Conspicuous Consumption

[Bill Pierce]

http://us.leica-camera.com/photography/special_editions/leica_M8-2_safari/?mid=430

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Comments?

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

What does it cost?

[aizan]

i want a silver anodized 28mm elmarit asph. that's the worst thing about these special editions - the good stuff doesn't make it into regular production. :(

[funkaoshi]

I think it's 10,000 USD. My coworker sent me a link to an ad for it.

[diagularax]

I'm intrigued that in the info on the site they state that the whole process is paint ... top cover, bottom cover and even the vulcanite. It seems strange to paint the leatherette in this way and you'd have to suspect that the green coating and the covering (obviously originally black) may part company, possibly in the future, and that will not be a good look. They must have a lot of faith in the green coating!

[Chriscrawfordphoto]

I think it's 10,000 USD. My coworker sent me a link to an ad for it.

That's a lot of money, and more than i'd pay even if I could afford it, but it doesn't sound like it is much more than the price of a regular M8.2 with the normal production 28mm lens.
:rolleyes:

[Al Kaplan]

They're counting on the cycles in fashions. Just like the original black paimt M3's and MP's back in the 1950's were covetted for that look of chipped black paint revealing the brass beneath, now a new generation of photographers can thrill to the discovory of black vulcanite beneath the paint...

[Pablito]

http://us.leica-camera.com/photography/special_editions/leica_M8-2_safari/?mid=430

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What's to say? Leica always does $h*t like this.

[diagularax]

They're counting on the cycles in fashions. Just like the original black paimt M3's and MP's back in the 1950's were covetted for that look of chipped black paint revealing the brass beneath, now a new generation of photographers can thrill to the discovory of black vulcanite beneath the paint...


I can't see it being quite the same! :p

I remember as a kid my sister bought some colour change for her shoes to keep up with the fashions and her need to fit in with her friends ... who could just afford the new shoes and didn't have go to such lengths. After a week or so of wearing them the coating, whatever it was, had cracked around the flex areas of her new black shoes and the look was not so cool!

Leica are guilty of tarting up the old girl with a quick coat of paint a little here and justifying it by nostalgically harking back to their military contracts!

[kshapero]

Attention!! Salute!!

[Rui Morais de Sousa]

One more useless/pointless gimmick from Leica to earn some more bucks from some must-have everything (rich) customers.
Why not a fireman shining-red camera?
Or a desert colored Afrika korps model?
Or...? Or...?
I find such ways just ridiculous.
I think the game with limited editions is just loosing control. Too much is just too much!
Rui (http:///ruimoraisdesousa.blogspot.com/)

[photogdave]

If you like it, buy it.
If you don't like it don't buy it.
Seems simple to me.

[Toby]

Am I alone in thinking it would take a brave man to photograph lions on safari with a 28mm lens?

[ClaremontPhoto]

The people who buy this will never use it for any serious photography.

[Keith]

I was wondering ... when was the last time Leica released one of these drab olive limited editions and what model camera was it?

[Rui Morais de Sousa]

I know that only buys who wishes to.
But I don't know if it is just as simple as that. In my modest opinion, such actitudes are not very benefical for the image of a company that once had a reputation for seriousness and commitment. We are talking here about a company that earned her prestige producing high-quality photographic tools.
While such gimmicks don't diminish the quality of these tools, I think that in a way Leica is kind of making fun of it's heritage.
We are not talking here about GAP or Timberland or Lacoste.
For myself, I get a little sad to see Leica becoming more and more a kind of fashion company, always trying to invent one more cameo to satisfy a dubious kind of market.
I wonder when they will start their clothing line for photographers... Or even for cameras. Like puppett clothes.
"Have you already dressed your Leica today?".
I would prefer a little more commitment to photography.
Rui (http://ruimoraisdesousa.blogspot.com/)

[ClaremontPhoto]

Rui:


My thoughts exactly.

If I was buying new today I'd choose Zeiss over Leica.

[Keith]

Actually, as much as the thought makes me cringe, a clothing line would probably be fairly successful for Leica at this stage.

[Pickett Wilson]

I don't really like the looks of the M8 in olive. I did briefly own an R3 Safari back in 1980 and I thought it was very handsome looking.

A photographer I knew ended up in a nasty divorce and sold me the entire kit - R3 Safari, 35, 50 and 90 lenses in a fitted case - for $1000. I really liked the R3, but the opportunity to make a nice profit on the kit resulted in my selling it a couple of weeks later.

[sleepyhead]

It's that Embossed Leather Strap that tips the balance for me... Where's my wallet?

[fergus]

Actually, as much as the thought makes me cringe, a clothing line would probably be fairly successful for Leica at this stage.

Indeed. Look at the number of people buying Harley Davidson t-shirts etc... I wonder if 1/100 actually own one of the bikes?

[Keith]

Indeed. Look at the number of people buying Harley Davidson t-shirts etc... I wonder if 1/100 actually own one of the bikes?


It was HD that came to mind. I used to be friends with the importer up here and he was telling me that when Harley suddenly became ultra successful again and was the brand to be seen on, the HD branded clothing also started selling in enourmous quantities to the point where they could barely keep up with demand.

A friend of mine recently bought his girlfriend some Ducati Logo G-srings to wear ... he likes Ducatis! :p

[Rui Morais de Sousa]

I know that I have a certain tendency to make long posts, but I just think that I should better explain my point of view. You can always skip to the next post...
Around 1987 I applied for a job as photographer at the Institut of Art History of the University of Heidelberg (Kunsthistorisches Institut). I still was driving cabs at night. Some other 36 people were also applying for the job. They came from all over Germany, lots of them with a Meisterbrief. I was there Friday afternoon, Monday morning I had the job. The weekend I had spent developing the two 120 b&w rolls I had to make of a bronze bust, and the prints of it. Photographing this dark shining bust was the practical test everybody needed to do, besides showing a portfolio, etc. So much for the introduction.
When I started working there, beeing already a Leitz/Leica user, I
was very pleased to see that the studio in the institut was filled with lots of Leitz equipment: two Reprovits (the "good" ones, not the simple copy stands, each with a Leica MDa and Focotar lens, then a couple of other Leica cameras (I remember a nice IIIG kit with some lenses), etc., etc. In our darkrooms we had a Focomat Ic and a Focomat IIc (I really loved it), and a Durst Laborator for 4x5". As I said before, personaly I was using Leitz cameras too, so was the other photogapher at the institut. She also had her own Leica equipment.
Once a year, a technician would drive from Wetzlar and would check our enlargers, etc.
So as a Leica user, you fellt that you were dealing with a company commited to serve professionals, making equipment for professionals. You were proud of using the best 35mm stuff, period!
Sadly, I see nowadays a much shorter Leica catalog. Where are those specialized pieces of gear? Where is the possibility of doing professional macro photography, long lenses photography (no, I don't think that Leica R is up to the competition, but that is another thema), enlarging, etc., etc. For sure market niches, but in my opinion important ones. There are still lots of instituts in the world, lots of police departments, lots of peace and army forces, criminal investigation, etc., etc. Where do they buy their stuff? Hardly still by Leica...
That's why I find it ridiculous that they come up with such a cameo of a product, that has nothing to do with the real things they once did.
Let me explain a little more:if I had seen them advertising the possibility of buying a green NO-limited-edition M camera together with the introduction of a new Visoflex and, say a new 560mm Telyt for nature photographers, or something other, I surely would cry out loud "Hurra! Congratulations Leica, that's the way to go!". But a green M and a shining chrome exclusive 28mm? Oh c'mon, don't joke with me! For the lions, like somebody else very well posted?
Niche markets? For sure, but behind those niche markets maybe you sell something else, one more camera, one more lens. And you build up your reputation! Seeing the clients go somewhere else to buy those things, surely doesn't help either.
Kienzle Phototechnik (http://www.kienzle-phototechnik.de/) (who makes a similar Focomat II enlarger), is happily selling those enlargers that Leica doesn't sell no more to all those institutions and photographers out there that still need / want one.
Although not mandatory to my choice of equipment, sure it did influence me on my choice to see that people like Bill Pierce, Robert Frank, H.C.-Bresson, Josef Koudelka, Bruce Davidson, etc., were using Leica stuff.
For sure I don't give a damm if the princess of dreamland uses one! The same goes for a Hollywood star, or pop star, or whatever star might shine in the glamour world.
Please, don't understand me wrong when I say that I don't like to see Leica transformed in a fashion company. I don't have nothing against fashion, I just don't think that Leica should fit in.
I even like very much some fashion photography: Jeanloup Sieff (a phantastic photographer who did some great work using Leicas for instance), and some others I do very much like the work, people like Patrick Demarchelier, Peter Lindbergh or Albert Watson, etc.
But can somebody explain to me how they could make a Leica Manual these days, like the one where Mr. Pierce wrote so many chapters? Would Bill have to write about the Leica à la carte program?
Let me say it loud: this thing of Leica à la carte kotz mich an!
The german speaking people will understand very well what I say, as well as the Herren in Leica management...
Now allow me one more side note, somehow still related with this topic:
A short time after I started my job at the Art History Institut, I had an exhibition at the Leica Galerie in Wetzlar. One month long. Than they called me and asked if I could let the photographs stay one more month. They wanted to put them on the walls of their new plant in Solms. That's how I new that they were going to open a new plant. And my photos were the ones on the wall! By Leica! As you can imagine, I was very happy to say yes...
On the occasion, the factory one Saturday made Tag der öffene
Tür (a day were the public can visit theinstallation). So I drove with a friend to Solms to see my photographs hanging on the wall and taking the chance to visit the plant. It was a very nice day, with bier und wurst, lots of baloons with Leica logo, happy faces everywhere, and a very interesting visit to a brand new shining plant. One of this days I will try to kick my lazyness and copy the images of the exhibition and post them in my blog, in case somebody wishes to see. The thema was Iberia with b/w photographs of Portugal and Spain.
I drove back home very happy for my personal "(little) success", but also firm believing that Leica, after all the difficulties (remember, some years earlier they wanted to stop M production!), was finally on the right track. Modernizing with "body and soul".
Selling to fashion gimmicks doesn't seem to me to be the right track for a company with such a respectable heritage.
Hey, but that is ME.
Rui (http://ruimoraisdesousa.blogspot.com/)

[photomoof]

I know that only buys who wishes to.
But I don't know if it is just as simple as that. In my modest opinion, such actitudes are not very benefical for the image of a company that once had a reputation for seriousness and commitment. We are talking here about a company that earned her prestige producing high-quality photographic tools.


It has been a VERY long time that Leica has been producing this stuff. When I first built a Leica website for Wall Street Camera in 1995, these cameras were in full swing. You have to remember Leica has not been a stable company financially for over 20 years.

[Harry Lime]

I was wondering ... when was the last time Leica released one of these drab olive limited editions and what model camera was it?

Officially the R3 Safari

They also made olive green M bodies for the Bundeswehr (German Army).

[Chuck Albertson]

Perfect for crawling through the bush for that environmental portrait of a pride of lions, and then getting stomped by an elephant.

They'll likely sell all 500 to collectors (the intended market), and I hope they do. Leica could use the cash, will pay down their R&D costs on the M8, and keep the production line going.

[kdemas]

Personally I see nothing wrong with Leica putting out this type of "Special Edition". It takes next to no real time to whip one up (all cosmetic changes), the investment required from the company to do something like this does not in any way hamper other development. If some collectors want to buy them up, I see absolutely no harm in it.

If it was a major drain on resources that affected other key plans and products, then I would feel much differently. I do not believe that's the case with this kind of Special Edition.

Do I want one, nope. I wouldn't mind buying that special edition MP3 from a few years ago, however :)

Anyway, back to work!

Kent

[photogdave]

The Safari editions are part of the company's history. I don't see these as being in the same league as "Sultan Of Brunei" special editions etc.
Gee, I don't recall such a stink when Voigtlander released the olive Bessa R2!

[Dogman]

Olive Bessa R2 didn't cost 20% of a decent annual income.

[Keith]

I thought the green Bessa was some sort of special commemorative edition ... (correct me if I'm wrong) ... and it certainly wasn't released by a company trying very hard to keep it's head above water financially at that particular time.

This is Leica trying to unload 500 cameras as quickly as possible to put some cash back in the coffers and good luck to them if they do so because they obviously need to do something to stir sales along a bit!

That comparrison doesn't work for me either I'm afraid! :)

[photogdave]

Olive Bessa R2 didn't cost 20% of a decent annual income.
But it didn't cost more than a black Bessa either. The M8 Safari set doesn't cost significantly more than the individual items sold separately.
Why is this such a big deal? :confused:

[Bassism]

To be honest, I kinda dig the olive green. Were I a multi-millionaire, I might buy one.

I don't really see why anybody should complain about it though. As Kent said, it takes essentially no time or money to produce these, and they're some easy money for the company. If this is how they need to make a few bucks to pay for developing the S system, then good on them. The way I see it, these trifling non-professional special editions are a good way for them to afford to come out with the ground breaking pro stuff everyone likes to see.

[Keith]

The M8 Safari set doesn't cost significantly more than the individual items sold separately.

Nor should it ... green paint is cheap after all! :p

Seriously, I hope it works for them. I have no desire to own a digital camera made by a company that no longer exists. Not a good scenario because I intend keeping mine for eternity at least!

[alan davus]

I actually like the thing. Why is it that cameras can ONLY be produced in black or chrome? If I was in the market for the M8 and the safari was no dearer I'd buy it in a flash.

[Keith]

I actually like the thing. Why is it that cameras can ONLY be produced in black or chrome? If I was in the market for the M8 and the safari was no dearer I'd buy it in a flash.


I have to confess to kind of liking the neutral look of the green also.

Maybe older users will be able to drag their lovely safari suits out of the cupboard for the total experience!

Just looking at one of the pics it looks like the camera is sitting on the bonnet of a Landrover Defender ... they really are selling an image and photographic style that lets face it, the camera just ain't suitable for! :p

[Keith]

I can see the headlines now:

"Tourist mauled by lion pride attempting to get close up shot with 28mm lens in Kruger National Park ... manufacturer forced to issue warning to customers with all future sales!"

[ruben]

To me it seems that the intended market are those money making mercenary soldiers to rent, who may find the olive color as matching the inherent required camouflage.

My symphaties are with Leica company which must be in a very serious struggle to survive.