What does it mean to be a professional photographer?

[bene]

Hi I am keen on 'turning pro' I am completing my BSC in economics and am planning to apply for a BFA in photography while working as a part time photographer to build a portfolio and learn the business side of things.

I just wonder if my reason to turn pro is valid or it is just castles built on clouds...

Do something i love.
I want to take better pictures and get exposure
buy better gear :D

I find that I dont like the office work enviroment . stiffling. I fear a mid/ quater life crisis!

I am keen on being a wedding photographer as I like to capture moments adding realism into a wedding no matter how fairytale like it may be.
Powerful protraits that capture the essence of the person.
Free to create and observe life and from a corner share their feelings.

It feel like a job with great freedom but I think that is dependent on which aspect.

[Mcary]

I just wonder if my reason to turn pro is valid or it is just castles built on clouds...

Do something i love.
I want to take better pictures and get exposure
buy better gear :D

.

"Do something I love" Not saying it will happen but a lot of the time the pressure of meeting deadline's,paying bills and not knowing where/when your next job is coming from can quickly turn something you love into something you dread.

"I want to take better pictures and get exposure " This has little or nothing to do with being a professional photographer. For every professional photograph who puts out boring un-inspiring work there are dozens of amateurs putting out amazing work.

"buy better gear" Sorry to be so blunt but this is the dumbest reason for becoming a professional photographer. Smart professional photographer's only buy equipment that will give them a good return on their money.
Amateur: you decide what equipment you want.
Pro: Your accountant decides what equipment you need. Ok its not that bad.

Reason for being a professional photographer; I want to provide a quality product while making a good living doing it.

[ampguy]

I think wedding photography is declining. Weddings are downsizing, and most everyone knows a friend or relative with a camera who can do the job for free.

Check out zivity.com - if you can get some work up there, you're a pro. You can try it out with an email invite code on my blog for 30 days.

It's a lot easier to find a model interested in the possibility of making some spare cash, than someone getting married, willing to pay a stranger hundreds or thousands of dollars for taking some snapshots for a couple of hours.

Hi I am keen on 'turning pro' I am completing my BSC in economics and am planning to apply for a BFA in photography while working as a part time photographer to build a portfolio and learn the business side of things.

I just wonder if my reason to turn pro is valid or it is just castles built on clouds...

Do something i love.
I want to take better pictures and get exposure
buy better gear :D

I find that I dont like the office work enviroment . stiffling. I fear a mid/ quater life crisis!

I am keen on being a wedding photographer as I like to capture moments adding realism into a wedding no matter how fairytale like it may be.
Powerful protraits that capture the essence of the person.
Free to create and observe life and from a corner share their feelings.

It feel like a job with great freedom but I think that is dependent on which aspect.

[bene]

Thanks for the reality check! But, its something i wish to try a least for 1 yr but i am still far from it =).

[Roger Hicks]

Take what you want, and pay for it, saieth the Lord.

The chances of making a good living at photography are slender, and plenty quit when they don't make enough to live on. As Mike says, there's a lot of administration and cash flow can be more interesting than you would like.

There are basically three options:

1 Work your arse off taking boring pictures for boring people. Honestly, that's what the vast majority of professional photography is. Advertising in the 70s was OK when there was lots of money and wine around but I'd not want to do it nowadays. Weddings are probably on the decline, as noted. There's still a surprising amount of industrial work around, if you can get excited about photographing heavy machinery. Fashion photographers go in and out of fashion. Car photography in the studio can apparently still pay OK, and so (I am told) can furniture. And glamour. But specialization is the key to most professional photography, and ANYTHING can get boring if you do too much of it.

2 Do whatever you damn' well please, and live on very little, often with part-time Mcjobs to help with the cash flow. Many of the best photographers I have ever met have chosen this approach. I know one -- much exhibited, lauded, published, prize-winning -- who has been known to work as a cinema usherette in order to pay for her phtographic habit.

3 Remain an amateur, and work at something else for a living.

The chances of fame and fortune are about equal for all three, though the third is probably a more reliable route to fortune if not fame.

And if you can't afford good kit now, what are you going to use when you start out as a professional? Professional kit is taken for granted, horribly expensive though it is.

Cheers,

R.

[bene]

Thanks Roger. It Echos don't quit your day job in a good way. Keeps me grounded.

[Pickett Wilson]

"Thanks for the reality check! But, its something i wish to try a least for 1 yr but i am still far from it =)."

Forget professional photography. Something you want to try at least for a year? Forget toying at professional photography! Unless you are committed to it and unless there is nothing else you want to do with your life, you aren't going to make it.

In the second decade of the 21st century, you are unlikely to make a living as a professional photographer. If you do, you are unlikely to make a very good living. You will have to work incredibly hard every day. Every day. You will have to make great sacrifices. It's got to be worth everything to you.

It's also the greatest job in the world. But, if you can be happy doing anything else, do something else. There are too many poseurs with expensive equipment calling themselves professionals.

[Roger Hicks]

Thanks Roger. It Echos don't quit your day job in a good way. Keeps me grounded.

You're welcome. Here's a further thought: see if you can get a job as an assistant in an advertising studio, for a few months or yes, even a year, instead of a BFA. The pay will be lousy; you'll have to sweep the floor and paint out the cove and find Christmas decorations in July and lots more, but you won't need your own equipment and you can see how you like it. That's how I started. But as you probably know, although I've done plenty of purely photographic jobs (where I was paid for pics only) the main way I keep my head above water is by writing as well as taking pictures -- and that's been pretty precarious at times.

I'll echo the argument that the only reason to be a photographer is that you can't really imagine doing anything else.

Cheers,

R.

[payasam]

You'll find yourself doing many things you don't like and only a couple that you love, sometimes none at all. A year is too short a period. No one can become a good and successful photographer - or house painter or concert pianist - in that time.

[Chris101]

Oh geez. Being a professional photographer just means that you take pictures that other people want for money.

[bene]

Ever so often I comeback to this thread to ground myself to reality.
But Mr Hicks'

2 Do whatever you damn' well please, and live on very little, often with part-time Mcjobs to help with the cash flow. Many of the best photographers I have ever met have chosen this approach. I know one -- much exhibited, lauded, published, prize-winning -- who has been known to work as a cinema usherette in order to pay for her phtographic habit.

has become an attractive option that I might take.
I am curious how far my "passion" for photography will last.
I won't use the term professional photographer. But a serious amateur seem more appropriate.
I plan to use the 3 month break (coming june to sept) to document my native city.

comments above have been helpful thanks.

[Vince Lupo]

One of the big problems with BFA programs is that they don't offer anything about how to be a professional photographer -- how do you build a portfolio and your business, how do you approach clients, how to retain clients, how to price things, how to make sure you're making enough money etc -- really, things that go way beyond the 'FA' in that 'BFA'. Plus, many of the teachers in these schools either have never been professional photographers, or they've been out of it for so long that their knowledge and experience can't be applied to what's going on today in the professional photography world.

My undergrad school offered a 'BAA', which was a Bachelor of Applied Arts, which I thought was much more useful than a BFA. We did have some more commercially oriented assignments and classes, as well as some business-related courses, so that definitely helped in both the short and long run.

There is much more to being a professional photographer than 'doing what you love', and unfortunately some of these schools still don't get it.

[Roger Hicks]

One of the big problems with BFA programs is that they don't offer anything about how to be a professional photographer -- how do you build a portfolio and your business, how do you approach clients, how to retain clients, how to price things, how to make sure you're making enough money etc -- really, things that go way beyond the 'FA' in that 'BFA'. Plus, many of the teachers in these schools either have never been professional photographers, or they've been out of it for so long that their knowledge and experience can't be applied to what's going on today in the professional photography world.

My undergrad school offered a 'BAA', which was a Bachelor of Applied Arts, which I thought was much more useful than a BFA. We did have some more commercially oriented assignments and classes, as well as some business-related courses, so that definitely helped in both the short and long run.

There is much more to being a professional photographer than 'doing what you love', and unfortunately some of these schools still don't get it.
Dear Vince,

Well, you know the other thing that 'FA' stands for, apart from 'Fanny Adams'.

Seriously, you must surely be something between 50% and 100% right, depending on the BFA programme.

Cheers,

R.

[Vince Lupo]

I guess the 'FA' could also be the same for an MFA???

[Keith]

Play becomes work ... and suddenly it's not quite as much fun!

[Roger Hicks]

Dear Vince,

And of course Sweet FA.

Unseen University in Ankh-Morpork awarded a Doctorem Adamus cum Flabello Dulci, or Doctorate of Sweet Fanny Adams.

Cheers,

R.

[MatthewThompson]

Diversify. Make sure you can do a few things passably well in addition to being great at a couple. 75% of my year has absolutely nothing to do with gear and shooting and models and weddings. It's a grind on the best of weeks, but doable if you're a person of reasonable flexibility.

edit: it certainly helps to have a S.O. with stable income for the inevitable dry weeks/months, not to mention a cheerleader for the times when you're pretty sure you're kidding yourself about what you chose to do with your life.

[mfunnell]

Play becomes work ... and suddenly it's not quite as much fun!That is a very important point. Whether I really could make a living as a photographer or not is one thing. (I'm not sure, but I know people in the business who have seen some of my stuff - especially event-oriented stuff that I don't put on the web - who tell me that I might.)

I also know I'd have to take an income hit by giving up my day job. That's a big thing when you've had a former partner take custody of the money (such as it was) and had a hit from the Great Flippin' Global Financial Crisis (as I have). So, best case, if I decided to give it a shot it wouldn't be for a while (essentially until I could live for a year with little-to-no income, which might have been possible in the past but isn't happening for a while now).

But that's a bit of a moot point. Photography is what I do to get away from my day job. I like what I do well enough. I'm actually pretty good at it - which is it's own reward. But it is work, and that does knock the gloss off it. Things I used to do out of enthusiasm simply go un-done these days: if I need to know that professionally, then I'll learn it - but I simply couldn't be stuffed learning for the joy of knowing or doing. Not if I don't get paid for it.

Photography I treat differently.

I am interested, and I do it for the sheer joy of learning and knowing and doing. I think I'd like to keep it that way, and use the day job to be jaded but income-earning. Which I like well enough, but can no longer be truly enthusiastic about.

That enthusiasm I reserve for photography and a couple of other things - and I think I prefer to keep it that way.

...Mike

[Bike Tourist]

"What does it mean to be a professional photographer?"

At this point in time? It means you have chosen to compete with the bride's cousin with a digital SLR, random people with cell phones, microstock agencies, photo forums where people hope you will like their pictures well enough to use them for free in a background where media is continually being cheapened and democratized.

You could be a pro photographer or front a rock band or write a great novel or have your painting displayed in the Metropolitan Museum of Art. Choose your poison.

[Pickett Wilson]

"At this point in time? It means you have chosen to compete with the bride's cousin with a digital SLR"

That was really brought home to me when I did a workshop for "beginning photographers" a few weeks ago. I expected a few folks with digital P&S cameras. What I got was a good number of moms and dads sporting brand new Canon 5DII's and Nikon D300's, a gaggle of L lenses, etc, several who had already shot wedding for pay!!!!! Now they wanted to learn a little more about photography. Had to pitch my planned workshop and wing it with them.

Modern times. You might not can buy talent yet, but it doesn't seem to take talent (or even basic knowledge of photography) to make money from photography.

[Dave Wilkinson]

There are quite a few professional and 'fine art' photographers that seem to hang around here - 24/7, arguing the toss about film and digital, and bokeh - etc....they must be earning good money from what little time they have left to take pictures!, so it may be worth joining them!. Personally, I'd recommend keeping your 'proper' job and initially trying for spare time (weekend, evenings) photo work - I did this happily for forty years! :)
Dave.

[emraphoto]

or they might be scanning, filing (FTP), working on photos, emailing (which is a surprisingly large part of the day) etc? all part of the "proper" job.

ask Pickett how much time goes into tagging, captioning and color correcting a days worth of shooting... you might be shocked.

[Vince Lupo]

Well no, that is not the point of a BFA, or an MFA, these are not vocational degrees, but liberal arts degrees. No liberal arts school sets you up to run a small business.

Don't worry so much.

Then the question is: What does a BFA set you up to do? Hope to display your photos in a gallery and make it as an 'artist'? If so, then these schools are deluding students into thinking that it's possible to make a full-time living that way. I'd think that after spending 4 years of your life, not to mention all that $$$ that it would set you up to do something. Of course, a BFA could also lead to a career in museum studies, or gallery ownership, or something on the periphery of photography, not necessarily becoming a professional photographer.

[Roger Hicks]

Then the question is: What does a BFA set you up to do? Hope to display your photos in a gallery and make it as an 'artist'? If so, then these schools are deluding students into thinking that it's possible to make a full-time living that way. I'd think that after spending 4 years of your life, not to mention all that $$$ that it would set you up to do something. Of course, a BFA could also lead to a career in museum studies, or gallery ownership, or something on the periphery of photography, not necessarily becoming a professional photographer.

Dear Vince,

As could, indeed, a degree in almost anything. Mine's in law; my brother's is in botany (and he became an accountant, merchant banker and CFO of various businesses); Frances's is in theatre studies. She says she wishes she'd done something a bit less self-indulgent.

Cheers,

R.

[JohnTF]

Mainly, a degree demonstrates you can successfully complete a program.

What you take from the experience, how you apply what you obtained, and eventually your metier is to be determined.

There are also variable components to degrees, e.g. because you end up with an MBA does not demonstrate how much that perhaps you may (or not) have gotten out of your associations outside of the core class, i.e. in classes not normally considered specific to what is printed on the diploma, nor does that diploma put you on one path only.

My first two did not show the detours, nor the other majors I declared at one time or another along the way, the McJobs, and the more interesting ones.

Professional level work is competent work, sometimes it rises to the level of art, but rather I think its goal is monetary, not necessarily aesthetic, though the two are not mutually exclusive, nor jointly exhaustive.

I sometimes wonder if art can best be defined as work you perform with no expectation of reward other than the work itself.

Coursework I have completed which was undertaken in order to hone skills along artistic lines, basically did just that, through criticism, guidance, synergy, and application, but a lot of what I still value from them was what was going on within me.

The better designed coursework used time allotted to allow and require a focus specifically on tasks necessary to produce images significantly cared about.


In short, in education all that you take in becomes part of what you produce.

If I hire someone with a PhD in Fine Arts in photography, I would hope they would have spent significant time in the field, and yes, I know they completed the program. I may expect, but do not know, how "good" they are.

If producing artistic work was quickly derived simply from the same easily obtained, perhaps rote, skill sets and universal approaches, someone would produce a shop manual.

What constitutes actual success will be covered in future symposia. ;-)

I apologize for the length of the post and the use of the phrase "In short".

Regards, John

[JohnTF]

Dear Vince,

As could, indeed, a degree in almost anything. Mine's in law; my brother's is in botany (and he became an accountant, merchant banker and CFO of various businesses); Frances's is in theatre studies. She says she wishes she'd done something a bit less self-indulgent.

Cheers,

R.

Seems she has. J

[gb hill]

You can just about forget wedding photography in this economy. Now that digital SLR's & Strobist groups are so popular everyone wants to become a professional. This has ruined it for nearly everyone. People now want the best deal & there are photographers that are willing to shoot a wedding for a few hundred dollars. The photo manager at my Sam's Club says this is what keeps them going. Photographers will come in & have prints made to sell to the couples. if your going to make it I urge you to have a look at Rangefinder magazine put out by WPPI. These photographers are the real pros, but they have established themselves for a long time & they shoot weddings for the wealthier class of folks who wouldn't think twice about plopping down a few grand for a wedding & their photos are in another class all together apart from these piddly strobist groups.

[JohnTF]

You can just about forget wedding photography in this economy. Now that digital SLR's & Strobist groups are so popular everyone wants to become a professional. This has ruined it for nearly everyone. People now want the best deal & there are photographers that are willing to shoot a wedding for a few hundred dollars. The photo manager at my Sam's Club says this is what keeps them going. Photographers will come in & have prints made to sell to the couples. if your going to make it I urge you to have a look at Rangefinder magazine put out by WPPI. These photographers are the real pros, but they have established themselves for a long time & they shoot weddings for the wealthier class of folks who wouldn't think twice about plopping down a few grand for a wedding & their photos are in another class all together apart from these piddly strobist groups.

For a long time there has seemed to be several tiers of quality in wedding photography.

There are those with limited experience, training, and moderate equipment who will shoot for nothing. Sometimes you get what you pay for, but the current technology makes better, perhaps more than slightly so, mediocre wedding photography quite possible, (at least in terms of getting focused photos of people you recognize), with someone going home from the wedding with their CD shots.

I wonder if anyone sues when they pay a couple hundred bucks, and the camera breaks down with the "pro" not having back up equipment?

Am thinking having all the photos horizontally shot is a plus, heard someone complaining on vacation that some of their photos were sideways. ;-)

Just what is the expectation with a $200 wedding contract?


Regards, John