A colour enlarger can do BW, is that right?

[Gabriel M.A.]

Originally Posted by 135format

Thats even worse, it means they didn't even verify what they were claiming but that's how myths start I guess.

Like Ilford XP being banned from labs because technicians see "C-41" and freak out that the photos turn out pinkish/magenta (or worse yet, in ::gasp:: black and white)? Or that Portra NC has a "saturation issue"? Or a bicycle being faulty for not having an engine just like those of all those other kids' bikes in the neighborhood?

[sevo]

Originally Posted by 135format

I'm not arguing that you only got 4.7. I'm just saying the chart says that 199M gives grade 5. It doesn't say how much Magenta filtration an LPL has, it says LPL use Kodak filtration units.

The requirements for multigrade and colour paper aren't quite the same, the numerical values for magenta might be higher than the value that would be measured if the filter is evaluated as a green bandstop. Whether and at what exposure compensation colour heads can reach the full range of multigrade papers always is somewhat debatable.

But it is not really a practical issue - if you need a gradation of 5 over 4.7 (or 1 over 1.3), your negative has issues that are rather beyond the scope of silver printing, and you'd better rescue it in a digital post. Most currently available fixed-grade papers aren't even made in these extreme grades.

[135format]

Originally Posted by sevo

The requirements for multigrade and colour paper aren't quite the same, the numerical values for magenta might be higher than the value that would be measured if the filter is evaluated as a green bandstop. Whether and at what exposure compensation colour heads can reach the full range of multigrade papers always is somewhat debatable.

But it is not really a practical issue - if you need a gradation of 5 over 4.7 (or 1 over 1.3), your negative has issues that are rather beyond the scope of silver printing, and you'd better rescue it in a digital post. Most currently available fixed-grade papers aren't even made in these extreme grades.

Yes I know its rarely used but what started this was the suggestion that colour heads can't do grade 5 and they can if they are decent enlargers.
And then there is split grade printing, not that 4.7 wouldn't work just as well as 5 but that isn't the point. The point is that telling people G5 is not achievable with a colour head simply isn't true.

[Chris101]

Originally Posted by 135format

Now look under the single filter kodak column further down the page and at Ilfords caveat at the bottom of that chart.

I'm not arguing that you only got 4.7. I'm just saying the chart says that 199M gives grade 5. It doesn't say how much Magenta filtration an LPL has, it says LPL use Kodak filtration units.

My "look here" link was to the specs for LPL filters. Through that link you would have seen that "the standard features of 4500-II with Dichroic Filtration Module: 0-200 Yellow, 0-200 Cyan and 0-170 Magenta stepless and continuously variable filtration."

170 magenta is not enough magenta to get to a 5. But as sevo points out in real world terms 4.7 is "good enough" for anything one would want to print in a darkroom. However I felt compelled to be precise since you insisted this is a myth, when it is true that many dichroic color heads do not have enough magenta to get to a full five.

[135format]

Originally Posted by Chris101

My "look here" link was to the specs for LPL filters. Through that link you would have seen that "the standard features of 4500-II with Dichroic Filtration Module: 0-200 Yellow, 0-200 Cyan and 0-170 Magenta stepless and continuously variable filtration."

170 magenta is not enough magenta to get to a 5. But as sevo points out in real world terms 4.7 is "good enough" for anything one would want to print in a darkroom. However I felt compelled to be precise since you insisted this is a myth, when it is true that many dichroic color heads do not have enough magenta to get to a full five.

OK I now understand that LPL can't do it. Some, such as my Durst CLS501 head can. So it is a myth that dichroic head can't do grade 5. Some can snd some can't.

[rxmd]

Originally Posted by 135format

The point is that telling people G5 is not achievable with a colour head simply isn't true.

And the other point is that this simply isn't relevant at all.

It's like a discussion which car goes faster if nobody you know or are ever going to know drives this car. It may be true, or it may not be true, but it's irrelevant either way.