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120 film RF Folders 120/220 Format Folding Rangefinders, including the various classic Zeiss Ikontas, Voigtlander Bessas, and their Ruskie copies.

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Pics from Perkeo II
Old 12-05-2016   #1
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Pics from Perkeo II

Its always exciting to get a new camera, but its even better when the first pics come back from it. In this case, its the new (to me) Voightlander Perkeo II from RFF Classifieds (thanks Bherman!). It came in the mail Friday, and by Saturday I had film in it. Too bad the whole weekend was murky and dark. I was ready for some crisp wintertime Sunny 16 shooting, but what I had instead was 4 to 5 stops off from there. But here's a couple samples. Just snapshots, really, to be sure it works. And I do believe it does!

All my B&W is on Ilford XP2, which of course is ASA 400. Growing up on Kodachrome 64, the extra speed might seem like a dream come true, but Sunny 16 turns out to be 1/500th at f16 or a little less than that. Most of my RF lenses have very closely-spaced f stops at the small end of their range, so its a little like splitting hairs to find the correct setting just a little bit open from f16 (try that with a Jupiter-12 sometime)! This was not the problem on this day as I was shooting around f4 at 1/500 or 1/250 instead. LOL The sunny stuff will have to wait for the next roll.

Here are a couple samples of my Perkeo test roll. In my naivete, I managed to shoot a few blanks and wound up with just 8 frames exposed on the roll, one of which was the car's dashboard and several of which were so dull and uncontrasty I won't bother posting them at all. But I was pleased with these two! I will say the camera works great and is very sharp! My experience pacing off distances in the field came into use when it came time to focus the camera. At f4 the DOF was not going to be on my side.

Of course, as soon as this roll was finished the snow came in earnest and I finished the afternoon in heavy snow showers with my Leica CL!





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Old 12-05-2016   #2
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I have a Perkeo II that I really like. I've carried it on several vacations - it's a great way to shoot MF without lugging a large camera around. I should use it more often.
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Old 12-05-2016   #3
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It is a tiny thing isn't it!

For the record, here's the weather a few hours later: (Leica CL, Jupiter-8)

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Old 12-05-2016   #4
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Like both shots. The theater looks much like the theater in the small town I grew up here in NC. Good to see they still show old movies there in your town.
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Old 12-05-2016   #5
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Very nice. Skopar lens?
Cheers
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Old 12-05-2016   #6
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You got some nice shots per the keepers. I liked the Perkeo II so much, I went and got the Vito II to accompany it.

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Old 12-06-2016   #7
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Thanks all! Yes, Skopar lens.

BTW, the white spots on the pictures are snowflakes in case anyone was wondering.
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Old 12-06-2016   #8
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Nice shots, very sharp!

Can't believe I sold an as-new Perkeo II to a fellow in Norway through here just a year ago for EUR 60... Never realised the Skopar was that good and a clean Perkeo II that hard to find... yikes.
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Old 12-06-2016   #9
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Funny, I haven't been looking at the classifieds here much recently but saw that one last week and thought- someone is going to get a nice camera! Congrats on your purchase and so cool to see these pics appear so fast

I have Perkeos 1 and 2 and while I don't use them much these days, your pics inspire me. I have been considering getting a new and faster scanner so I'd be more likely to shoot some film again. Great little camera.

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Perkeo II
Old 12-06-2016   #10
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Perkeo II

I picked up a Perkeo II myself last month, and have yet to get around to developing the rolls of FP4+ and HP5+ I ran through it. Your theatre shot tells me I've no good excuse for procrastinating!

Hope your weather picks up.

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Old 12-06-2016   #11
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They really are marvellous cameras. Congrats on the purchase and the thread!
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Old 12-20-2016   #12
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From roll #2, in the sanctuary of a huge ruined church. I come here from time to time to try out new camera equipment:

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Fast film problems you mentioned.
Old 12-21-2016   #13
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Fast film problems you mentioned.

Like you I was brought up on the 25 and 64 Asa stuff, I still shoot at around 80 Asa I recently took some 400 Asa out to Thailand. The 500th at 22/16 became an issue for me as well, so I slapped an orange or green filter on, so I could more accurately control the exposure. My Super Ikonta is like your scale, very small movement at that end of the scale. When I had her cleaned the tec told me to avoid using the 500 the speed if possible because it was a big strain on the shutter mechanism, I only shoot it at 100th or slower or use a Hasselblad instead.
Just thought I would add this bit.
Very nice lump of glass that you have there, doing lovely crisp images.
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Old 12-21-2016   #14
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It was the Perkeo 11 that lead to me buying a Fujifilm GF670. Great cameras both.
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Old 12-21-2016   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpgino View Post
...told me to avoid using the 500 the speed if possible because it was a big strain on the shutter mechanism.
Hmmm, that's interesting! I noticed on the Perkeo there's a noticeably greater resistance felt while turning the shutter speed dial from 1/250 to 500, compared to any of the speeds lower than 1/250, which I'm told is due to the additional springs or mechanisms (or something?) necessary for the faster shutter speed. Maybe I should stick to a maximum of 1/250th. I'm not sure the lens is threaded for filters.... Might be time to start looking for the old Voigtlander slip-on filters mentioned in the manual!

One thing I noticed - the film-advance and frame counter aren't necessarily the most accurate things in the world. Two rolls in and I'm only getting nine or ten shots per roll due to occasional uneven and haphazard frame spacing on the negative strip. The frame counter works by having the film roll over a roughened spindle which must turn a certain number of times to click it onto the next exposure number, but if the film slips I wind on a lot more (sometimes) than needed. I think for the next roll I'll try leaving the frame counter disengaged and wind my film based on the numbers in the red window.
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Old 12-21-2016   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete B View Post
It was the Perkeo 11 that lead to me buying a Fujifilm GF670. Great cameras both.
Pete
Sounds like its a slippery slope!
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Old 12-21-2016   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by css9450 View Post
Hmmm, that's interesting! I noticed on the Perkeo there's a noticeably greater resistance felt while turning the shutter speed dial from 1/250 to 500, compared to any of the speeds lower than 1/250, which I'm told is due to the additional springs or mechanisms (or something?) necessary for the faster shutter speed. Maybe I should stick to a maximum of 1/250th. I'm not sure the lens is threaded for filters.... Might be time to start looking for the old Voigtlander slip-on filters mentioned in the manual!

One thing I noticed - the film-advance and frame counter aren't necessarily the most accurate things in the world. Two rolls in and I'm only getting nine or ten shots per roll due to occasional uneven and haphazard frame spacing on the negative strip. The frame counter works by having the film roll over a roughened spindle which must turn a certain number of times to click it onto the next exposure number, but if the film slips I wind on a lot more (sometimes) than needed. I think for the next roll I'll try leaving the frame counter disengaged and wind my film based on the numbers in the red window.
I'm assuming your camera has a Compur shutter. The 1/500 speed on these uses a booster spring which is engaged separately, which is what creates the additional resistance. Note that you should not adjust the speeds, especially to or from 1/500, once the shutter is cocked - the booster spring may be deformed, affecting accuracy (which probably isn't great to begin with). Sticking to 1/250 isn't a bad idea; my Perkeo II has a Prontor shutter that only goes up to 1/300, so I don't really have a choice.

The frame counter can be very accurate. Mine spaces perfectly enough that I consistently get 13 non-overlapping frames. Cleanliness is the key. Pop the top plate off an clean absolutely every piece of the gear train and spacing should improve markedly.
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Old 12-21-2016   #18
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Honestly, are there any big differences between Perkeo II and Perkeo I? Image quality? Build quality? Lenses? I think both were made with either Vaskar 4.5 or Color-Skopar 3.5 lenses, right?
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Old 12-21-2016   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johannielscom View Post
Honestly, are there any big differences between Perkeo II and Perkeo I? Image quality? Build quality? Lenses? I think both were made with either Vaskar 4.5 or Color-Skopar 3.5 lenses, right?
The Perkeo II adds a frame counter and automatic spacing. That's it.
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Old 12-22-2016   #20
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Well, on Ebay I found a Voigtlander "Deep Yellow 3X" slip-on filter, which at least should get me away from 1/500th in sunny daylight. I think 3X is 1.5 stops? Come to think of it, I could probably do something similar with all my vintage lenses to get away from the f/16-f/22 range where its just a hairswidth between stops. Probably wasn't even an issue back in the day when Kodachrome was ASA 10!
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Old 12-22-2016   #21
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The Voigtlander filters are excellent quality, however the slip-on portion is quite deep and highly polished. In practice this will sometimes create weird flaring along the top edge of photos as light slips though the spaces and is reflected onto the lens. I used a rubber o-ring on the outside of the filter to cover the gaps, which solved the problem.

Filters are not the easiest to find for these. The deep yellow is good (I usually give +2 stops with it) and seems strangely the most common at the moment. I have slowly accumulated a reasonably full set of filters (some Voigtlander, some not) from all over the world, but it took years.
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Old 12-26-2016   #22
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Another from the giant abandoned church:



Next roll will be something different!
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Old 1 Week Ago   #23
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Here's a quickie train shot just to bump the thread. Perkeo II and Ilford XP2:

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Old 1 Week Ago   #24
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I have the Perkeo RF or sometimes referred to as the Perkeo III. I have many folders both German and Japanese 9 Super Ikonta IV, Konica Pearl III, Mamiya Automat II, Olympus VB, and what else?

The Perkeo is hands down my favorite. Color-Skopar 80/3.5 is the best.
Would never give it up.

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Old 1 Week Ago   #25
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Excuse my post as the Olympus model escaped me, I haven't used for such awhile: Chrome Six R IIB, with 2.8 Zuiko.
I guess I shouldn't forget the Minesix 66 and the Certo Six. Never have gotten one of the perennial favorites, the Agfa Super Isolettes... but I guess you can't have them all... Perkeo, still my favorite.

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Old 1 Week Ago   #26
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Well.... New roll finished and scanned. I finally got twelve shots on a roll. Turns out the camera's auto-stop and frame counter isn't very accurate so for this roll I skipped them altogether and wound the camera the old fashioned way with the red window.

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Old 1 Week Ago   #27
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Another.... These are all on Ilford XP2 by the way.

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Old 1 Week Ago   #28
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Unfortunately several of the shots turned out like this. Is this a light leak? I wonder what is going on here. The location and shape of the washed-out area is consistent on every photo where it appears, to greater or lessor degrees. I used the Voigtlander deep yellow filter and 32mm hood for the entire roll.

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Old 1 Week Ago   #29
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Here's one where the washed-out area is very faint. Same shape and area of the negative though.

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Old 1 Week Ago   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hilltime View Post
I have the Perkeo RF or sometimes referred to as the Perkeo III. I have many folders both German and Japanese 9 Super Ikonta IV, Konica Pearl III, Mamiya Automat II, Olympus VB, and what else?

The Perkeo is hands down my favorite. Color-Skopar 80/3.5 is the best.
Would never give it up.

Gary Hill
The rangefinder is also labeled as the Perkeo E. I don't recall if there are any other physical differences.

On the Perkeo II, I have had two, but not lucky enough to have a reliable transport and frame counter/stop.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #31
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[/quote]

Downers Grove, IL, if I'm correct. My parents live in Downers. The Tivoli is a great theatre!
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Old 1 Week Ago   #32
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My best experience with the Perkeo.

The Perkeo (1) usually has a Vaskar 75, and a Prontor shutter. black front standard,

OCCASIONALLY, you find a first gen Perkeo with the Color Skopar 80 ( or 85) and the silver front standards... (ordered originally as an upgrade) Prontor or Compur shutter?

Perkeo II came with a lot of gearing under the hood, film stop and count. I never had a good II. Two failed on me, so because they had Color Skopar and advanced shutter, I stripped out the gearing and shot them like a I.

My best experience was a Perkeo I that was factory upgraded to the silver standards, the Color Skopar, and the advanced shutter.

It was a great shooter, but I dislike square 6x6, so sold it. Best Perkeo configuration I found. Use the ruby window for stop and framing and no double exposure prevention. Memory only.

These two BMW pics came from the Perkeo I which was factory silver standards, Color Skopar, advanced shutter, and NO AUTO CRAP under the hood. My final best configuration. Just takes time to find this upgraded Perkeo I.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by css9450 View Post
Hmmm, that's interesting! I noticed on the Perkeo there's a noticeably greater resistance felt while turning the shutter speed dial from 1/250 to 500, compared to any of the speeds lower than 1/250, which I'm told is due to the additional springs or mechanisms (or something?) necessary for the faster shutter speed. Maybe I should stick to a maximum of 1/250th. I'm not sure the lens is threaded for filters.... Might be time to start looking for the old Voigtlander slip-on filters mentioned in the manual!

One thing I noticed - the film-advance and frame counter aren't necessarily the most accurate things in the world. Two rolls in and I'm only getting nine or ten shots per roll due to occasional uneven and haphazard frame spacing on the negative strip. The frame counter works by having the film roll over a roughened spindle which must turn a certain number of times to click it onto the next exposure number, but if the film slips I wind on a lot more (sometimes) than needed. I think for the next roll I'll try leaving the frame counter disengaged and wind my film based on the numbers in the red window.
The accelerator spring for the highest shutter speed is a common feature on almost all of these old vintage shutters. Often makes the user think something is going to break. Rarely ever had a fail on that in many of these old folders.

I know someone is going to piss and moan on my next comment, because you have a II that appears to work. Frame spacing and film "stuffing/jamming" is relatively common on the II because of the "frail" mechanism in the top. The best combination is the Perkeo I with the upgrade to Color Skopar and shutter. The Perkeo I with the upgraded lens/shutter has no impediments in the gear train under the hood. Therefore using the ruby window gives proper frame spacing AND the film count is irrelivent because you see it in the ruby window.

I would look for a I which was bought with the upgrade lens/shutter, or if I ever buy another II, no matter how good it appears to work, I would pull the top and strip out the mechanism to match a Perkeo I.

I only care if the camera is a good shooter. Nobody would ever know from looking at the exterior if it has the II's crap automation. Sorry. Performance and utility is best for me. A Perkeo I with a Color Skopar, or a stripped out II (the automation) but with the Color Skopar would be reliable and shoot the same Image Quality.. most important to me

Don't know what I would find with a Perkeo III or E, but suspect the frame spacing would still be a problem, not to mention film count.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by css9450 View Post
Unfortunately several of the shots turned out like this. Is this a light leak? I wonder what is going on here. The location and shape of the washed-out area is consistent on every photo where it appears, to greater or lessor degrees. I used the Voigtlander deep yellow filter and 32mm hood for the entire roll.

Could be the film was not loaded correctly in the development tank, keeping the liquid from reaching the entire image area all the time.

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Old 1 Week Ago   #35
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Downers Grove is correct. Good eye! I live in nearby Glen Ellyn.

This camera has the Synchro-Compur shutter, so it has a 1/500th shutter speed but I'm using the deep yellow filter to keep it at a maximum of 1/250th in bright outdoor daylight. Pesky ASA 400 film!

So just now in a darkened room I found if I open the camera front and back and shine a bright flashlight into the lens I can see light coming through the shutter blades. Not a lot, but thinking of the shots where I noticed a light leak they all corresponded to periods of time while I had the camera open for an extended period of time. Using the filter (and hood), I didn't want to keep removing those things so I could close the camera between shots. It was very bright outside and that might be the source of my leak. Next step - find a lens cap that will slip over the Voigtlander hood!
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Old 1 Week Ago   #36
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Could be the film was not loaded correctly in the development tank, keeping the liquid from reaching the entire image area all the time.

PF
That was my first thought also, but seeing how the leak was shaped identically every time it appeared, and didn't appear at all on a few other photos, made me think it was something other tha n processing error. Its XP2, so it went through the C-41 machine or at least that is how I think its done.
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Old 1 Week Ago   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kuzano View Post
...I would pull the top and strip out the mechanism to match a Perkeo I.
The Perkeo I uses a shutter button on top, like the II has, I assume? Of course on the II, the button isn't working now since I left the frame counter disengaged for this roll. I bent a paperclip into a little hook to reach up next to the lens to trip it manually.
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Old 5 Days Ago   #38
css9450
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Originally Posted by 02Pilot View Post
The frame counter can be very accurate. Mine spaces perfectly enough that I consistently get 13 non-overlapping frames. Cleanliness is the key. Pop the top plate off an clean absolutely every piece of the gear train and spacing should improve markedly.
I took the top cover off the camera. Very easy on this camera! So far everything looks clean with some evidences of light oil. Supposedly the camera was serviced recently.

I can imagine where drag might be created on the textured roller if there were grit or dried lubricant on the gears. I'll focus my attention there. I also considered the possibility that the rough texture at the top and bottom of the roller has worn off somewhat thus allowing the film to slip. Worst case scenario is I can disengage the lever from the shutter button lock (either by wiring it back, or by removing it) but that's a fallback plan. I could advance film by the red window, if necessary.

By the way, I found a 52mm lens cap fits perfectly on the Voigtlander hood. As a Nikon shooter, I have at least a "few" of those!
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Old 5 Days Ago   #39
02Pilot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by css9450 View Post
I took the top cover off the camera. Very easy on this camera! So far everything looks clean with some evidences of light oil. Supposedly the camera was serviced recently.

I can imagine where drag might be created on the textured roller if there were grit or dried lubricant on the gears. I'll focus my attention there. I also considered the possibility that the rough texture at the top and bottom of the roller has worn off somewhat thus allowing the film to slip. Worst case scenario is I can disengage the lever from the shutter button lock (either by wiring it back, or by removing it) but that's a fallback plan. I could advance film by the red window, if necessary.

By the way, I found a 52mm lens cap fits perfectly on the Voigtlander hood. As a Nikon shooter, I have at least a "few" of those!
It may look clean, but if it were me I'd blow it out, go over every single surface with Ronsonol, and very lightly (syringe) oil the rotating pins (be sure to keep the gears dry). If the roller is not engaging, I'd suspect that the pressure plate springs are weak (they were on mine) rather than surface wear. I added some light foam blocks behind the pressure plate leading and trailing edges to improve contact.
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Any man who can see what he wants to get on film will usually find some way to get it;
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Old 5 Days Ago   #40
Robert.M
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Perkeo II is a great camera !
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