Security - Lost and Found

[kshapero]

I just read an article about a company called Stuffbak. They sell little metal adhesive labels, so you can get your stuff back if lost or otherwise. They claim a 75% return ratio.

1. Would I want to ugly up my rig with a label somewhere?
2. What other methods are folks using?
3. What about Insurance riders, etc.?
4. Other methods of identifying one's camera?

[Gumby]

These kind of labels are quite common for corporate equipment.... mostly for property tracking within a companies property accountability system. Putting an owners name and return address is a logical extension of that 'technology" concept. Thsi sloutionis only valid for lost equipment that is found by honest people, not for stolen equipment that is taken or put into commerce in the "dishonest" community.

Personally, I think 75% return ratio is an aspiration rather than a fact. Let's consider something similar -- luggage checked onto airplanes. One would be foolish not to tag them with ID to facilitate return WHEN they are lost. Yet, there is a huge warehouse in Atlanta (I think) that sells HUGE AMOUNTS of unclaimed luggage from the airlines. Maybe that is only 25% of whluggage that is lost, but in a system where almost 100% of what they handle is tagged twice, once by tehm and once by the owner, I find it interesting that so much ends up unidentifiable and unreturnable.

To answer your questions, from my perspective:
1. Why not, if you want to increase the chances of return if your equipment is lost.
2. Some might call it luck, but I call it "concious control of my property". I watch my equipment like a hawk.
3. Don't use insurance for cameras equipment., but that is one way to get reimbursed the depreciated value in the event of loss or theft.
4. All of my cameras have a serial number on them.

[JohnTF]

I would like to track down the guy who put scratched his SS number on the bottom of my M3-- if only to smack him. ;-)

A dymo or other label inside will help the occasional honest guy who finds your kit, nothing will help the rest. Same for some sort of hang tag?

I would like to think the serial numbers of reported stolen equipment eventually have some effect when equipment is sent for repair, but have no numbers on that.

I have known people who have found digital cameras, waited a few weeks for people to return, and then just bought a new battery charger, and erased the images -- There is an urban legend/joke of someone who lost their digital, on their Honeymoon. Perhaps the first image, or the one on the internal memory of any digital should be an ID Image?

If you call my stolen cell phone from ten years ago, some guy answers in Russian, he never even changed the sim card.

Regards, John

[Al Kaplan]

People used to engrave Social Security numbers on things. Now we're told to guard the S.S. number itself from unauthorized use.

If I offered to sell you a 1965 M-3 in good user condition for $500, but it had somebody else's S.S. on it, and I told you that I bought it used from a dealer in Chicago back around 1981, would you run down to the police station to check the serial number against a list of stolen property, or try to track down the owner of the S.S. number? Do you think that if you sent it in for a CLA Sherry would check?

Exactly!

[kshapero]

Of course there is no real protection from a successful thief. But one of those metal labels on the base plate might help an honest person get your stuff back. Or I guess we could buy some hefty insurance policy and say the hell with it.

[Al Kaplan]

83.2 percent of the folks here would be afraid that an adhesive label might compromize the sheen on the black paint finish. Nobody is likely to steal my Leicas even without a Dymo lable.

[newspaperguy]

I'm one of the lucky ones. A week ago Monday, I lost (I won't tell you how - it was so dumb... Maybe my wife is right and it is 'early onset.') my digi point n' shoot.

Some nice lady from a nearby town found it and delivered it to our house.

I had one of those free labels you get from the fundraisers' stuck to the bottom.

Yes, I sent her a $25 gift card to a local store.

[kshapero]

Originally Posted by Al Kaplan

83.2 percent of the folks here would be afraid that an adhesive label might compromize the sheen on the black paint finish. Nobody is likely to steal my Leicas even without a Dymo lable.

I was pretty sure that would be like 92.7% but you could be right on this. I always lean to my elders.

[Roger Hicks]

Any stick on label will work with honest people.

No stick-on label will work with the rest.

A label inside the base of a Leica, or the back of other cameras, works fine.

I've lost the address of the UK company I used to deal with (500-1000 top quality sticky labels at a time). Any current recommendations?

Cheers,

R.

[bmattock]

This applies only to the USA:

Every camera has a serial number, I believe. The serial number is supposed to be unique. If your camera is stolen (not lost), you can and should file a police report. If you have done your job, you can provide the serial number of the camera to the police. You can also engrave your equipment with a serial number of your own devising, such as a Driver's License number or Social Security number. As mentioned, these days it may be unwise to reveal your social security number on the camera.

The police file the report, the serial number of the camera is supposed to get entered by department personnel into the NCIC (National Crime Information Center) database. If the item is ever recovered, the police agency which filed the report will be notified, and they should contact you and arrange for you to get your item back.

There is no statute of limitations on stolen goods, and they never become 'clean' again. If your item is found years or even decades later, you get it back, even if it has passed innocently through many hands since then, and the current 'owner' is just S.O.L.

Pawn shops are often required to check all their items of value such as cameras with the local police or to provide a list of all such items with serial numbers on a timely basis.

However, most people do not keep track of their serial numbers, nor do they engrave cameras with identifying marks.

Homeowner's insurance will often cover cameras and other such equipment, but there is generally a cap or limit on the value - this is due to years of fraud and abuse by people who drive a $500 car, but seem to have a $10,000 Rolex stolen from them every couple years. You can generally purchase a rider on your policy that covers your equipment to the limits of their value, but especially if the cameras are expensive, sometimes insurance companies require appraisals be done by their choice of licensed appraisers at your own cost.

[Gumby]

Originally Posted by kshapero

Or I guess we could buy some hefty insurance policy and say the hell with it.

... only if it is a replacement-value policy. I think most of us would ge t screwed if it was a depreciated-value policy.

[Gumby]

Originally Posted by Roger Hicks

I've lost the address of the UK company I used to deal with (500-1000 top quality sticky labels at a time). Any current recommendations?

Google

[btgc]

What if thieves machine out SN? Sure they will not resell through dealer, though there always will be people buying shady stuff.

Also, if gear isn't expensive, most of us never ever look at SN even if it's there. Or you do?

[bmattock]

Originally Posted by btgc

What if thieves machine out SN? Sure they will not resell through dealer, though there always will be people buying shady stuff.

Also, if gear isn't expensive, most of us never ever look at SN even if it's there. Or you do?

It is easy to grind off a serial number. But then the camera looks like it has had the serial number ground off, which to me means it is definitely stolen.

I can't speak for others, but I won't have anything to do with things I think might be stolen. And I'll call the police if someone tries to sell me something with the serial number removed. I can't help what other people do, I can only control what I do.

[btgc]

Originally Posted by bmattock

It is easy to grind off a serial number. But then the camera looks like it has had the serial number ground off, which to me means it is definitely stolen.

I want to say that in this case SN doesn't help to identify camera, some other pointers are needed. Like young moon shaped dent on bottom plate, or chip in leatherette right at five o clock relative to lens. That could help in case police catches man selling grinded camera and has at least two theft files. One is owner, and probably it's camera from another theft.

So basically SN help in case of lost gear and theft by novices. Expensive gear should be photographed time by time to have at least chance to prove ownership in case of theft.

Do SLR's have frame on film door to stick note with name and address? How with other cameras - carefully write name and short contact info with soft pencil in film compartment?

[JohnTF]

In Ohio if you make a good faith purchase, you very well may be OK, if for example you buy a camera and pay for it with a check made out to the seller, that would be pretty good evidence of good faith. If the guy will not take a check, it might indicate several things. Pawn shops get the money they paid for the merchandise back from the owners.

Seems almost every camera show has someone announce a camera has been lifted, I lost an F2 at a table I was watching, was pretty certain who it was, the guy was hanging around while we were changing places-- but the owner of the table did not want to risk some sort of liability confronting the guy.

Some cheeky guys will steal from one end and sell at the other.

In Prague, the thieves will visit a store, ask the clerk to take out the film, then ask if they want to buy the camera.

I think most of those SS numbers were put on during the time when it was against US policy to use SS numbers for legal identification.

I have a couple of cameras that are marked, but they were very reduced in price.

I did enjoy a case where the camera uploaded digital files, and the thieves took photos of each other.

Regards, John

[KenR]

Maybe we should put an ID chip in the camera body, like the one the vet put into my dog's neck. Does it become a digital camera then?

[colyn]

Many times if someone breaks into your home and steals your camera it will usually end up in a pawn shop or resale shop.

I don't know about other states or countries for that matter but here in Texas these places are required to provide a copy of the pawn/sale ticket to the police.

If you have the serial number and report it to the police you stand a good chance of getting it back IF it is as above..

If on the other hand someone targets your camera gear......SOL.....

My experience with camera insurance is it is useless especially with film cameras. The agent will simply say film cameras are obsolete..and therefore worthless...

[Al Kaplan]

You should be able to document current selling prices of film cameras. If your agent doesn't want to work with you then find somebody else.

[colyn]

Originally Posted by Al Kaplan

You should be able to document current selling prices of film cameras. If your agent doesn't want to work with you then find somebody else.

Insurance agents here aren't interested in insuring film gear since as they say "not worth dealing with". Now digital on the other hand....they'll go it..

I keep my gear locked in a 600lb 100+ year old safe...

[JohnTF]

Originally Posted by colyn

Many times if someone breaks into your home and steals your camera it will usually end up in a pawn shop or resale shop.

I don't know about other states or countries for that matter but here in Texas these places are required to provide a copy of the pawn/sale ticket to the police.

If you have the serial number and report it to the police you stand a good chance of getting it back IF it is as above..

If on the other hand someone targets your camera gear......SOL.....

My experience with camera insurance is it is useless especially with film cameras. The agent will simply say film cameras are obsolete..and therefore worthless...

You have the wrong policy, mine allows me to set the value, and their rates are a percentage of the stated value, if they wish, they can ask for an appraisal, before they accept the value. They generally ask for appraisals for items valued at more than $5K.

Regards, John

[Pablito]

Time tested method, scratch your SS#, name, or telephone number in a really visible place. Be sure and use something like a rusty nail to do the scratching, and scratch deep!

[hlockwood]

Originally Posted by kshapero

Of course there is no real protection from a successful thief. But one of those metal labels on the base plate might help an honest person get your stuff back. Or I guess we could buy some hefty insurance policy and say the hell with it.

I have a separate schedule insuring my cameras and lenses with Liberty Mutual. They will refund original purchase price of lost, stolen or destroyed equipment. Cost is not so hefty: 1.1% of original purchase price.

Harry

[colyn]

Originally Posted by JohnTF

You have the wrong policy, mine allows me to set the value, and their rates are a percentage of the stated value, if they wish, they can ask for an appraisal, before they accept the value. They generally ask for appraisals for items valued at more than $5K.

Regards, John

Around here film cameras are considered worthless and most insurance companies won't insure them..now digital.....no problem...

[JohnTF]

Originally Posted by colyn

Around here film cameras are considered worthless and most insurance companies won't insure them..now digital.....no problem...

Same with mechanical watches-- Rolexes-- obsolete. ;-)

Assume you have similar insurance companies to ours, and if necessary an appraisal is and appraisal.

Your rates reflect the amount of coverage, what is the problem?

John