Are You NOT Using Coded Lenses On Your M8, M8.2 ? [Archive]

murrayb53

11-02-2009, 09:13

Having purchased an M8.2 a month ago I still am looking to purchase two lenses to complete an outfit, a 28mm and a 75mm. In the meantime I own a 35mm Zeiss Biogon and am considering sending it to DAG for conversion.

I was wondering how many of you who own an M8 or M8.2 are NOT using coded lenses and are just as happy as can be? No plans to change your inventory for a coded lens?

Steve

ampguy

11-02-2009, 09:17

no coding here, other than experimenting.

CLE-RF

11-02-2009, 09:31

I used sixteen different lenses on my M8 until I sold it:

M-Hex 28mm
M-Hex 35mm
M-Hex 50mm 2.0
M-Hex 50mm 1.2
M-Hex 90mm
Komura 28mm 3.5
Kyoei Acall 35mm 3.5
Jupiter-3 & 8
Jupiter-11
Hacked Wollensak 50mm 2.8
Summicron 50mm 1st version
Elmar 90mm coll.
Summar 50mm
Canon 50mm 1.2
Kyoei Acall 135mm 3.5

Never coded any one of them, never had bad shots because of that. I was always me I had to blame when the shots were bad... :)

Cannot vouch for wide angles though, it seems there it might actually make a difference :eek: :)

Roger Hicks

11-02-2009, 10:03

I think I have used maybe 3 coded lenses out of 30 (many of them borrowed, I hasten to add). Among my favourites are the 135/2.8 Elmarit, the 50/1.5 C-Sonnar, the 50/1 Noctilux and the 90/2.2 Thambar, all uncoded, and the 24/1.4 Summilux, coded.

Cheers,

R

swoop

11-02-2009, 10:09

Shooting in RAW makes coding pointless.

None of my lenses are coded.

ashrafazlan

11-02-2009, 10:24

Does the UV/IR cut filter affect anything else besides color? Those things are expensive, and i'm only interested in shooting B&W.

victoriapio

11-02-2009, 10:41

Does the UV/IR cut filter affect anything else besides color? Those things are expensive, and i'm only interested in shooting B&W.

No the filter doesn't do anything else but there is a lot of black fabric out there looks purple under almost any light without it. The new breathable black clothing from Patagonia and others are especially susceptible to the IR shift. Get the filter if you can afford them and by the way, I use the B+W versions and they work just fine.

ashrafazlan

11-02-2009, 17:24

Thanks, i'll get one as soon as I can, in the mean time I'll just stick to B&W

robklurfield

11-02-2009, 17:28

coded: 28 elmarit, cv 15/4.5, canon 50/1.2
not coded: canon 35/2, 90/4 elmar, j8

when shooting with the non-coded lenses, I simply ask people to undress. works like a charm.

Jason Sprenger

11-02-2009, 17:52

I have only one coded lens, a Leica 28/2.8 aspherical. My 35's, 50's and and 90's are not coded and I haven't felt it necessary.

I also don't use a 28 very often, I find I use my 35's just like I do with film even though the FOV is smaller.

Ben Z

11-03-2009, 07:10

Shooting in RAW makes coding pointless.

That's not quite correct. Using the IR filters on lenses wider than 35mm causes some greenish corners (cyan) and if the lens is coded the camera will correct that, even when shooting .dng's. Personally I find enough cyan vignetting even with 35mm that I have coded all my 35mm and shorter lenses. Those longer than 35mm I have not coded. My M8 has been set to "UV/IR-ON" since day one and I have not seen any harm from leaving it that way even with uncoded lenses. However on a couple of my 80's-era lenses I had to white-paint the flange screw that rests opposite the code reader, otherwise the M8 thinks it's a 90mm lens.

ampguy

11-03-2009, 07:17

with no greenish corners.

There is an option in the menu to turn lens detection off.

The issue is that cyan or vignetting correction can never be just right, because aperture detection cannot be accurately determined.

Recommend you subscribe and read the Reid reviews articles on this issue, and if you like, go ahead and code and turn lens detection on, but also be prepared to have to post process and undo the over-corrections that will happen.

The M9 will be better, it will error on the conservative side, since during M9 development they realized aperture guessing was not possible.

That's not quite correct. Using the IR filters on lenses wider than 35mm causes some greenish corners (cyan) and if the lens is coded the camera will correct that, even when shooting .dng's. Personally I find enough cyan vignetting even with 35mm that I have coded all my 35mm and shorter lenses. Those longer than 35mm I have not coded. My M8 has been set to "UV/IR-ON" since day one and I have not seen any harm from leaving it that way even with uncoded lenses. However on a couple of my 80's-era lenses I had to white-paint the flange screw that rests opposite the code reader, otherwise the M8 thinks it's a 90mm lens.

Tom Niblick

11-03-2009, 12:16

My 21 Biogon is coded but my 35 Summicron, 35 Color Skopar, and 90 Elmarit are not coded.

I've never noticed any problems with the 35s or the 90. Of course, I don't shoot white walls very often so a slight cyan tint in the corners would go unnoticed.

Opps, I just looked over a few hundred 35 Summicron shots and I found a touch of blue in the corner of two shots. The photos are of white sails in overcast daylight and they might have about 2 or 3 percent more cyan in the extreme corners... but you have to look hard to see the shift. Here's one that has a slight shift in the upper left corner.

Tom

Vince Lupo

11-03-2009, 13:09

So goofball question here - what happens if you don't use coded lenses? And what if you use a lens that's so old that it couldn't be converted, like a 105/6.3 Mountain Elmar or a 50/1.5 Xenon?

Roger, I'd be interested to see some results from your Thambar!

nksyoon

11-03-2009, 13:30

I've noticed green corners a few times with an uncoded Ultron 28/1.9 and B+W 486 filter, but it depends on the scene. No problems with uncoded 35 and longer.

JPSuisse

11-03-2009, 14:55

I'm using:

50 Lux ASPH Coded w/Filter
35 Cron ASPH Coded w/Filter
28 Cron ASPH Coded w/Filter
21 Biogon Uncoded w/out Filter

No problems with the 21 Biogon at all. It's a great lens!! And I haven't had any "disturbing" purple effects yet either... I can't really tell a difference using filters. At least the filters on the 50 and the 35 don't disturb film. But, the filter on the 28 causes nasty vignetting on film.

Now, the question that I have is that what if I use the 21 Biogon without coding but with Filter? I haven't experimented with this yet and there is no option in the menu for it!

JP

Imaji

11-03-2009, 16:41

I'm using a coded 35 summicron and uncoded CV 50 f2 Heliar. No issues with the uncoded heliar at all.

Ming Rider

11-03-2009, 16:58

Quote "Are You NOT Using Coded Lenses On Your M8, M8.2 ?"

No

ampguy

11-03-2009, 18:39

even when you do need a UV/IR filter for color work with the magenta issues.

Depending on your non Leica 21, it may be possible to experiment, but first it would need to bring up the same framelines as the equivalent Leica lens, so either newer Zeiss 21?? or modified mount by John Millich or sending back to Zeiss.

I've only used CV 15s and 21s, they work great on the M8 with and without UV/IR filters, on the lens detection off setting. I have used the 15 with lens detection on as a WATE while experimenting, but reverted to lens detection off.

I'm using:

50 Lux ASPH Coded w/Filter
35 Cron ASPH Coded w/Filter
28 Cron ASPH Coded w/Filter
21 Biogon Uncoded w/out Filter

No problems with the 21 Biogon at all. It's a great lens!! And I haven't had any "disturbing" purple effects yet either... I can't really tell a difference using filters. At least the filters on the 50 and the 35 don't disturb film. But, the filter on the 28 causes nasty vignetting on film.

Now, the question that I have is that what if I use the 21 Biogon without coding but with Filter? I haven't experimented with this yet and there is no option in the menu for it!

JP

larryk34

11-03-2009, 19:19

Never have; never had any problem. I saw all the tests done by Reid's review, but I never could produce any of the effects he was eliminating with the coding. 24mm Asph, 35mm lux asph, 50mm pre-asph lux, and 75mm lux. No problem with any. Blues skies, white skies, white walls, I just couldn't make it happen. So, my advice is to take pictures without coding and keep going until you encounter a problem. Why solve a problem you may never have?

hunghang

11-03-2009, 20:31

I gave coding a go and bought the M-coder/D-coder. Too much effort for not much benefit (to me) apart from being able to tell which focal length was used.

Anyone after an M-coder/D-coder ? :)

Ben Z

11-04-2009, 06:00

I use a lot of 28'swith no greenish corners.

I only use 2, a type-IV Elmarit and an f/1.9 Ultron but both produce cyan corners if the coding isn't used.

The issue is that cyan or vignetting correction can never be just right, because aperture detection cannot be accurately determined.

Recommend you subscribe and read the Reid reviews articles on this issue, and if you like, go ahead and code and turn lens detection on, but also be prepared to have to post process and undo the over-corrections that will happen.

I have the 12 (which requires Cornerfix), 15 Heliar, 21 Elmarit pre-ASPH, 21 Skopar, the 2 28's mentioned above, and 2 35 Summicrons, all which I hand-coded (permanently by milling the black slots) and all which the M8 takes care of the cyan with no overcorrection at any aperture. If there's a problem with other lenses, I am not prepared to say. I'm done buying lenses, these are it for me.

I was a Reid subscriber for a year. With over two years of shooting the M8 I have my own hard-fought experience to go on now, which I prefer over theory or anything I might read on the internet that appears to contradict what I've seen in practice.

Jim Evidon

11-04-2009, 22:33

It is my understanding that coding is useful for wide angle lenses only. According to comments I have read in Reid Reviews, anything 50mm or longer do not benefit much from the coding, whereas for focal lengths under 50mm, coding will assist in avoiding minor vignetting on the edges.
The only lenses that I have coded are the 15mm CV Heliar and the 35mm CV Ultron. I also have a 35mm CV Nokton that is not coded, and frankly, I see no difference in edge brightness between the two. My uncoded 40mm Summicron is bright all the way across, so it seems that as focal length increases, the need for coding decreases.

Doug

11-05-2009, 12:19

At first I used no coding and no filters on my M8, 15mm, 21mm, 28mm, 35mm. I soon found I needed the filters. With the filters in use, I found I needed the coding. All confirmed again when I got a used 18 ZM and tried out CornerFix.

So now all the lenses (including several 50s) I use on the M8 are coded except the rarely-used 15. I do like the lens ID in EXIF, so when and if I ever use the 75mm Heliar on the M8 I'll dab some black & white fingernail polish in the pits of a Milich 50/75 adapter so it will ID as a 75 Summarit.

crusius

11-05-2009, 13:01

For those who want to code LTM lenses:

A "kipon" adapter, with pre-milled 6-bit slots, is now starting to show up on Ebay. Same price as non-milled Voigtlander adapters.

- Cesar

Jim-st

02-12-2010, 09:31

I got a Kipon today, but can't get it to work on my CV LTM lenses on the M8. It brings up the correct framelines (in this case 24 & 35mm), but there's no lens model showing up in the exif data. So I guess it's not going to deal with vignetting or cyan issues either (though I've not received my filters yet from Leica so can't test yet)

Anyone else used these adapters?

Do you need to paint in the white as well as black markings? If so, what medium would you recommend - I've done the black with a Staedler marker, but have no white to try with?

TIA and kind regards

jaapv

02-12-2010, 09:40

Jim-st

02-12-2010, 10:03

Thanks jaapv - I'll see if I can get some Humbrol tommorrow and give it a try

Best wishes

Jim

Ben Z

02-13-2010, 07:43

I used that automobile touch-up paint that comes in the little tubes with the brush inside. It's made to stick tenaciously to bare metal without a primer. It's glossy, but that hasn't seemed to pose a problem for the code reader on my M8.