberryman View Post
Hmmm... that's helpful. I wonder what else they photoshopped in/out?
The photoshopper is the poster here, the original image on IG has the buttons and D pad
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Old 5 Days Ago   #218
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From what's been shown, it looks to me like the M10 will replace the M.240 family.
Other than lack of video, there seems no reason to keep producing the M.240 especially if M10-P, M10-D and M10-M variants arrive.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #219
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They'll probably keep the M262 around as the "budget" or "starter" camera like they did with the M-E.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brennanphotoguy View Post
They'll probably keep the M262 around as the "budget" or "starter" camera like they did with the M-E.
M10-B(udget)?
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Old 5 Days Ago   #221
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The M-E stuck around for a while after the M240 was released. There's no reason to think they'll quit making the M262 barely a year into production.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #222
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Ouch, that's an ugly camera.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #223
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Actually, I think the camera looks very nice. Won't be getting one for a while though, so my opinion is not as important as those with the $$$.

My next M will likely be a M240. Partly because of its visoflex, but that's not important here...
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Old 5 Days Ago   #224
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Have you thought about an M 262?
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Old 5 Days Ago   #225
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I wonder if I will still be able to use my secondary hot shoe arm adapter for studio work?
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Old 4 Days Ago   #226
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom.w.bn View Post
for whatever reason he did that......
I was going for an M3 look:



All I was trying to do is to show how it could look like had they used a touchscreen following a previous post.

I know aesthetics as well as ergonomics are partly subjective but I like the second more:





If they had to place the buttons, then they did a better job with the Leica SL.

It doesn't really matter though cause I was never their target audience.
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Old 4 Days Ago   #227
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I absolutely detest the S/SL button layout haha. Different strokes. But like you said, I'm not their target market. I'm too poor.
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Old 4 Days Ago   #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brennanphotoguy View Post
I absolutely detest the S/SL button layout haha. Different strokes. But like you said, I'm not their target market. I'm too poor.
What I dislike is having dedicated buttons all over the camera that are vulnerable to pressing inadvertently, nearly unavoidable... an example of that is the Pentax 645Z. I rather like the S layout.
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Old 4 Days Ago   #229
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I like the button layout of the M240 and I also like the flexible buttons of Leica S/SL. I don't want a touchscreen only.

The more I look at the images of the M10 the more I dislike the square buttons.


Quote:
Originally Posted by olakiril View Post
I was going for an M3 look:


All I was trying to do is to show how it could look like had they used a touchscreen following a previous post.

I know aesthetics as well as ergonomics are partly subjective but I like the second more:


If they had to place the buttons, then they did a better job with the Leica SL.

It doesn't really matter though cause I was never their target audience.
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Old 4 Days Ago   #230
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Looks badass to me.
A more refined interpretation of a digital M; would also expect a substantial increase in battery runtime in 'old school mode' (no LV/no chimping).
Looking forward to the real-world user reviews along with the in-depth technical testing of this new device.
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Old 4 Days Ago   #231
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Originally Posted by redsky View Post
Ouch, that's an ugly camera.
Looks rather beautiful to me, like every other Leica M.
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Old 4 Days Ago   #232
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Originally Posted by Duane Pandorf View Post
If this is an accurate photo of the next M model it would appear to me that it won't have live view so won't do video nor need an external EVF. And since the name appears to be M10 indicates to me that the M240 was an interim model until the SL came on the scene.

Those that want or desire liveview will need to buy the Q, T or SL.
It will have live view. There is a button on the back labelled "LV".
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Old 4 Days Ago   #233
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It will have live view. There is a button on the back labelled "LV".
As stated earlier in the thread, I think that's the Louis Vuitton button, not live view...
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Old 4 Days Ago   #234
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There is also the focus/zoom button on the front that is used with live view... There is still doubt about the video though, since the movie button is gone, but it may have moved to the unmarked main switch or a menu option.
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Old 4 Days Ago   #235
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But there appear to be no holes for mic or speaker.
EVF and LV provide the electronic infrastructure anyway though, so I think it would be silly to remove the video facility, even if it cannot compete with dedicated video cameras.
I find it ii quite useful for occasional use and I am not alone. Who wants to carry a complete video system when it is not the primary purpose?

For instance I was traveling through Mozambique carrying just my M set. Sitting on the beach of Lake Nyassa suddenly this situation appeared. I was very happy to be able to record this memory, even if it does not meet professional standards. I think it enhances the purpose of an M camera as a travel companion. As an aside, video cameras do not have Summiluxes in general

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m5ckWSAzB8&t=8s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRXkRqBlBbQ
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Old 3 Days Ago   #236
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I also hope that video is included in the M10 for exactly the reasons jaapv describes. I also have used the M240 for these types of situations. And, it sure is amazing to use Leica lenses to capture the video.

But, I can always take out my iPhone, so I can live without it. But, the iPhone doesn't even come close to the quality of the M. Video will be missed by me if not included on the me M10.

It makes no sense to me to include LV and not allow the live stream to be recorded to the memory card. I'm pretty sure the firmware is included on the chip set used in the new M10, so disabling it or not including it seems more like a design restriction than a technical one.

We had this same discussion before the M240 was announced and Leica ended up including it. We can only hope Leica has buried it in the menu somewhere.

36MP through a 75 Summilux would be gorgeous!!!
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Old 3 Days Ago   #237
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Any rumors about the release date? My Leica dealer asked me yesterday if I want to pre-order one.
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Old 3 Days Ago   #238
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And you're tempted to order one of the first batch? Fortunately I have a M240 and a new M-D262 so not currently suffering GAS pains. But 36Mp would be tempting... I would not order one now or for a while due to uncertainty, as there is very little in the way of information and too much speculation and guessing for comfort. Patience would be good I think until some early glitches are addressed, surely there will be glitches! Remember the strap lugs falling off, for example I would wait until the first firmware update comes out, but that takes discipline!
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Old 3 Days Ago   #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaapv View Post

For instance I was traveling through Mozambique carrying just my M set. Sitting on the beach of Lake Nyassa suddenly this situation appeared.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m5ckWSAzB8&t=8s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRXkRqBlBbQ

That was lovely. Thank you.
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Old 3 Days Ago   #240
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are they ever going to come up with better places for the brightness sensor and video button?
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