View Full Version : NEW Voigtlander Bessa 3 Medium Format 2009
cloneroom
12-21-2008, 11:31
O.K for those off you who may or may not know, Fuji earlier this year unveiled a 120 Medium format rangefinder. This was a huge surprise and gained allot of attention . Well it is official and Voigtlander have announced the BESSA 3 on the following website.
www.voigtlaender.com/
BOTH the FUJI & VOIGTLADER will be releasing the same model (produced by Cosina). The first release scheduled by Voigtlader as the "Bessa 3" in BLACK is around April 2009. Followed mid year by Fuji, a silver Fuji 6x7variety(Japan Only) Both Cameras are the same except for color. So yes its something to be excited about.
ONE IMPORTANT feature apparent when looking at the interior of the Voigtlander when loading the film. There is a 6x7 or 6x6 switch on the inner body. So square or landscape, who could ask for more. I am assuming the Fuji will have the same feature.
So that's the news until I have more infoe enjoy the pics....
http://flickr.com/groups/fujirangefinders/discuss/72157611275516585/
John Robertson
12-21-2008, 11:55
I hope The Bessa 3 will also be offered in silver, like the original Bessas.
johnwnyc
12-21-2008, 12:00
Direct link:
http://www.voigtlaender.de/cms/voigtlaender/voigtlaender_cms.nsf/id/pa_fdih7jzkae.html
The problem, of course, will be price. At a rumored $3000 a piece, this may be a tough sell in the 2009 economy.
Double Negative
12-21-2008, 12:03
$3k?! I sure won't be buying one at that price.
Well if they were REALLY clever they'd figure out a way to switch from 4.5x6 to 6x6 to 6x7 mid-roll, sort of like the Xpan (without wasting film). Sure it's easier with 35mm film which has sprockets for moving the film into more precise alignment with the film gate, but so what? Yes, I know the Xpan is motorized.
<-- Just being ornery.:D
if they were really really clever, they would get it to shoot 6x9. :)
whitecat
12-21-2008, 13:03
Even at 2K they will miss the boat.
Ken Ford
12-21-2008, 13:21
$3k?!?!?!?!
http://www.smileyvault.com/albums/forum/thumb_smileyvault-wtf.gif
RF-Addict
12-21-2008, 14:02
Someone throws out $3K on an internet forum and everybody takes it for granted. Nowhere does it say in the attachments that the price is 3K - in fact, on the German website it clearly states that the price is not yet determint - so relax, everybody!;)
Chriscrawfordphoto
12-21-2008, 14:27
It'll be $5000. It is, after all, medium format so it is worth more than those little 35mm Leicas!
:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p
I think $1000 will be asking too much.
vdonovan
12-21-2008, 14:51
FUJI TAKE NOTE: Discount the camera and you will sell lots and lots of FILMMMMMM! Yesssss! Give man a fish and he eats for a day. Give man a nice film camera and YOU will eat for years to come as he burns through film.
If those are the price range, then I will have to pass... I was hoping <$1500...
buckpago
12-21-2008, 15:14
I dont think that they will sell it for 3k... do the math.
voigt never had a 3k film camera body.
their top of the line lens cost around 1.5k.
camera like bessa 3 are less expensive too produce.
they have less parts and they have bigger parts which is easier to produce unlike on their 135 cameras. lens of medium formats are also easier to make than 135.
perhaps the fuji version will be more expensive for the reason that it is a japan use only status.
I don't think Cosina have got to where they are by overpricing their products ... if it was a Zeiss it may cost $3000 but I'd be surprised at more than $1500 from this company.
It's also a very simple camera and when you consider the price of their flagship R4*/R3* series it would be unlikely that they would expect anyone to pay more than twice the price of the afore mentioned Bessas. If they do it will bomb and they'll be collecting dust on dealer's shelves for years to come!
Fred Burton
12-21-2008, 15:29
They will have to set the price pretty high. The market for such a camera must be pretty small.
Chriscrawfordphoto
12-21-2008, 15:29
I dont think that they will sell it for 3k... do the math.
voigt never had a 3k film camera body.
their top of the line lens cost around 1.5k.
camera like bessa 3 are less expensive too produce.
they have less parts and they have bigger parts which is easier to produce unlike on their 135 cameras. lens of medium formats are also easier to make than 135.
perhaps the fuji version will be more expensive for the reason that it is a japan use only status.
Cost of production never seems to make a difference in camera prices. Basically, if it is for photography, you have to bend over to get it. Look at the sensor brushes for digital cameras that cost pennies to make and sell for $50 or more. Or plastic bodied digital crap-cam SLRs that costs nearly $1000. I won't be surprised to see it sell for $3000, really.
They will have to set the price pretty high. The market for such a camera must be pretty small.
I can't really see that the market for this camera would be a lot smaller than it is for the R4A ... that's a pretty specialised tool when you think about it, although it does have a commonality with other Bessas. I think Cosina's ability to survive and thrive in a market that is just a slice of a slice after all is impressive. They are very astute and will be well aware of the pitfalls of overpricing such an item in what they know is a very limited market!
Well, let's see. A good vintage folder in a good condition goes for $500-1500. Give or take. Some more rare ones even more. Bessa II with heliar in clean condition can be found on ebay for over 1K. What other folding cameras are there? Some Fuji 645? I think it will be a collectors camera, selling for around 2-2.3K, limitied production. People that want these things - already pay as much for the folders. They will buy this one as well. It's like Zeiss 85/2 lens - very expensive yet a few people buy it anyway, while there other cheaper and about as good alternatives. Collector's item, collector's price. On a used market they will become more affordable, of course. Plus while lens says "Heliar" - we dont really know how well it will perform.
Me - I dont think I'll buy one, unless it(against my logic) will sell for under 1K. but than again - I already have a couple real vintage folders that I really like, so it's not like I have to have this one.
I can't really see that the market for this camera would be a lot smaller than it is for the R4A ... that's a pretty specialised tool when you think about although it does have a commonality with other Bessas. I think Cosina's ability to survive and thrive in a market that is just a slice of a slice after all is impressive. They are very astute and will be well aware of the pitfalls of overpricing such an item in what they know is a very limited market!
See, Keith, I think this is just the thing - just like with Zeiss - they have a line of good a pretty reasonably priced items and a couple of those that are waaaay out there. So, maybe Voigtlander is doing the same? Cause I'm sure even at 2K there will be people buying this thing no problem.
Hey Keith,
Did you get an email from Kobayashi San asking you to support their dealers.:D
Kaufmman San should slip over to the land of the rising sun for a while for a few lessons from Kobayashi San methinks! :D
I still haven't quite recovered from the implications of the doctor's begging letter! :p
See, Keith, I think this is just the thing - just like with Zeiss - they have a line of good a pretty reasonably priced items and a couple of those that are waaaay out there. So, maybe Voigtlander is doing the same? Cause I'm sure even at 2K there will be people buying this thing no problem.
You may be right but it still doesn't seem their style. What I do know is that anything over $1500 definitely removes it from my list of cameras I'd like to own! :p
noimmunity
12-21-2008, 16:28
Someone throws out $3K on an internet forum and everybody takes it for granted. Nowhere does it say in the attachments that the price is 3K - in fact, on the German website it clearly states that the price is not yet determint - so relax, everybody!;)
The figure (actually, 300,000 yen) is based on a filmed interview in Japanese demonstrating how to use the camera that was made at Photokina. I believe the technician demonstrating the camera (the fellow who mentioned the 300,000 yen suggested retail price) was from Fujifilm, but I'm not sure. And that was before the yen hit an all-time high. At current exchange rate, 300,000 yen is well over 3k. I still guess it will be over US$2,000, probably $2,2-2,400.
Well, let's see. A good vintage folder in a good condition goes for $500-1500. Give or take. Some more rare ones even more. Bessa II with heliar in clean condition can be found on ebay for over 1K. What other folding cameras are there? Some Fuji 645? I think it will be a collectors camera, selling for around 2-2.3K, limitied production. People that want these things - already pay as much for the folders. They will buy this one as well. It's like Zeiss 85/2 lens - very expensive yet a few people buy it anyway, while there other cheaper and about as good alternatives. Collector's item, collector's price. On a used market they will become more affordable, of course. Plus while lens says "Heliar" - we dont really know how well it will perform.
Me - I dont think I'll buy one, unless it(against my logic) will sell for under 1K. but than again - I already have a couple real vintage folders that I really like, so it's not like I have to have this one.
Jamie123
10-21-2009, 05:14
As you may have noticed the camera has been out for quite some time now and so far none of the people who bought it seem to be collectors. I know I'm not.
Also, comparing the Bessa III with a vintage folder is like comparing a Leica M7 with one of the Oscar Barnack Leicas.
Gabriel M.A.
10-21-2009, 05:23
The problem, of course, will be price. At a rumored $3000 a piece, this may be a tough sell in the 2009 economy.
And since it's not made by Leica, it is not "ridiculous".
Jamie123
10-21-2009, 07:18
And since it's not made by Leica, it is not "ridiculous".
This thread is over a year old. The camera's been out for some time, it's $2k not $3k and if it had a red dot it would probably be closer to $5k.
Gabriel M.A.
10-21-2009, 10:51
This thread is over a year old. The camera's been out for some time, it's $2k not $3k and if it had a red dot it would probably be closer to $5k.
The M9 is awfully underpriced, then. :angel:
Jamie123
10-21-2009, 11:40
The M9 is awfully underpriced, then. :angel:
Not if you add the price of a lens :D
btw, I don't really know what the M9 has to do with any of this. It's a digital camera and should be compared to other digital cameras in its range. All I was saying is that it's a bit silly to call a modern film camera like the Bessa III a collectors item because it's more expensive than old used folders. That's like calling the M7 a collectors item because you can get an M2 for less.
As far as the M9 is concerned I really don't have much to say other than that I'd buy one in a heartbeat if I could (comfortably) afford it.
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