Go Back   Rangefinderforum.com > 35mm Film Range Finders > Zeiss Ikon ZM

Zeiss Ikon ZM This is for the current production Leica M mount Zeiss Ikon camera and lenses.

View Poll Results: Which lenses wobble
None all my Zeiss lenses are rock solid 148 54.01%
18mm f/4 1 0.36%
21mm f/2.8 10 3.65%
21mm f/4.5 0 0%
25mm f/2.8 21 7.66%
28mm f/2.8 23 8.39%
35mm f/2 21 7.66%
35mm f/2.8 8 2.92%
50mm f/1.5 22 8.03%
50mm f/2 37 13.50%
85mm f/2 3 1.09%
85mm f/4 0 0%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 274. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes

Zeiss ZM lens wobble issues
Old 11-12-2010   #1
FrozenInTime
Registered User
 
FrozenInTime is offline
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Here and there
Posts: 1,221
Zeiss ZM lens wobble issues

Just how common is Zeiss wobble ?

I had hoped that things had improved with the newer lenses, but after just one week with a 35mm C-Biogon, I noticed that it had wobble between the lens mount and focus ring.

The lens is going back for exchange.

The poll is : check which lenses have/have had mechanical reliability issues.
( sorry no room for a 15mm button in the pole - but at $4600 I hope it's been okay)

Last edited by FrozenInTime : 11-13-2010 at 06:39.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #2
FrozenInTime
Registered User
 
FrozenInTime is offline
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Here and there
Posts: 1,221
A while ago I had a 21mm f/2.8 and a 50mm f/2 : I sold them both, but the 21mm f/2.8 was looser than I cared for.
There are a few threads on RFF mentioning issues with the 50mm f/2, 35mm f/2 and 25mm f/2.8.

My 18mm f/4 is rock solid after two years and improved my confidence in Zeiss lenses no end.
When I started thinking about compact travel lenses, I had hoped the build and design quality was improving as new lenses were introduced.

The 35 f/2.8 was a disappointment.
The 85mm f/4 is looking okay so far.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #3
semilog
curmudgeonly optimist
 
semilog's Avatar
 
semilog is offline
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,714
My 35/2.8 is tight as a drum. Rock-solid.
__________________
There are two kinds of photographers:
those who are interested in what a particular camera can't do,
and those who are interested in what it can do.

semilog.smugmug.com | flickr.com/photos/semilog/
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #4
leicashot
Registered User
 
leicashot's Avatar
 
leicashot is offline
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 1,505
I've seen plenty of Leica lenses with this issues, as well as plenty of other manufacturers so lets not forget that this is not exactly a 'Zeiss only' issue, but an issue the OP is bringing up 'about' Zeiss on this occasion.
__________________
WEBSITE

LEICAHUB on Facebook
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #5
John Lawrence
Registered User
 
John Lawrence is offline
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,661
Quote:
Originally Posted by leicashot View Post
I've seen plenty of Leica lenses with this issues, as well as plenty of other manufacturers so lets not forget that this is not exactly a 'Zeiss only' issue, but an issue the OP is bringing up 'about' Zeiss on this occasion.
I've never seen (or had) a Leica lens with this issue in all the years I've been using, buying and selling Leica lenses.

That's not to say it doesn't exist, but your comment that "plenty of Leica lenses" have this issue does surprise me.

John
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #6
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
 
Chriscrawfordphoto's Avatar
 
Chriscrawfordphoto is offline
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana
Age: 39
Posts: 6,374
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Lawrence View Post
I've never seen (or had) a Leica lens with this issue in all the years I've been using, buying and selling Leica lenses.

That's not to say it doesn't exist, but your comment that "plenty of Leica lenses" have this issue does surprise me.

John
When I first got into Leica and was buying my very first body and lens, I ordered a 50mm tabbed summicron, used, and it looked perfect...bot a mark on it, but the barrel wobbled. I sent it back. So, I have seen one Leica lens do it. I also saw a Konica 90mm M-Hexanon do it also.
__________________
Christopher Crawford
Fine Art Photography
Fort Wayne, Indiana

Back home again in Indiana

http://www.chriscrawfordphoto.com

My Technical Info pages: Film Developing times, scanning, printing, editing.

Like My Work on Facebook
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #7
John Lawrence
Registered User
 
John Lawrence is offline
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriscrawfordphoto View Post
When I first got into Leica and was buying my very first body and lens, I ordered a 50mm tabbed summicron, used, and it looked perfect...bot a mark on it, but the barrel wobbled. I sent it back. So, I have seen one Leica lens do it. I also saw a Konica 90mm M-Hexanon do it also.
Like I said Chris, I'm surprised and have never seen it any of the lenses I've owned, used, bought or sold.

Do you have any other Leica lenses and do any of them exhibit 'wobble'?

John
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #8
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
 
Chriscrawfordphoto's Avatar
 
Chriscrawfordphoto is offline
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana
Age: 39
Posts: 6,374
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Lawrence View Post
Like I said Chris, I'm surprised and have never seen it any of the lenses I've owned, used, bought or sold.

Do you have any other Leica lenses and do any of them exhibit 'wobble'?

John
I do have one Leica lens and have owned a couple more that I sold. None o them wobbled.
__________________
Christopher Crawford
Fine Art Photography
Fort Wayne, Indiana

Back home again in Indiana

http://www.chriscrawfordphoto.com

My Technical Info pages: Film Developing times, scanning, printing, editing.

Like My Work on Facebook
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-13-2010   #9
sanmich
Registered User
 
sanmich's Avatar
 
sanmich is offline
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 3,123
Quote:
Originally Posted by horosu View Post
I recevied the new Summilux 35/1.4 ASPH FLE just last week.

Well, when shaking the lens one can hear something rattle inside the lens. I didn't know if this was normal, but the lens was also plainly wrong calibrated (it backfocused a lot), so I sent it in for repair.

Was very dissappointed to put down 5000 USD and have such issues out of the box.

None of my Zeiss lenses (bought new or second-hand) developed wobble, rattle and all of them were perfectly calibrated.

Just to put things into perspective...


Horea
I discovered a while ago that some lenses sound like something is free inside when you shake them a bit. I think it has something to do with the aperture blades or mechanism but this is just a wild guess.
Of course yours could be a totally different story related with the focus issue.
__________________
Michael

Gloire a qui n'ayant pas d'ideal sacro-saint se borne a ne pas trop emmerder ses voisins (Brassens)

My site
  Reply With Quote

no way
Old 11-13-2010   #10
leicashot
Registered User
 
leicashot's Avatar
 
leicashot is offline
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 1,505
no way

Quote:
Originally Posted by horosu View Post
I recevied the new Summilux 35/1.4 ASPH FLE just last week.

Well, when shaking the lens one can hear something rattle inside the lens. I didn't know if this was normal, but the lens was also plainly wrong calibrated (it backfocused a lot), so I sent it in for repair.

Was very dissappointed to put down 5000 USD and have such issues out of the box.

None of my Zeiss lenses (bought new or second-hand) developed wobble, rattle and all of them were perfectly calibrated.

Just to put things into perspective...

Horea
This lens should have ZERO wobble. The test sample I received from Leica has zero movement and seemed better built than the previous model.
__________________
WEBSITE

LEICAHUB on Facebook
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #11
Olsen
Registered User
 
Olsen's Avatar
 
Olsen is offline
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,843
I have had two ZM lenses: 50 mm 2,0 and 25 mm 2,8. The 50 mm 2,0 did wobble, but I could not see any bad effects on files or prints. Quite on the contrary. Sharpness and contrast was high and very even over the surface. In this respect; far better than my Leica Noctilux - which is neither sharp with rather low contrast and with hefty distortion. The latter cost 5 times as much as the ZM.

I regret that I sold these lenses. First, because they produced excellent results with my M8. Second; because I destroyed much of my reputation on the small 2.hand market of M-lenses here in Norway. I was not aware of the wobble before after I had sold it and got a lot of pepper because of it.

My Canon 28-70 mm 2,8L did also wobble. I gave it away to my nephew. He repaired it. I then bought a 24-28 mm 2,8L 2.hand. It wobbled too! I had it repaired for 20 $ at the Canon here in Oslo. These heavy Canon zooms are very prone to wobbling, I was told at the Canon service center. It is an easy and cheap thing to fix. The hassle for many of us here in Europe is that customs might demand that we pay VAT one more time, claiming it is a new product, and all that. So, it is not only a matter of sending it to the factory to have them repaired.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #12
kbg32
neo-romanticist
 
kbg32's Avatar
 
kbg32 is offline
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 4,850
I have 3 ZM lenses, the 18, 21/4.5, and the 25/2.8. All are stellar lenses, but my 25 has a really bad case of the wobbles, and "squeels" when you focus it. It definitely needs attention. The lubricant has all but dried out. My other ZM lenses are fine. I haven't had this issue at all with my CV or Leitz lenses and some of the latter are over 30 years old.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #13
sanmich
Registered User
 
sanmich's Avatar
 
sanmich is offline
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 3,123
I wonder how much of these wobble issues are simply an optical retaining nut getting a bit loose, and could be solved with just a spanner wrench?
I had such an issue on a summicron-c 40mm back from a fresh CLA...
__________________
Michael

Gloire a qui n'ayant pas d'ideal sacro-saint se borne a ne pas trop emmerder ses voisins (Brassens)

My site
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #14
ferider
Registered User
 
ferider's Avatar
 
ferider is offline
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 10,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanmich View Post
I wonder how much of these wobble issues are simply an optical retaining nut getting a bit loose, and could be solved with just a spanner wrench?
I had such an issue on a summicron-c 40mm back from a fresh CLA...
That's the thing: there is wobble and wobble.

(a) retaining ring is loose - very easy fix, and I consider this quite normal when the lens travels with you a bit. I had that with a 40 Summicron-C and a 35/2.5 Color Skopar. Usually optics are not affected at all. At least one case of a wobbling ZM 25/2.8 on RFF was fixable like this.

(b) optical cylinder start separating. I had that with a 50/1.5 Nokton, and it can happen also at least to the 35/1.7 Ultron, 35/1.2 Nokton, 50/2 Planar and 35/2 Biogon. To fix, you have to take off the front element to reach internal screws that need tightening and nail polish. Not so pleasant, and possible change of optical collimation.

(c) glued lens elements that start falling apart. That's the worst since not easily fixable yourself. The 35/2 v4 (Bokeh King) is known for this. Why glue was used instead of retaining rings is a miracle to me.

Roland.
__________________
My Smugmug

Last edited by ferider : 11-12-2010 at 10:58.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #15
Olsen
Registered User
 
Olsen's Avatar
 
Olsen is offline
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,843
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanmich View Post
I wonder how much of these wobble issues are simply an optical retaining nut getting a bit loose, and could be solved with just a spanner wrench?
I had such an issue on a summicron-c 40mm back from a fresh CLA...
On the Canon lenses they changed a plastic ring which tightened the construction. I have heard that it is something similar that is being done with the ZM lenses. It is a cheap fix.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #16
briz
Registered User
 
briz is offline
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 24
Bought an 28 2.8 on the bay and sent it back. My 50 2 and 25 2.8 have no problems.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #17
MCTuomey
Registered User
 
MCTuomey's Avatar
 
MCTuomey is offline
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: U.S.
Age: 60
Posts: 2,656
25/2.8 - solid
28/2.8 - solid
35/2.8 - solid
35/2 - slight play in focus ring, repaired well by zeiss
50/1.5 - solid
50/2 - tight focus ring, repaired well by zeiss

leitz 35/2 v4 - needed tightening twice in ~ 2 yrs, aperture ring still too loose for my taste
__________________
--Mike (confirmed midget imagist on stilts)

Bill Pierce's "photographer's proposition": I saw something wonderful, let me show it to you.

Leica and Zeiss M
Fuji X-T1 GX680 F30
Canon EOS
Minolta Autocord


My Flickr

Last edited by MCTuomey : 11-12-2010 at 11:06.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #18
coelacanth
Ride, dive, shoot.
 
coelacanth's Avatar
 
coelacanth is offline
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 2,633
Only ZM I have is 35/2.8. And that lens is super solid with no wobble, no nothin'.
__________________
- Sug

b/w japanese dude.

flickr | RFF Gallery | @SuguruN | Sug on G+ | Portfolio (beta)

  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #19
kdemas
ʎlʇuǝɹǝɟɟıp sƃuıɥʇ ǝǝS
 
kdemas's Avatar
 
kdemas is offline
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,630
I have had my 25/2.8 get the wobble twice, both times it was the retaining ring/nut. Easy fix but annoying.

Why do I put up with it? The lens is superb from a performance perspective.
__________________
------------------------------------------------------------
Open Iris. Life, Captured.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #20
robbeiflex
Registered User
 
robbeiflex's Avatar
 
robbeiflex is offline
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Luxembourg
Posts: 865
My 50mm Planar is rock solid.
__________________
"They say, ‘If you use this digital camera, you can take a clear picture in the dark’. The dark should stay dark. You can’t really see that much, and you don’t really want to see that much anyway.” Nobuyoshi Araki 2006

My Flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #21
jplomley
Registered User
 
jplomley is offline
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 181
I currently have six Leica lenses and they all perfect. Mechanically, no faults whatsoever. These lenses are built to outlast me.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #22
Vickko
Registered User
 
Vickko is offline
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Canada
Age: 55
Posts: 2,750
I have had a few Leica R lenses with wobble. But never Leica M's with wobble.
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #23
Costo Kim
Registered User
 
Costo Kim is offline
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 52
I'm using zm planar with significant wobble for a few years
I've bought it second hand in this state and no deterioration noticed
and I cannot see any troubles with sharpness wide open and/or stopped down
__________________
Flickr Streetcorn Seencere

Last edited by Costo Kim : 11-12-2010 at 12:50. Reason: spelling
  Reply With Quote

Old 11-12-2010   #24
dyao
Registered User
 
dyao is offline
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 264
my 35/2 has no wobble but it has slight play in the focus ring.
__________________
tumblr

flickr
  Reply With Quote

Old 04-29-2011   #25
KM-25
Get off of here and shoot
 
KM-25's Avatar
 
KM-25 is offline
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Colorado
Age: 47
Posts: 1,125
I just received a mint used chrome 50/2 that is flawless in operation, no wobble, no stiffness. In fact, it is even better than my 35 Summicron..
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 23:02.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All content on this site is Copyright Protected and owned by its respective owner. You may link to content on this site but you may not reproduce any of it in whole or part without written consent from its owner.