Oy vey

[Teuthida]

Standing on Sunset Beach in Hawaii today at a scenic overlook. Leica M5 in hand (only because I've learned never to leave anything in a car in Hawaii).

Japanese tourist with m9 with a 50 Summilux (with red filter!) and X2 approached me to inquire about my camera. Had no idea Leica made "old" film cameras.

[Chris101]

Originally Posted by Teuthida

Standing on Sunset Beach in Hawaii today at a scenic overlook. Leica M5 in hand (only because I've learned never to leave anything in a car in Hawaii).

Japanese tourist with m9 with a 50 Summilux (with red filter!) and X2 approached me to inquire about my camera. Had no idea Leica made "old" film cameras.

M9, not M9m with a red filter? Oy vey indeed. My standard answer to any Leica questions (back when I had one) was "No, it's a Russian knock-off."

[maddoc]

Red-filter for Sunset beach in Hawaii ..... I will try that next week!

[FrozenInTime]

Sounds apocryphal : perhaps it was a M8 with UV/IR cut filter.

[sparrow6224]

I published a novel once, and in it the wife of the ambitious main character remarks, "Every time your income rises, a little more of your conscience has to die." That said, and I stick by it, I have problems with this anecdote as a lesson in the morality of wealth. For if the gentleman had known from the serial number on the M5 -- somewhere in the 1,3xx,xxx I presume -- its year of manufacture; and all the lore surrounding that first metered M; and its failure in the marketplace; and everything else that would make it clear he really knows not only his Leicas, but his photography.... and he was nice to you and bought you a drink, would he then get a pass? Likely so. Either man described -- the boob and the aficionado -- can be someone brutally dedicated to wealth above all considerations; and either could be someone who has by luck, and without exploitation or abuse, become wealthy, and could be a good man, and his expertise in photo matters, even owning so enviable and costly a set of camera and lens, is not a good basis for making the distinction. In short: you can be a camera vulgarian and still be a decent human.... though I grant you, it's hard to imagine.

[IEDEI]

lol!

you should have told him it is an M14 prototype!

[FrankS]

Originally Posted by sparrow6224

I published a novel once, and in it the wife of the ambitious main character remarks, "Every time your income rises, a little more of your conscience has to die." That said, and I stick by it, I have problems with this anecdote as a lesson in the morality of wealth. For if the gentleman had known from the serial number on the M5 -- somewhere in the 1,3xx,xxx I presume -- its year of manufacture; and all the lore surrounding that first metered M; and its failure in the marketplace; and everything else that would make it clear he really knows not only his Leicas, but his photography.... and he was nice to you and bought you a drink, would he then get a pass? Likely so. Either man described -- the boob and the aficionado -- can be someone brutally dedicated to wealth above all considerations; and either could be someone who has by luck, and without exploitation or abuse, become wealthy, and could be a good man, and his expertise in photo matters, even owning so enviable and costly a set of camera and lens, is not a good basis for making the distinction. In short: you can be a camera vulgarian and still be a decent human.... though I grant you, it's hard to imagine.

Love this post. Brilliant.

[PointOmega]

Originally Posted by sparrow6224

I published a novel once, and in it the wife of the ambitious main character remarks, "Every time your income rises, a little more of your conscience has to die." That said, and I stick by it, I have problems with this anecdote as a lesson in the morality of wealth. For if the gentleman had known from the serial number on the M5 -- somewhere in the 1,3xx,xxx I presume -- its year of manufacture; and all the lore surrounding that first metered M; and its failure in the marketplace; and everything else that would make it clear he really knows not only his Leicas, but his photography.... and he was nice to you and bought you a drink, would he then get a pass? Likely so. Either man described -- the boob and the aficionado -- can be someone brutally dedicated to wealth above all considerations; and either could be someone who has by luck, and without exploitation or abuse, become wealthy, and could be a good man, and his expertise in photo matters, even owning so enviable and costly a set of camera and lens, is not a good basis for making the distinction. In short: you can be a camera vulgarian and still be a decent human.... though I grant you, it's hard to imagine.

=

Classic

[paulfish4570]

sparrow, primo stream of consciousness. make that a river ...

[Sejanus.Aelianus]

In short: you can be a camera vulgarian and still be a decent human

Very true.

[unixrevolution]

Even if everyone knows something, there has to be a first time they find out.

Frankly, the amazing part here, to me, is how do you even get an interest for an M9, much less the desire to actually purchase it, without knowing leica film cameras first?

Who decides an M9 is the right digital camera for them if they don't already love rangefinders?

On the same note, I'm a car person, and I find it repugnant that many people who buy the new Mini don't know there was an original. Same with the Fiat 500.

[edge100]

Originally Posted by unixrevolution

Who decides an M9 is the right digital camera for them if they don't already love rangefinders?

Someone who walks into a camera store and says "I have money, and I want everyone to know it. What camera will do that for me?", that's who.

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by unixrevolution

On the same note, I'm a car person, and I find it repugnant that many people who buy the new Mini don't know there was an original. Same with the Fiat 500.

Some people just aren't fanatical. They just want something nice and current. I don't know the history of the companies which made my toaster, or my sink's faucet, or my bed, or the food I eat, etc.

[willie_901]

If the red filter was an IR cut filter the M9 photographer may be smart ( or just lucky?) as Erwin Puts noticed the M9 has a non-trivial IR response.

[IEDEI]

no offense to those still into film cameras, but I think a story like this shows how irrelevant film cameras are to the general population at this point in 2012. to the enthusiast they matter, but to regular people they are useless.

I too am a car enthusiast, and do not expect someone to identify who looks as a sorry excuse of a 2012 Lancia to understand their rich background of exclusivity and motorsport heritage....those ideas are simply not persistent in the mass consumption realm.

[JohnTF]

It is sad to me when a newly minted Mini actually has a competition class at a Classic British Car Show, and is literally driven from the showroom, exhibited, and goes home with a trophy.

The car club import office guys exempted it to allow it in to the US because the name was classic, but not the final edition of the VW Beetle from Mexico. They said they made too many, I asked how many people asked for an exemption, including me, and he told me two. Hardly a flood. He said I could take out the motor and import it as parts.

Cameras, it's nice when your camera is cool, nicer when your images are.

Regards, John

[IEDEI]

Originally Posted by JohnTF

The car club import office guys exempted it to allow it in to the US because the name was classic, but not the final edition of the VW Beetle from Mexico. They said they made too many, I asked how many people asked for an exemption, including me, and he told me two. Hardly a flood. He said I could take out the motor and import it as parts.

what year mexican Beetle are you referring to? I'm guessing you're aware of the 25 year laws right? after 25 years ANY car can be imported to the US; however under 25 years only certain cars (very few) are legally able to be imported.

[zuiko85]

When folks ask about my old cameras I just answer as best I can. Had a fellow ask if my Pen F was a Leica once. Told him 'no, it's about the same size as some Leica's but is this shape because......' and went on to show him it's design features.

[burancap]

Well, you just never know!

My older brother has shot film his whole life at the rate of at least a roll-a-week, if not more. At 64, that is a lot of film!

We live rather far apart and don't speak too often.

Years ago, upon the arrival of my first Hasselblad -I couldn't contain myself.

I had to call my brother and tell him all about it.

His response: "Hass-a-what? You might as well be speaking Greek!"

... and that was the end of the conversation.

[Godfrey]

The other 99% of the world that knows nothing about photography and cameras are just curious when they see people carrying unusual looking cameras. I smile and return the pleasantry.

Of course, I can't tell one point and shoot from another either ... film or not! ;-)

[Gabriel M.A.]

Originally Posted by Teuthida

Standing on Sunset Beach in Hawaii today at a scenic overlook. Leica M5 in hand (only because I've learned never to leave anything in a car in Hawaii).

Japanese tourist with m9 with a 50 Summilux (with red filter!) and X2 approached me to inquire about my camera. Had no idea Leica made "old" film cameras.

Whoa, wait: they make "red" filters?! For how long has this been going on?

[Teuthida]

Originally Posted by sparrow6224

I published a novel once, and in it the wife of the ambitious main character remarks, "Every time your income rises, a little more of your conscience has to die." That said, and I stick by it, I have problems with this anecdote as a lesson in the morality of wealth. For if the gentleman had known from the serial number on the M5 -- somewhere in the 1,3xx,xxx I presume -- its year of manufacture; and all the lore surrounding that first metered M; and its failure in the marketplace; and everything else that would make it clear he really knows not only his Leicas, but his photography.... and he was nice to you and bought you a drink, would he then get a pass? Likely so. Either man described -- the boob and the aficionado -- can be someone brutally dedicated to wealth above all considerations; and either could be someone who has by luck, and without exploitation or abuse, become wealthy, and could be a good man, and his expertise in photo matters, even owning so enviable and costly a set of camera and lens, is not a good basis for making the distinction. In short: you can be a camera vulgarian and still be a decent human.... though I grant you, it's hard to imagine.

Well put. He was a very nice guy, and we shared a thumbs up about the fact we shared the same camera. I guess I'm just an old guy with a failure of imagination, not understanding how anyone could own a Leica without understanding the rich history. Of course, many people find it irrelevant and I get that. I just find it amusing, given that Leica means exquisite mechanical film camera to me and the digitals are an afterthought. Frankly, I'd much rather have a d800e than an M9, although I do love my M8.

I have a close friend who is rather well known in European photographic circles, in his 50 s like me. Been shooting with an m4 forever. Every time I pull out my m8 he remarks that he just "doesn't see the point". He's currently using a MF digital back when he needs digital files, but all his personal work is done with his M4.

[zauhar]

Originally Posted by sparrow6224

I published a novel once, and in it the wife of the ambitious main character remarks, "Every time your income rises, a little more of your conscience has to die." That said, and I stick by it, I have problems with this anecdote as a lesson in the morality of wealth. For if the gentleman had known from the serial number on the M5 -- somewhere in the 1,3xx,xxx I presume -- its year of manufacture; and all the lore surrounding that first metered M; and its failure in the marketplace; and everything else that would make it clear he really knows not only his Leicas, but his photography.... and he was nice to you and bought you a drink, would he then get a pass? Likely so. Either man described -- the boob and the aficionado -- can be someone brutally dedicated to wealth above all considerations; and either could be someone who has by luck, and without exploitation or abuse, become wealthy, and could be a good man, and his expertise in photo matters, even owning so enviable and costly a set of camera and lens, is not a good basis for making the distinction. In short: you can be a camera vulgarian and still be a decent human.... though I grant you, it's hard to imagine.

This is an intelligent observation, but I think the feeling of the OP is really summarized by the thread title. I am pretty sure that most RFFers fall in the category 'not scraping bottom but not getting anywhere fast'. The OP encountered a well-heeled tourist who picks up an M9 the way the rest of us would select a cheap point & shoot. The effect is .... disconcerting.

I don't think 'jealousy' is the right word. Rather, when a person behaves in this way they cheapen the valuable item they have acquired. For most RFFers an M9 would be a Very Big Deal. Months of saving or taking on a debt, I can imagine them waiting anxiously for the delivery to arrive, opening the package with trembling hands - you get the idea.

But Rich Business man walks in the store, and says "gimme the best camera ya got."

Come to think of it, who is really better off?

Randy

[Teuthida]

In thinking about what I found off putting about this encounter, it's not that the guy was a vulgarian. It's this: I recently picked up a beautiful black m4 from a forum member. It looks like its never been used. The camera is exquisite, a mechanical work of art. It feels so right in ones hands. It's a small piece of perfection in an imperfect world. In spite of its own charms, A digital Leica seems a vulgarization of such perfection, and this man's use of said seemed to me to embody that vulgarization.

[sig]

Lost in translation?

Maybe both of you came out of this conversation in a good way?