Go Back   Rangefinderforum.com > Clubs, Critique, RFF Projects, Salon > Photogs / Photo Exhibits

Photogs / Photo Exhibits This is the place to discuss a particular Photographer (work, style, life, whatever), as well as to post Gallery and Museum Photo Exhibitions and your own impressions of them. As we march on in this new digital world, it is often too easy to forget about the visual importance of the photographic print, as well as their financial importance to the photographer. It is also interesting to remember that some guy named Gene Smith shot with lenses that many lens test reading "never had a picture published in their life" amateurs would turn up their their noses at, as being "unacceptable."

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes

A Banker Whose Photos Tell the Stories of Bronx Prostitutes
Old 02-21-2012   #1
Araakii
Registered User
 
Araakii is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 507
A Banker Whose Photos Tell the Stories of Bronx Prostitutes

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/20...ait-at-a-time/


What do you think of this? Do you feel that the subjects are being exploited?
__________________
My Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #2
Sparrow
Stewart McBride
 
Sparrow's Avatar
 
Sparrow is offline
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Perfidious Albion
Age: 62
Posts: 11,237
Disappointing stuff really hardly "in depth" journalism, I was hoping for Dominique Strauss-Kahn again
__________________
Regards Stewart

Stewart McBride



You’re only young once, but one can always be immature.

flickr stuff
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #3
Roger Hicks
Registered User
 
Roger Hicks is offline
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Aquitaine
Posts: 20,313
HOPING? AGAIN?

Aaaargh....

Cheers,

R.
__________________
Now even more free photography information on www.rogerandfrances.com
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #4
jsrockit
Moderator
 
jsrockit's Avatar
 
jsrockit is offline
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: NYC
Age: 41
Posts: 14,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Araakii View Post
http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/20...ait-at-a-time/


What do you think of this? Do you feel that the subjects are being exploited?
Are they being exploited? Sure, in some form... but it's better than exploiting them for sex no? Also, is it being implied that he's exploiting them more so because of his job and income?
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #5
Creagerj
Incidental Artist
 
Creagerj's Avatar
 
Creagerj is offline
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by Araakii View Post
http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/20...ait-at-a-time/


What do you think of this? Do you feel that the subjects are being exploited?
"Pardon me ma'am, but do you mind if I take your picture with my camera that costs as much as you make in three months while you, ahem, 'holla for a dolla?'"

To a certain extent what he does is exploitative. On the other hand, he does ask permission. However, the story of Nina, the 17 year old prostitute that he paid $20 to take her photo. I would call that exploitative. That girl didn't have a choice but to take that $20, and I can guarantee that it didn't do her any favors. Instead, it just reinforced her position as a street worker. It wasn't an opportunity to change her life, it was just another John paying for her services.

A part of me feels like this guy is pretending to be a NatGeo photographer in an urban jungle, giddy at the idea of showing his privileged friends his most recent adventures into the bad side of town. So, what happens when his friends see his work? Do they decide to help? Do they say "oh gee, that's terrible, someone who isn't me should do something about that." Or, does he actually inspire people to help make a difference?

The other part of me wants to commend him for his boldness. What he is doing does not come without risk. He could be assaulted by a pimp, or robbed. He is likely not immune to attack just for befriending a few of the girls on the corner. Then again, maybe he fancy's this idea as a form of gratification for what he does so that he can say, "look, I took a risk and I paid for it with blood."

I think what it boils down to is that he pays for their time. In the end, he is just another John supporting and exploiting their way of life. He really isn't helping them. What he is doing could put these girls at risk of assault from their pimp's or worse. They carry that risk after he retires to the comfort of his privileged life. While he sits at home editing his photos, those girls are still down on the corner, putting their life on the line, and their lives are no better for having pandered to his whims.
__________________
Joe
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #6
photo4ls
Registered User
 
photo4ls's Avatar
 
photo4ls is offline
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NC
Posts: 364
ooh boy, I can see where this post is going.
Nelson
__________________
M3 Summicron 50 f2 DR
Canon 50 f1.8 chrome
Elmar 90 f4
Nikon FM3a 45P f2.8
24 f2.8 28-105
Nikon FM2 135 f2.8 90 f2.5 Macro
50 f1.8
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #7
Sparrow
Stewart McBride
 
Sparrow's Avatar
 
Sparrow is offline
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Perfidious Albion
Age: 62
Posts: 11,237
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Hicks View Post
HOPING? AGAIN?

Aaaargh....

Cheers,

R.
... socialism's great white hope?
__________________
Regards Stewart

Stewart McBride



You’re only young once, but one can always be immature.

flickr stuff
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #8
Sparrow
Stewart McBride
 
Sparrow's Avatar
 
Sparrow is offline
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Perfidious Albion
Age: 62
Posts: 11,237
Quote:
Originally Posted by Creagerj View Post
"Pardon me ma'am, but do you mind if I take your picture with my camera that costs as much as you make in three months while you, ahem, 'holla for a dolla?'"

To a certain extent what he does is exploitative. On the other hand, he does ask permission. However, the story of Nina, the 17 year old prostitute that he paid $20 to take her photo. I would call that exploitative. That girl didn't have a choice but to take that $20, and I can guarantee that it didn't do her any favors. Instead, it just reinforced her position as a street worker. It wasn't an opportunity to change her life, it was just another John paying for her services.

A part of me feels like this guy is pretending to be a NatGeo photographer in an urban jungle, giddy at the idea of showing his privileged friends his most recent adventures into the bad side of town. So, what happens when his friends see his work? Do they decide to help? Do they say "oh gee, that's terrible, someone who isn't me should do something about that." Or, does he actually inspire people to help make a difference?

The other part of me wants to commend him for his boldness. What he is doing does not come without risk. He could be assaulted by a pimp, or robbed. He is likely not immune to attack just for befriending a few of the girls on the corner. Then again, maybe he fancy's this idea as a form of gratification for what he does so that he can say, "look, I took a risk and I paid for it with blood."

I think what it boils down to is that he pays for their time. In the end, he is just another John supporting and exploiting their way of life. He really isn't helping them. What he is doing could put these girls at risk of assault from their pimp's or worse. They carry that risk after he retires to the comfort of his privileged life. While he sits at home editing his photos, those girls are still down on the corner, putting their life on the line, and their lives are no better for having pandered to his whims.
... I'd have typed that if I had the patience
__________________
Regards Stewart

Stewart McBride



You’re only young once, but one can always be immature.

flickr stuff
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #9
lic4
Registered User
 
lic4's Avatar
 
lic4 is offline
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 263
A Wall St banker can do whatever he wants.
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #10
Creagerj
Incidental Artist
 
Creagerj's Avatar
 
Creagerj is offline
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparrow View Post
... I'd have typed that if I had the patience
I've got patience enough to rant for the masses.
__________________
Joe
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #11
Creagerj
Incidental Artist
 
Creagerj's Avatar
 
Creagerj is offline
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by lic4 View Post
A Wall St banker can do whatever he wants.
It sure seems like that's how the guy feels about it. He seems to feel that paying for their time makes everything ok. I guess he is just a purist in a capitalist state.
__________________
Joe
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #12
Araakii
Registered User
 
Araakii is offline
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 507
It does mention that he volunteered at some community service before he started doing this so it could be that he does have some compassion towards the street workers, but the way he simply stops them and pays them for photos makes me feel like this is just some weird fetish that a rich guy with a lot of free money has.
__________________
My Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #13
ibcrewin
Ah looky looky
 
ibcrewin's Avatar
 
ibcrewin is offline
Join Date: Apr 2006
Age: 37
Posts: 749
You know it seems kind of lame. Something about it just isn't that interesting. I kind of feel like this guy got coverage of an over-covered topic. Also.. poignant portraits? eh. I'm no pro but I put this in with covering the homeless. Is that effed up?
__________________
Shooting, developing, and scanning more film in 2013! My Flickr Gallery


Bessa-R w/ J8 lens, Lubitel 2, Rebel XT, Elan 7e, Konica C35, Olympus Mju
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #14
jsrockit
Moderator
 
jsrockit's Avatar
 
jsrockit is offline
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: NYC
Age: 41
Posts: 14,094
So, a few of you are saying that the guy's day job makes it worse?

Also, he seems to be a trader more than a banker. It's been some slim years for a lot of traders... not all traders are good or make a lot of cash. Some traders are very nice people believe it or not. Not everyone on Wall St. is scum... plenty of average wage workers on Wall St. However, it appears he does make some cash based on the fact that they had to say "spacious" about his apartment.

I work on Wall St (Regulation) and don't make six figures. I do live in Manhattan, but in a small studio apartment. I don't own a car, a house, or anthing else worth any cash... besides a M9 and a few lenses. People who aren't from this area tend to look at someone's wages without considering the cost of living in that area (yes, NYC is very high). I'd like to think that I'm still a decent person despite the fact that I work on a particular street.
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #15
andredossantos
Registered User
 
andredossantos is offline
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Age: 36
Posts: 1,421
People are exploiting other people all the time without even realizing it (especially those who type from their high speed internet on a made in somewhere where a the worker got paid $1 a day laptop in a climate controlled abode in first world countries that run on oil provided by totalitarian governments). Those examples are kind of ridiculous but it serves the point because where does "exploitation" begin and end? Just saying, to single out one person for taking pictures of prostitutes is kind've naive. The fact that hes a banker doesn't matter at all. That means anyone with a 401K cannot take pictures of hookers either since their retirement is based on the gains of corporate vampires exploiting others.

The photographer seems sincere and besides a flickr stream doesn't seem to be putting this stuff out there or doing this for any sort of personal gain.
__________________

Website

Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #16
photo4ls
Registered User
 
photo4ls's Avatar
 
photo4ls is offline
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NC
Posts: 364
Since this guy is financially successful, is he limited for to what photography projects he can have ?
Nelson
__________________
M3 Summicron 50 f2 DR
Canon 50 f1.8 chrome
Elmar 90 f4
Nikon FM3a 45P f2.8
24 f2.8 28-105
Nikon FM2 135 f2.8 90 f2.5 Macro
50 f1.8

Last edited by photo4ls : 02-21-2012 at 11:03. Reason: none
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #17
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
 
sevo is offline
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
Posts: 4,492
Well, getting prostitutes to document the work life of wall street bankers would both be more interesting and more of a help in getting them off the streets...
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #18
andredossantos
Registered User
 
andredossantos is offline
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Age: 36
Posts: 1,421
Quote:
Originally Posted by sevo View Post
Well, getting prostitutes to document the work life of wall street bankers would both be more interesting and more of a help in getting them off the streets...
I cant argue with this
__________________

Website

Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #19
jsrockit
Moderator
 
jsrockit's Avatar
 
jsrockit is offline
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: NYC
Age: 41
Posts: 14,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by sevo View Post
Well, getting prostitutes to document the work life of wall street bankers would both be more interesting and more of a help in getting them off the streets...
If they are smart, the prostitutes do documents their exploits with bankers in some form... but keep those documents for when the time is right...
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #20
andredossantos
Registered User
 
andredossantos is offline
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Age: 36
Posts: 1,421
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsrockit View Post
If they are smart, the prostitutes do documents their exploits with bankers in some form... but keep those documents for when the time is right...
Ha!

And speaking of Hunts Point, jsrockit, we need to go back soon to "exploit" the decrepit urban landscape. Im actually glad the hookers are still sleeping when Im there
__________________

Website

Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #21
MickH
Registered User
 
MickH is offline
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 974
I didn't go all the way through his pictures, not my taste at all. They reminded me of the snaps that get circulated around the web of unusual looking people photographed in Walmart, 'shot from the hip', most likely by kids on their mobiles.

When I saw he'd got a Flickr set titled 'NYC Bikes' I was expecting more of the same, but was pleasantly surprised. Not by the photo's but crikey, what bikes!
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #22
Creagerj
Incidental Artist
 
Creagerj's Avatar
 
Creagerj is offline
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by photo4ls View Post
Since this guy is financially successful, is he limited for to what photography projects he can have ?
Nelson
It isn't his financial success so much as it is the economic power that he wields. Like I said before, the worker named Nina who initially refused to have her photo taken and then agreed when he offered her $20 really didn't have a choice but to accept that money.

She is 17, selling her body for sex, and this guy thinks that paying her $20 makes it okay for him to photograph her for his own personal indulgence. How did that action make that woman's life any better? How does that make him any different from a John who wants to pay her for sex?
__________________
Joe
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #23
anu L ogy
Registered User
 
anu L ogy is offline
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: RI
Posts: 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by andredossantos View Post
People are exploiting other people all the time without even realizing it (especially those who type from their high speed internet on a laptop, in a climate controlled apartment or house in first world countries). To single out one person for taking pictures of prostitutes is kind've naive. The fact that hes a banker doesn't matter at all. That means anyone with a 401K cannot take pictures of hookers either since their retirement is based on the gains of corporate vampires exploiting others.

The photographer seems sincere and besides a flickr stream doesn't seem to be putting this stuff out there or doing this for any sort of personal gain.

I don't think I can disagree with this. I think its wrong to single him out for exploitation when these points are considered.
__________________
-Jim

http://www.flickr.com/photos/anulogy/
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #24
Pablito
coco frío
 
Pablito's Avatar
 
Pablito is offline
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Salsipuedes
Posts: 3,228
Brenda Ann Kenneally
  Reply With Quote

Old 02-21-2012   #25
andredossantos
Registered User
 
andredossantos is offline
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Age: 36
Posts: 1,421
Quote:
Originally Posted by Creagerj View Post
She is 17, selling her body for sex, and this guy thinks that paying her $20 makes it okay for him to photograph her for his own personal indulgence. How did that action make that woman's life any better? How does that make him any different from a John who wants to pay her for sex?
She is not 17, she tells him she began hooking when she was 17. Not saying this means anything one way or another but figured Id mention it.
__________________

Website

Flickr
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 00:11.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All content on this site is Copyright Protected and owned by its respective owner. You may link to content on this site but you may not reproduce any of it in whole or part without written consent from its owner.