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Help with HC110 ....Please
Old 02-19-2012   #1
helenhill_HH
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Help with HC110 ....Please

I have been using Rodinal the last few years and decided to try
HC110 / arghhhhhh

I read somewhere online You do not need to Dilute Solution, You can use it straight from the bottle
I did a ratio:
10ml of HC110 to 500ml Water / 7.5 minutes and for the FIRST Time using HP 5 / 20C
A Recipe for Disaster

My negatives were BLANK ...

Can someone PLEASE steer me in the Right Direction
With some recipes / ratio

Thanks Much. ...
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Old 02-19-2012   #2
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Helen, you have to dilute it, but not that much for the time. I would use Dilution B for the above time which would be and use 3.9 ml per 500ml. For Trix (with B) I use about 6 minutes and agitate after 30 seconds initial, 3 inversions every 3 minutes, so only once. I use Dilution H with HC-110 which is 7.8 ml of US HC-110 (500ml) and develop 11 minutes and 30 seconds for Trix at 250 (agitate 30 seconds then 3 inversions at each 4 minutes). Still, it shouldn't have been blank just very thin. So look for something else.

Thanks for the avatar change.
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Old 02-19-2012   #3
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Helen,

That seems way underdone to me. I use HC-110 at dilution E (1:47) with Tri-X, which shouldn't be that different from HP5+. That gives me 12.5ml out of 600ml in a two-reel plastic tank or 10ml out of 480ml in a steel tank (the latter only works for rolls of 24 as you require 6.25ml per 36 frame roll; so you'd have to add the extra and just maybe develop for a shorter period, though if it exhausts it shouldn't matter).

At 20C I agitate for the 1st 30 seconds (invert and roll, invert and roll etc.) then for 10 seconds at each subsequent minute mark to the 7th minute, then empty and stop by flushing at the 8th minute. I fix with Ilford rapid fixer and all works out fine. (At 22C I do the same, but for seven minutes instead of eight.)

There's lots of stuff to read on HC-110 at:

http://www.covingtoninnovations.com/hc110/

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Old 02-19-2012   #4
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Hey Helen, here is some good reading for HC110,
http://www.covingtoninnovations.com/hc110/
I do dilution B which is 1:31, in a 2 reel paterson tank, its 18.8 ml of hc110 (i round it off to 19) and the rest water to make the 600ML's...
I usually do times around 6:30 or so for Trix... I noticed times are all over the place, thats what I ended up doing.. Everything I have in the gallery is HC110 this way with tri-x..
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Old 02-19-2012   #5
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It's true that you don't need to make up a stock solution. I mix the syrup straight from the bottle (I decant it into 100ml medicine bottles and use a syringe to get it out). The syrup dissolves readily in water with a bit of a stir.

I'd have thought HP5 in 1+50 for 7.5 mins would have been enough to get negs with some sort of image, so I"m tempted to agree that the issue may lie elsewhere.
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Old 02-19-2012   #6
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Helen- you should take a look at the Covington site, and track down a 50ml syringe. You must know someone who knows a nurse or doc that can grab you one. I mix from the syrup only. I almost always use dilution B, which is 31ml of syrup and 969ml of water. I use 16ml in a half Liter. Precision measurements are important when working with the syrup, thus the syringe (No needle needed, just the plastic bit).

The concentrate lasts plenty well in the bottle even if opened. You shoot enough film to get through it with no worries.

edit: seems everyone knows Covington.
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Old 02-19-2012   #7
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Helen: what you said you did sounds in the ballpark enough to give you usable negs. I suspect you may have done something different from what you thought you did.

I suggest shooting a quick roll of nothing important and carefully repeating what you said you did. I am betting you get a different result.
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Old 02-19-2012   #8
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Helen,
I only use HC-110 at dilution H 1/63. For 1 film you need minimum 6ml of juice and 378ml of water. For 2 films I use 9ml and 567ml of water. Tri-x at 400, 12 mins at 68 with first minute agitation and 1 inversion every minute. Same for neopan 400 but only 10 mins.
I use a kids syringe 5ml, the type used to give cough strup.
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Old 02-19-2012   #9
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Ok, Thanks EVERYBODY for the Additional Ratios to try / btw, I do Have a Syringe

John & Nomad ....look elsewhere for Issue

does that mean I thought I shot a Roll and Didn't...The Entire Roll after developing was BLANK
So I possibly went through 36 shots and never had the film in properly ????
oh Gawd now I 'feel' like I am losing my Mind

or is there something else to 'Look' For ...
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Old 02-19-2012   #10
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Are you sure you removed the lens cap?
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Old 02-19-2012   #11
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Blank can mean a few things- no edge printing means no development at all, and occasionally this means fixer before developer. I've done that before. Edgeprint and no images means (usually) a mis-loaded camera. HP5 has lots of edgeprinting- barcodes and numbers and the name.
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Old 02-19-2012   #12
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am i the only one who gets confused by hc-110 dilutions? My bottle says dilution B is 1:7 dilution. I've always been confused about this.
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Old 02-19-2012   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregoryniss View Post
am i the only one who gets confused by hc-110 dilutions? My bottle says dilution B is 1:7 dilution. I've always been confused about this.
I think they mean working solution, already diluted.. We are working off the pure hc110 straight from the bottle...
I think
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Old 02-19-2012   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregoryniss View Post
am i the only one who gets confused by hc-110 dilutions? My bottle says dilution B is 1:7 dilution. I've always been confused about this.
I understand. The HC110 syrup I buy in Europe is much more concentrated than the syrup sold in Japan (US import I think).
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Old 02-19-2012   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lflex View Post
I understand. The HC110 syrup I buy in Europe is much more concentrated than the syrup sold in Japan (US import I think).
Or is it the other way around?
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Old 02-19-2012   #16
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The 'European version' of the syrup is weaker, and comes in smaller bottles (half litre?). It also works out rather more expensive to get to working solution. Fortunately, the 1 litre US bottles are readily available in Europe.

On solutions, there is the syrup, a stock solution, and a working solution. The idea is that one makes up stock solution in batches and then dilutes it further to working solution when about to use it. I'm not sure if the stock solution has a shorter lifespan than syrup. I presume the reason for making it is for easier measuring due to using larger quantities. However, I think most people find they get on fine with straight syrup and a syringe.
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Old 02-20-2012   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankS View Post
Or is it the other way around?
No, the syrup I buy in europe requires 79 parts water to make solution F



The one in Japan requires only 19 parts water.
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Old 02-19-2012   #18
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With 100 iso films, I develop using Rodinal, 1:100, 30 minutes total, continuous agitation for first minute, then just 10 seconds once after 15 minutes.

With 400 iso film like HP5, I develop using HC-110, 1:100, 20 minutes total, continuous agitation for first minute, then 10 seconds every 3 minutes.
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Old 02-19-2012   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Michaels View Post
Helen: what you said you did sounds in the ballpark enough to give you usable negs. I suspect you may have done something different from what you thought you did.
I suggest shooting a quick roll of nothing important and carefully repeating what you said you did. I am betting you get a different result.
Yes Quite Right ...The recipe I did is within a certain reason but should Not have produced Total Blanks
Back to the Drawing Board and start again...hopefully My Brain-Mind will be In FULL Control ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by sepiareverb View Post
Blank can mean a few things- no edge printing means no development at all, and occasionally this means fixer before developer. I've done that before. Edgeprint and no images means (usually) a mis-loaded camera. HP5 has lots of edgeprinting- barcodes and numbers and the name.
Oh Dear . I wonder if I did Fixer before Developer ...NEVER did that before but there is Always a First Time
I usually Develop first thing Saturday Mornings but I did it Late Last Night anticipating some New Shots...

Jeez, What a Jacka** I am if I did ...lol

Well at Least I have some NEW & FUN Recipes to try
though I will stick with my TriX & Tmax combo for Now

THANKS AGAIN, and This is Why I LOVE RFF
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Old 02-19-2012   #20
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Helen, sorry to hear that !!

To confuse you further ... I stopped using a syringe and trying to measure an exact amount of a syrup but now make the "stock-solution" as suggested by Kodak.

That is I dilute 100ml of syrup (much easier to measure) with 300ml of water resulting in my stock solution (that is stable at for at least one month when kept cool in the fridge). To make solution "B" I then dilute 1 part of the stock-solution with 7 parts of water and voila.
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Old 02-19-2012   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
.............................. though I will stick with my TriX & Tmax combo for Now
Helen: I have found that what works well for TriX also works well for HP5 (also for Neopan 400) I shot Neopan 400 for 9 years with two 6 month stints of shooting HP5 in the middle there because of availability. I have shot TriX for the last year (Freestyle branded) because of price. Each transition took at least a month shooting rolls of both and developing them in the same tank. I still cannot tell a difference.

Remember just to change one variable at a time. Some people will change film and change developers at the same time, and then speak that their comparisons of one element in the mix are valid.

Also remember that Kodak, Ilford and Fuji have done a lot of research on their products. Read the instructions and follow them until you are consistent enough to know how to tweak things to suit you. I am amazed the new folks who believe that the poster, ILeicaDude, knows more about developing Kodak film in Kodak chemistry that Kodak ever figured out.
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Old 02-20-2012   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Michaels View Post
Also remember that Kodak, Ilford and Fuji have done a lot of research on their products. Read the instructions and follow them until you are consistent enough to know how to tweak things to suit you. I am amazed the new folks who believe that the poster, ILeicaDude, knows more about developing Kodak film in Kodak chemistry that Kodak ever figured out.
That's kind of hard to do these days with TriX and HC110, given how Kodak contradict themselves: they warn against developing times less than five minutes, then recommend a developing time of less than 5 minutes for TriX in HC110.
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Old 02-19-2012   #23
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You should have got an image Helen. Stop bath is similar in color to HC110 developer. You might not use that, most don't. But if you do that's probably what you did. Don't give up on the HP-5. Try again.
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Old 02-19-2012   #24
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I make a working solution, as suggested by Kodak. It is thin enough so that it is easy to pour and measure easily, and if distilled water is used the working solution lasts at least a year.

I usually mix 12 or 16 ounces of working solution at a time, rather than the entire bottle of HC-110.

1 ounce of working solution plus seven ounces of water equals 8 ounces of dilution B for one roll of 35mm film.

Good luck.
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Old 02-19-2012   #25
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I've just started developing film at home, and the very first rolled I tried was blank. It was a filing error; I had erroneously put a new roll of TriX on the shelf reserved for exposed ones. The error was compounded by my having used a leader extractor on the exposed rolls in preparation for my loading them onto developing reels.

Given the choice between wasting a roll of film by developing it unexposed and wasting one by exposing it twice and ruining two sets of exposures, I decided that the former was the lesser of two evils.
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