4x5 YANKEE or FR

[ARCHIVIST]

I am happily using my Busch Pressman model D 4x5 with its RF.

Deep tank processing is very good but daylight would be more convenient - not standing in the dark etc.

I have the option on two classic US dev tanks, the FR and the Yankee.

Do any of you have experience with these two tanks? Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Regards
Peter

[biomed]

In the 1970s I used the Kodak hard rubber tanks with metal film holders - processing had to be done in the dark. I also used a Yankee daylight tank that held several sheets of film. I don't recall any particular problems with the Yankee tank.

[Roger Hicks]

Dear Peter,

I don't really like either (and I've used 'em). I'd back Jobo or Gepe/HP, though the latter is much more successful with 2 sheets per side than with 3.

Cheers,

R.

[ARCHIVIST]

I have a couple of JOBO tanks with the 4x5 reels. As you all know they are designed for rotary processing but can be used as a hand process tank.

I find them cumbersome to load by hand and the price of the JOBO sheet loader is excessive to say the least. Have also owned and used the HP Combi Plan tank. This I found took too long to fill and drain and, yes, you are correct in saying that two sheets per side is the way to go.

Apart from the fact that the Yankee and FR tanks are truly 'wet' tanks when you process is there any real drawbacks in using them? I intend to limit the number of sheets I process to six at a time.

I am interested in the Yankee and the FR as I like the ease of loading with the film guide that comes with each and also their compact designs. I will be selling my two JOBOs and the four 4x5 reels that I have.

Regards
Peter

[Gottfried Sandow]

there is a good discussion on the Yankee to be read here:

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=41584&highlight=yankee

I´ve been using mine with no problems for a long time. Only disadvantage to me was, it´s not water tight so you´ll have to stay in the darkroom. But it can hold up to 12 negs - as for me that´s a big plus !
Cheers, Gottfried

[Roger Hicks]

I am interested in the Yankee and the FR as I like the ease of loading with the film guide that comes with each and also their compact designs. I will be selling my two JOBOs and the four 4x5 reels that I have.

Regards
Peter

Dear Peter,

I found them quite hard to load, with the same problem as the Gepe: the film tends to bow and touch, even after loading correctly, unless you miss alternate spaces. They're also slow to fill and empty. I've not used them for years: I currently have a Doran and a Yankee, and I preferred the Yankee to the FR.

What about buying a CPE-2 and using the Jobo as rotary?

Or -- and these are hard to find nowadays -- consider a Dallan stainless steel. Google Dallan and you might find something. I've had these for 4x5 but currently only have a 6x9.

Yet another possiblity is modifying a Paterson Orbital, which is how I do 4x5 now: http://www.rogerandfrances.com/subscription/ps%20how%20orbital.html


Cheers,

R.

[Trius]

In addition to Roger's comment about the loading issues of the Yankee, I always found problems with agitation, resulting in uneven development.

If you have a problem with standing in the dark, get a stool and sit! ;)

I've never used Jobo or the Orbital. For the money, deep tank or tray is the way to go.

That said, I acquired another Yankee tank last winter, and will actually give it another go at some point. I'm just not expecting much success.

[thetooth]

i use a yankee and have been very happy with it . just have to be very gentle with your agitation cycle because the lid is light tight but not water tight .

i once tried a friends hp combi tank and did not care for it .

[Al Kaplan]

I had Yankee for a few years but I went back to using stainless steel hangers. The Yankee takes to long to fill and drain. Also, it's a two hand operation. With a standard Nikor type tank for roll film you can handle the tank with one hand.

Working with film hangers in the tark isn't al that bad. I've sometimes used a lift rod with reels and develop in the dark when I needed precise timing.

[newsgrunt]

Look for used Simma tubes and roller bases. Four sheets per load and consistent.

[Andrew Howes]

How much 4x5 do you do?
I am happy with my steel hangers in the dark at present but if I were doing a few processing runs a week I would be looking for an alternative. I have been following all the threads on processing sheet film and my conclusion is that some people are happy with each of the options but there is usually more opposition to each option than support. Seems a perfect solution to daylight sheet film processing is elusive, we must put up with leaky tanks, fiddly loading, slow fill and drain, uneven edges, high cost. (some of those options cost more than my LF camera and lens)

[nikon_sam]

I had a FR tank but never used it...I sold it to colyn for the price of shipping...
I currently have and use a Nikor 4x5 SS Tank...
You can find them on *bay but prices may vary from $80 to over $200...I saw one go for $260...it all depends if there's a bidding war for it or not...
I paid around $80 for the one I have...
I find them fairly easy to load, it holds up to 12 sheets and it's adjustable...
If you find one make sure the metal "Film Band" comes with it...sometimes they're missing...I've read that some folks use a rubber band instead...

[Trius]

If sheet film weren't such a niche, I'd design and build an alternative. The solution can't be that hard. The key in labs was nitrogen burst agitation. Of course, some of the machines were somewhat complex and expensive, but there was the volume to support that.

I see the main issue as quick fill. Quick drain shouldn't be a huge issue, and an alternative to nitrogen burst for agitation shouldn't be impossible.

But then, I'm thinking about this several years too late. :(

[ARCHIVIST]

Certainly a wealth of opinion for and against certain tank types.

It would appear that what ever 'devil' you can work with then stick with it. There is absolutely no 'this is the best way' is there?

Somebody from my work suggested the English Johnson 4x5 tank. Has anyone heard of this?

Peter

[ChrisN]

If sheet film weren't such a niche, I'd design and build an alternative. The solution can't be that hard. The key in labs was nitrogen burst agitation. Of course, some of the machines were somewhat complex and expensive, but there was the volume to support that.

I see the main issue as quick fill. Quick drain shouldn't be a huge issue, and an alternative to nitrogen burst for agitation shouldn't be impossible.

But then, I'm thinking about this several years too late. :(

This approach might be worth considering:

http://davidhoulder.com/info/4x5tanks.html

[Roger Hicks]

Certainly a wealth of opinion for and against certain tank types.

It would appear that what ever 'devil' you can work with then stick with it. There is absolutely no 'this is the best way' is there?

Somebody from my work suggested the English Johnson 4x5 tank. Has anyone heard of this?

Peter

Dear Peter,

Yes, the best tank is probably the one you aren't using -- but then again, it might be worse, so stick with the devil you know...

If the Johnson is the one I think it is, it's about the same as all the others: swings and roundabouts.

Cheers,

R.

[Trius]

This approach might be worth considering:

http://davidhoulder.com/info/4x5tanks.html

Chris: Neat, but I was thinking of enclosed for daylight as per the opening post. That rig is clever, but for all the effort, a standard Kodak hard rubber tank line is easier.

[venchka]

Jobo 2551/2553 tank
Jobo 2509 or 2509n reels for sheet film + roll film reels
Uniroller or Beseler motor base.

Perfect set up for 35mm, medium format and sheet film.

Next question?

[Trius]

Next question?


$$$$ ?????

[ARCHIVIST]

Chris,
David's home made tank sysytem is very simple and looks good - yes, it is worth considering.

Peter

[JustPlainBill]

Hi Archivist,

[x-ray]

I use the CombiPlan and Jobo tanks regularly. I also have the FR and get terrible streaks with the FR. No problems with either the HP or Jobo. I use the HP with 6 sheets with no problem and generally use it for odd sizes like 3x4. Don't bother with anything that can't be inverted.

[ARCHIVIST]

x-ray, I agree with you when you say do not bother with anything that cannot be inverted.

However, I beleive the problem with streaking on negs processed with the FR or Yankee tanks can be resolved with agitation.

I must be getting old as I do now remember using an FR back in the late '70s and to resolve the uneven development problems I changed my agitaion from 10 sec every minute to 5 sec every 30 seconds. It worked well.

I obtained a Johnson cut film tank yesterday. This uses metal film hangers that fit into slots in the tank. It cannot be inverted. I will process some sheets this weekend and leave comment on the results early next week.

Regards and thanks for all the replies.
Peter

[Soeren]

$$$$ ?????

Yes! The 2551/3 tanks and reels are quite expensive. I bought a used CPE2+ with lift from SDS and it came with the 2800 something paperdrum and a 1520 drum. I ordered 2 2509n reels and since the jobo system is modular I can take apart the drums (cup, funnel and centerpost) and use them bottom part of the paper drum with one 2509n reels to develop 6 sheets of 4X5", 9X12cm or 6X9cm. It is pretty easy to use and the results are great without any signs of uneven development so far.
best regards

[gdi]

Jobo 2551/2553 tank
Jobo 2509 or 2509n reels for sheet film + roll film reels
Uniroller or Beseler motor base.

Perfect set up for 35mm, medium format and sheet film.

Next question?

I have used the beseler roller and a matching print drum - bought for around $50. It will do 4 sheets at a time.

[ARCHIVIST]

Well, I finally got around to processing with my Johnson 4x5 tank.

Easy to load and use. Fill and drain times were 14 seconds each. Capacity is 720 ml. The results were very good - no uneven development or streaks.

This will do me..

Regards
Peter

[ChrisN]

Good news! Do you scan the negs or wet print? (I scan only at this stage, but have just started wet printing and hope to print some 4x5 negs soon.)

[ARCHIVIST]

Chris,
I only print wet silver. Have been doing so for 37 years. I do have access to digital printers, scanners and large format digital backs as I work in the photography / fine arts dept. of a TAFE college. However I concentrate on the craft of wet silver with a particular passion for archival processing of the black and white image.

Regards
Peter

[ChrisN]

Envy! I don't think I have enough time to acquire the skills of 37 years experience, but hope to achieve a reasonable standard. I've started late!