Nikon F3 or FM2?

[fdigital]

I've succumbed to the desire to own a famous nikon SLR, along with some of their fine MF lenses. I've narrowed my choice down to 2 cameras. I'm just looking for opinions on which people like more basically...

Firstly there's the F3. Can anyone tell me if besides the advantage of being able to see through the VF at a slight distance, the HP model is any better to look through? Is it much larger?

Also there's the FM2/n which is desirable mainly for its Mechanical shutter. Is there a real difference in reliability between the cameras, or is it much of a muchness...

The lens I will be getting will be a 35 ais f2 following good reviews of it. I will also be using it on my 30d.


Thanks!

[Michael I.]

fm2n survived where a f3 died.it is also cheaper

[Chris Lynch]

i've never OWNED an FM2(n) or F3, but i currently shoot an FE2 and love it. I had an FM3A shortly, and sold it cuz i needed the cash- that was a very nice camera and i do miss it dearly.

Sorry for that probably not-too-helpful input. :)

[fdigital]

fm2n survived where a f3 died.it is also cheaper

I thought someone would have some insight on the electric vs mechanical side of it.

Is the fm2n viewfinder worse to look through than the f3?

[jfserejo]

I have a FM2n and a FM3a and the FM2n is always the one I take with me when I wish to use the lenses from Nikon. I like the mechanical response of this camera better and the meter with only a "+ o -" is my favorite meter of all the cameras I have.
One other thing I feel about the FM2n is that the camera will never fail you.

Good luck with your choice,
Joao

[anandi]

Hey,
A thread that I can answer definitively. I have both an FM2(n) and an F3. For the F3 I have both the HP viewfinder and regular finder. Here are my thoughts:

If I had to choose one camera it would be the F3. I find that having aperture priority there lets me shoot faster in situations that I don't have time to manually set exposure for. You can always set exposures manually if you want. Also it allows for Non-AI lenses to be mounted and stopped down metered, opening up even cheaper excellent glass. I can't say that the HP viewfinder makes a whole lot of difference to me either way. I do wear glasses and sunglasses sometimes when shooting but overally I probably like the DE2 (?) finder with the slighter greater magnification factor. It's also cheaper to get with an F3 for some reason. Finally the heavily centre-weighted metering acts effectively like an spot meter to me and I have grown to rely on this even more than any matrix metering I have ever used. It is uncannily simple and effective. Bright/Dark scenes and subjects you'd just compensate for manually anyway.

I like the feel of the F3 a bit better, it's a little heavier and therefore a bit more stable for handheld low light shots and the little grip on it is effective.

In praise of the FM2(n) - it is lighter and more compact for a kit. The viewfinder is every bit as nice as the F3. It comes with a split screen focus (not interchangeable) that I find a bit easier to use than the focusing screen I have on my F3 (the middle region just goes in and out of focus). I like to shoot with the FM2(n) when I have lots of time to setup and to force me to think about exposure. It is more fiddly and enjoyable to use when you're in that frame of mind. The LED metering system + 0 - is pretty effective and useful in the dark, some people prefer match needle metering, you get used to it and it becomes as quick as manual metering can I think. I also take out my FM2(n) out in the rain and wouldn't hesitate to use it in the cold

I haven't noticed any issues with the FM2(n) in terms of shutter speed accuracy. It does have a faster flash synch speed.

I'd imagine an FE or FE2 would be sort of an in-between best of both worlds (or go for broke and get an FM3a!). I think the battery issue isn't practically a problem with an F3. A spare set takes up little space and compared to digicams batteries last forever.

Hope this helps, feel free to email me any questions at aanandi AT gmail DOT com

Cheers,
-Amit

[ChrisPlatt]

FE2's are getting very inexpensive...

Chris

[fdigital]

Hey,
A thread that I can answer definitively. I have both an FM2(n) and an F3. For the F3 I have both the HP viewfinder and regular finder. Here are my thoughts:

If I had to choose one camera it would be the F3. I find that having aperture priority there lets me shoot faster in situations that I don't have time to manually set exposure for. You can always set exposures manually if you want. Also it allows for Non-AI lenses to be mounted and stopped down metered, opening up even cheaper excellent glass. I can't say that the HP viewfinder makes a whole lot of difference to me either way. I do wear glasses and sunglasses sometimes when shooting but overally I probably like the DE2 (?) finder with the slighter greater magnification factor. It's also cheaper to get with an F3 for some reason. Finally the heavily centre-weighted metering acts effectively like an spot meter to me and I have grown to rely on this even more than any matrix metering I have ever used. It is uncannily simple and effective. Bright/Dark scenes and subjects you'd just compensate for manually anyway.

I like the feel of the F3 a bit better, it's a little heavier and therefore a bit more stable for handheld low light shots and the little grip on it is effective.

In praise of the FM2(n) - it is lighter and more compact for a kit. The viewfinder is every bit as nice as the F3. It comes with a split screen focus (not interchangeable) that I find a bit easier to use than the focusing screen I have on my F3 (the middle region just goes in and out of focus). I like to shoot with the FM2(n) when I have lots of time to setup and to force me to think about exposure. It is more fiddly and enjoyable to use when you're in that frame of mind. The LED metering system + 0 - is pretty effective and useful in the dark, some people prefer match needle metering, you get used to it and it becomes as quick as manual metering can I think. I also take out my FM2(n) out in the rain and wouldn't hesitate to use it in the cold

I haven't noticed any issues with the FM2(n) in terms of shutter speed accuracy. It does have a faster flash synch speed.

I'd imagine an FE or FE2 would be sort of an in-between best of both worlds (or go for broke and get an FM3a!). I think the battery issue isn't practically a problem with an F3. A spare set takes up little space and compared to digicams batteries last forever.

Hope this helps, feel free to email me any questions at aanandi AT gmail DOT com

Cheers,
-Amit


Thankyou very much - this is more or less exactly what I was looking for - thankyou.

At the moment that f3 is looking pretty sexy, but It'll be a few days before I actually buy one... Need to think more still.

[the_jim]

I own/owned an FE2, FM, FM2n, FM3a and F3. The finders are great on all of them. The FE2 and FM3a have the match needle system which I like and the FM/FM2n have the +o- system that many people also like. The F3 has a little monochrome LCD that displays the speed and is very easy to use. The high eye point and eye level finders are equally easy for me to use, as I dont wear glasses.

The big difference for me comes in two points.

1. Top shutter speed. I love to shoot as wide open as I can so the faster the shutter the better. The FE2, FM2n and FM3a have a vertical travel shutter that goes up to 1/4000 whereas the F3 has a horizontal shutter that tops out at 1/2000.

2. Feel. The smaller bodies are nice and well built, but the slightly larger F3 just feels so much more comfortable in my big hands. The weight of it is also perfect for me. The shutter advance lever is so smooth and quite that it's scary. Also the pitch of the shutter is a little different. It sounds a little softer.

For me, the second point is more important as you can work around the first through filtration and slower film.

Any argument about mechanical vs electronic shutter reliability is a bit silly anymore. With proper care and planning, any of these cameras will last you a lifetime.

[JonR]

Take a look at www.flickr.com/groups/fmseries (http://www.flickr.com/groups/fmseries). There you will find a big group of active Nikon FM-users - most of them with a FM2! The F3 is a great camera but the FM2 seems to be one of the most used Nikon cameras still today with those wanting a manual camera. Personally, it is my favourite Nikon SLR and combining it with some glass like the Nikon Series E 28, 100 and 135 mm lenses creates a great combination!

Jon

[GeneW]

anandi's reply is excellent, and matches my own inclinations. I have both the F3HP and FM2n -- love 'em both -- but if I were to choose just one, it would be the F3. It's got that heft and je ne sais quoi that just feels 'professional'. I like the FM2 for its compactness and lighter weight when I want to travel very light.

Gene

[BillBingham2]

I've had an FE, FM2, several Nikkormats, Fs and now have standardized on an F2. For me, while I loved my Nikkormats having 100% framing for me is wonderful. I know it sounds strange coming from an RF user, but here's the rub. In RF/VF world you can see around the edges and if something is distracting that might be in the frame adjust. Doing that in SLR world, IMHO is a pain.

Another issue is focusing screens, I love the P screen and for me it's a big deal. The K screen is OK, but P is IMHO the best (1-14 in OM-1 land). Along with a wider range of screens also comes different finders. For copy standish work and really low to the ground shooting (like from the second level of a commuter train people on the first level) a waist level finder is handy.

If you really want a manual workhorse that will last a life time, go F or F2, IMHO, the next step down is the F3. Go F3.

B2 (;->

[Joe Brugger]

A minor correction. There are three user-interchangeable focusing screens available for the FM2n (and the FE2 and FA). In addition to the split image, there is a plain matte screen, and matte with gridlines.

To me the tradeoff between the FMs and the F series are the 100% finder and interchangeable prisms of the F's vs. the more compact body of the FMs. They're all well-built and easy to use.

In praise of the FM2(n) - it is lighter and more compact for a kit. The viewfinder is every bit as nice as the F3. It comes with a split screen focus (not interchangeable) that I find a bit easier to use than the focusing screen I have on my F3 (the middle region just goes in and out of focus).

[ChrisPlatt]

The FM2n is the loudest SLR I have ever owned.

Chris

[Michael I.]

f3 has a better VF and sits better in my hand.

[Nikon Bob]

Check out http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/ for more info on the two. My vote goes to the FM2n for its lightness,cost and ruggedness. Unless you need pro build and features the FM2n is classic user. Yes I do use the FM/FE/FE2/FM2n and F3. There is not a thing wrong with the F3 but I just prefer the FM2n as I like minimalism.

Bob

[anandi]

A minor correction. There are three user-interchangeable focusing screens available for the FM2n (and the FE2 and FA). In addition to the split image, there is a plain matte screen, and matte with gridlines.


Oops, I hadn't realized that. Thanks for the correction.

[JJW]

Both are very nice cameras. The FM2 is lighter and easier to use. It is also not battery dependent, which is great. I have had the battery on my F3 drop dead and the camera is pretty much incapacitated.

Since these cameras are getting to be towards 20-30 years old, you need to consider the upkeep factor. I've had both FM2s and F3s (and FE2s) sent to my repair guy. This is what he has to say... the FM2 is simple to fix and very easy to maintain. Parts are usually not an issue. It will last forever. The F3 is more complex and parts sometimes do need to be replaced. It's more expensive to maintain. To fix some of the electronics inside, my repair guy needs to get parts cameras with the proper component(s) intact. The FE2s are more delicate, but that's another story.

That said, I have a nice clean FM2n body for sale. It's just been serviced and CLA'ed and has a 6 month warranty from my repairman. Drop me a line for more information.

The only reason I'm selling it is to get a DSLR... as much as I am sorry about doing this... but my clients are demanding digital deliverables..

[HSI]

F3 > FM2
-
The F3 is by far one of the best manual focus cameras out there in terms of ruggedness and realiabilty, (Also in the running, the Olympus OM4 and Canon F1N).
The F3 has a great meter stepless meter, heavy center weighting, and 100% viewfinder.
-
But it lacks a high sync and shutter speed and the pentaprisim is quite easily dented compared to the rest of the camera.

[dnk512]

I have them both. I am not selling either.

The FM2n is my favorite carry around as it is lighter and very simple in operation. The F3 is the best on a tripod. Though it does fit well in my hands, it is a bit heavier and the needle is a bit slower to evaluate (My comparisons are for using both cameras in all manual).

The F3 is sleeker in looks and in operation. It has true mirror-lock and electronic shutter.

As for viewfinders, I have both HP and nor-HP. If you do not use glasses go for the non-HP. However, the FM2n with a screen from the FM3 series is the best to focus on. But, you will not have 100% view. Does this matter to you?

The FM2n triggered my path to all manual old cameras (TLRs, Folders etc). The F3 is the most automated film camera I own.

Finally, the F3 is a part of a large system of attachments. It will also take older lenses that the FM2n will not mount.

[KoNickon]

FM2n, without question. I think it's one of Nikon's best-ever designs, and seems indestructible. The F3 is heavier, with much slower flash synch (not to mention an unfortunate flash mount location), and the metering is quirkier. I'm also not convinced about its sturdiness. And one more thing -- to turn on the F3 you have to throw a rather stiff and not at all ergonomic switch. Really not well done at all. With the FM2n (as with earlier Nikons like the F2 and the Nikkormats), just pull the wind lever to its standoff position.

[JNewell]

One thing to bear in mind is that IMO (and I am a long time owner and user of both) is that the VF of the F3, while bigger/better/brighter than the FM/FE series, is not really set up for manual exposure, in my opinion. The "match needle" arrangement is to see the + and - signs on the LCD, which is not great in good light and a real problem in bad light. The FM2 (and the F2 with one of the LED finders) is much better in this regard.

[Harry Lime]

Tough call. I've shot both and own two F3-P, which are great. But I really like the compact size of the FM.

Hmm, blondes or brunettes? One of each?
;-)


HL

[dnk512]

Oh, one last thought: If you like the Nikon manual system, you will end up buying both.

[igoesmyth]

The F3'sonly failing point is the lack of a hot shoe. having on camera flash is sometimes needed and eBay doesn't show many SB 16's lately. Those were terrible flashes...

[Rick_Campbell]

I ended up selling my F3 because I had trouble focusing it. With the high eyepoint prism the whole image, while being 100%, is smaller than what I see through the FM2N. I do wear glasses and my eyes are getting older.

And you can put the focusing screen from the FM3A in a FM2N and have a very nice and bright view. You do need to have the meter recalibrated but it's worth it. So I've now got an FM2N and FM3A but have only been using my Leica M6TTL lately.

[Nikon Bob]

I ended up selling my F3 because I had trouble focusing it. With the high eyepoint prism the whole image, while being 100%, is smaller than what I see through the FM2N. I do wear glasses and my eyes are getting older.

And you can put the focusing screen from the FM3A in a FM2N and have a very nice and bright view. You do need to have the meter recalibrated but it's worth it. So I've now got an FM2N and FM3A but have only been using my Leica M6TTL lately.

You don't really need to have the meter re calibrated as you can compensate by re rating your film to take care of any discrepancies . I have an FM3a screen in one of my Fm2ns and have not bothered with any method of compensation as I shoot print film and with that it is close enough.

Bob

[shadowfox]

The FM2n is the loudest SLR I have ever owned.

Chris

You should get a Konica TC :D
It sounded like someone smacks you behind the ear...

[anandi]

Really? Why were SB16s bad flashes? I'm not disagreeing just wondering what was wrong with them.

eBay doesn't show many SB 16's lately. Those were terrible flashes...

[jimmygcreative]

I think the F3 is a better looking camera than the FM2 no shoe is the reason. If I had only one camera and a budget of less than 300. I would own a user F3 w/50mm.

[DavidH]

F3 - one of the finest cameras ever made.

There's a little gizmo (forget the Nikon code) that provides a standard hotshoe - I use mine with an SB28 but any of the flash units will work.

Good info here:
http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/nikonf3ver2/index.htm

[sepiareverb]

If accessories are something you might want to get into, the F3 would have a much larger selection. The removable prism allows for different types (waist level, high magnification).

Never owned either of these, one FE2 and several F4's The build on either is darn good, parts for the FE2 are about gone, check into that for any Nikon you might purchase.

I'll throw in a nod to the F4- my favorite SLR ever.

[Pablito]

F3 - one of the finest cameras ever made.

There's a little gizmo (forget the Nikon code) that provides a standard hotshoe - I use mine with an SB28 but any of the flash units will work.

Good info here:
http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/nikonf3ver2/index.htm


That gizmo is not reliable, poor electrical contact between. the body and the gizmo even if you clean the contatcts. Much safer to use a cord.

Re the debate at hand: impossible to say which is "best" I own and use both as circumstances dictate. At least you have a pretty comprehensive list of each camera's pros and cons...

[rich815]

I've owned an FE2, FM2 and have held more than a few times the F3. They are all three gorgeous user cameras. My vote would be for the FM2 as I found the F3 just too heavy and bulky. Though the 100% finder is nice, you must ask if that is truly critical to your work.

I went Contax for my SLR set-up a few years back loving the Zeiss glass but a early MINT FM2 with the honeycomb titanium shutter came up for $150 and I snagged it. Now searching for me ol' favorite Nikon MF glass again.....anyone got a 105/4 Micro they want to sell?

[Carzee]

I have a F3. I got it because of the fanyastic stepless AV mode -made for trannys-(especially macro pix where the manual focusing is keeping you busy enough), long life, the cheap cost (feebay with a CLA receipt), and it has accessories I like. I like being able to clean the viewfinder in a snap, I like the chimney finder and the HP finder, I like the slanted split prism and the grid screen, I like the feel of the camera. I wouldn't really reach for it if the job called for flash. Some nikkor glass is so great and so cheap. In some rodeo/rural circumstance (ie; if the job was dirty and dusty) and I could build in the cost of a replacement gear to the job (charge the client) I'd reach for the F3.
I don't like the F3 ASA dial. But thats my only complaint.

[BillBingham2]

Great choice. You will find the finders very useful and mostly reasonably priced.

B2 (;->

[amateriat]

For a higher maximum shutter speed, and a bit more compactness: the FM2

For just about everything else: the F3. By a country mile.


- Barrett

[cmogi10]

I spent 3 hours fondling an F3 and an Fm2n and ended up taking the FM2 home...go figure, I think it's perfect.

[richard_l]

I think the FM2n is intrinsically perfect. It does exactly what it is supposed to do; it is totally dependable; it can accomodate an excellent selection of lenses; and it has a mechanical shutter.

Richard

[amateriat]

I spent 3 hours fondling an F3 and an Fm2n and ended up taking the FM2 home...go figure, I think it's perfect. Well, why not? I'm never (okey, rarely) one to question someone's choice in photographic gear. No cosmic percentage in it, really. Let's just say you could've done a helluva lot worse...for SLRs. ;)


- Barrett

[fdigital]

If anyone wants to know, I ended up getting a mint high serial f3hp. Its serial puts it as about a 96/97 model and I'm really in love with it. It's so industrially beautiful and strong. As such I'm not even using any rangefinder bodies at the moment - just the f3hp. I'm about to order a zeiss 50 1.4 planar in ZF mount from popflash this weekend for it. I don't think it gets much better than that!

Really enjoying it.

[anandi]

Congrats. I'm sure you'll still love it after a couple of years too. That feeling of rightness in your hand doesn't go away.

Cheers,
-Amit

[jaffa_777]

Great choice Gavin, even though you couldn't have gone wrong with either camera. I have an F3 non HP which I absolutley love. I also use the zeiss zf 50mm with it and think it is a stellar combination. I think you are going to love the results. I find the focusing screen gorgeous to look through and very easy to focus accurately. I do have more trouble accurately focusing my 85mm 1.8 accurately on the eyes though. I wonder if anyone knows if there is a eye piece magnifier you can get for this camera that would help with critically focusing longer lenses?


I'll post a few pics with the F3 and the zf 50mm.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1344/1195378358_3090bb5154_o.jpg


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1250/1195760744_ee4238448b_o.jpg

[rogue_designer]

congrats!

Fwiw - I used to love my FM2n and F3 - gave the FM2n to an ex gf, and the F3 was lost in a boating accident.

Rather than replacing either, I managed to get a kit of 2 Canon F1N's with a complement of lenses which have served me faithfully since. I don't miss the F3. But I do sometimes pine for that little tank of an FM2n.

Regardless enjoy your new rig.

[fdigital]

Great choice Gavin, even though you couldn't have gone wrong with either camera. I have an F3 non HP which I absolutley love. I also use the zeiss zf 50mm with it and think it is a stellar combination. I think you are going to love the results. I find the focusing screen gorgeous to look through and very easy to focus accurately. I do have more trouble accurately focusing my 85mm 1.8 accurately on the eyes though. I wonder if anyone knows if there is a eye piece magnifier you can get for this camera that would help with critically focusing longer lenses?


I'll post a few pics with the F3 and the zf 50mm.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1344/1195378358_3090bb5154_o.jpg


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1250/1195760744_ee4238448b_o.jpg



Wow that second photo sure is sharp! I'm really keen to see what sort of resolution I can pull at ardoun f4 on the ZF planar. Also of interest to me is the 35 distagon vs the nikkor 35 1.5 ais. The zeiss's have a really amazing look though - and all of them have it. It's hard to explain but I think its something in the way of how the in-focus parts of the image transfers to the out of focus bokeh. zeiss is in a league of its own here.

Thanks for that.

[literiter]

I went to a camera store near me about two years ago and found about 6 or 7 really nice F3Hps to choose from. I carefully went over each camera and found one absolutley blemish free. (I think many people dumped heir film cameras, at the same time, when digital arrived) Then I chose a case.
I already had a F2 and some lenses.
The F3 fits my hand very well and the "auto" setting exposes very well.
These are special cameras. They complement my Leica M2 and M4-P.

[kjoosten]

If anyone wants to know, I ended up getting a mint high serial f3hp. Its serial puts it as about a 96/97 model and I'm really in love with it. It's so industrially beautiful and strong. As such I'm not even using any rangefinder bodies at the moment - just the f3hp. I'm about to order a zeiss 50 1.4 planar in ZF mount from popflash this weekend for it. I don't think it gets much better than that!

Really enjoying it.

Nice choice of the Planar. I have that lens and use it regularly with my F2AS and FM3a. It is absolutely stellar.

[jaffa_777]

I think where the zeiss lenses have always really shone is on slide film.
A lot of people over on another forum compare this lens and their nikkors with digital pics, but my opinion is that the sensors at the moment are uanble to do the lens justice in the terms of subtlety of colour. I think these pics try to convey what I mean.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2391/1516845952_7eb137eae8_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1160/531253798_e5752336d5_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/243/517844525_48a8d19fec_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/225/517843439_25b361b890_o.jpg

[szekiat]

its like comparing the M6 with an M7 really isn't it?

[cmogi10]

its like comparing the M6 with an M7 really isn't it?

Hm, I'l take the M6! And the FM2N!

http://carlmogerley.zenfolio.com/img/v2/p31209374-4.jpg

[cmogi10]

http://carlmogerley.zenfolio.com/img/v2/p443134932-4.jpg

[CC72]

For collectibility, F3. The F series is (was) Nikon's top-of-line model range. Just like the F3, the FM2 is an excellent, indestructible camera. The work-horse of all work-horses. I have an FM2n from 1992. I got it new in Hong Kong. And I still want an F3. Get both!!!

[Uncle Bill]

I have been following this thread with interest, I was toying of getting an FM3 sometime next year but the idea of having a F3 HP and FM2n for the same price or a little bit less makes more sense.

[kjoosten]

I have been following this thread with interest, I was toying of getting an FM3 sometime next year but the idea of having a F3 HP and FM2n for the same price or a little bit less makes more sense.

Although....

The FM3a could be considered as having the best characteristics of both - the FM2n's compactness and battery-less operability, the F3's aperture priority and TTL flash.

That said, someday I WILL own a mintish F3/T champaign......

[fdigital]

Well, I really love my f3hp. I haven't even got it that zeiss lens yet - will order soon. The handling of the f3 is beautiful. I find it intuitive and love the way it feels. Like it more than my old m6.

[robert blu]

I like my FM2, with the Nikkor 50mm/1,4. Not sure about differences with the Zeiss planar 50mm/1,4. But the camera is excellent, at least for me...
rob

[mw_uio]

F3HP, is my favorite camera! Plus it has 'aperture priority' for quick shooting, works like a charm! Even if you do not get a F3HP, but get a FM2n, still you can venture into the Zeiss ZF lenses.

Distagon T* 2.8/25 [$787]
Distagon T* 2/28**expected release in Dec. 07**
Distagon T* 2/35 [$787]

Planar T* 1.4/50 [$492]
Planar T* 1.4/85 [$984]

Makro-Planar T* 2/50 [$984]
Makro-Planar T* 2/100 [$1507]

*Above prices from B&H web site


I wonder how the ZF Distagon T* 2/28 will compare to the Nikkor 28/2.0?

Good luck in your quest!! :D
Just go ahead and get the F3HP, you can always sell it for the same price you bought it!

Cheers
MArk
Quito, EC

[JNewell]

That said, someday I WILL own a mintish F3/T champaign......

It's a personal preference - but I always favored the black F3/T model. The champagne looks OK until the paint starts to wear, then (to me) the gray TI under the paint really looks ratty. The gray looks better under the black...to me.

[Seele]

I think where the zeiss lenses have always really shone is on slide film.
A lot of people over on another forum compare this lens and their nikkors with digital pics, but my opinion is that the sensors at the moment are uanble to do the lens justice in the terms of subtlety of colour. I think these pics try to convey what I mean.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2391/1516845952_7eb137eae8_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1160/531253798_e5752336d5_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/243/517844525_48a8d19fec_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/225/517843439_25b361b890_o.jpg

Jaffa,

Sorry to be a spoil sport but these pictures, especially the last three, shows very messy bokeh: messy in a different way as compared to Nikkors.

[JonasYip]

Recently I've really enjoyed using my (new to me) F3HP paired with a Voigtlander Ultron 40/2. I also have an FM2n, and I do like some things better there as others have discussed: the easy-to-see +/- LEDs, the power-switch (or rather, I don't like the F3 switch), the 1/4000 shutter.

I think an FM3a would actually be perfect for me. Actually, an FM3D-FX would be perfect ...

j

[rogue_designer]

Jaffa,

Sorry to be a spoil sport but these pictures, especially the last three, shows very messy bokeh: messy in a different way as compared to Nikkors.

Ah - and that is where personal preference comes in. I rather like the bokeh in the image samples. *shrug*

[NIKON KIU]

The only thing that pisses me off about the F3 is the darn shutter speeds getting stuck @ 1/90 while one is advancing to the first frame :eek:

I always try to get an extra frame before the first frame ;)
I haven't handled the F3P, I think that one does without that feature.

BTW. Did you try the mechanical release? Now, that's loud.

Kiu

[cmogi10]

Ah - and that is where personal preference comes in. I rather like the bokeh in the image samples. *shrug*


I have to say I like it as well!

[Seele]

Ah - and that is where personal preference comes in. I rather like the bokeh in the image samples. *shrug*


Valid point, I guess I should justify my views.

In pictures 2 and 4 you can see in the background and foreground, respectively (both towards the bottom end of the frame) showing some smudges, showing the first signs of swirling. In picture 3 the background specular highlights seem to jump in front of the focussed distance. For me I do not find these traits too appealing.

[kjoosten]

Recently I've really enjoyed using my (new to me) F3HP paired with a Voigtlander Ultron 40/2. I also have an FM2n, and I do like some things better there as others have discussed: the easy-to-see +/- LEDs, the power-switch (or rather, I don't like the F3 switch), the 1/4000 shutter.

I think an FM3a would actually be perfect for me. Actually, an FM3D-FX would be perfect ...

j

I think the CV Ultron really sits well on the FM-sized cameras. I always felt the Nikkor 45P was too much of a pancake - hard to use. The Ultron is "just right." The CV 90mm APO-Lanthar is a nice, compact, sharp tele that works well with a compact, also. Those two lenses, along with my FM3a almost give an RF-sized kit.

[fdigital]

Valid point, I guess I should justify my views.

In pictures 2 and 4 you can see in the background and foreground, respectively (both towards the bottom end of the frame) showing some smudges, showing the first signs of swirling. In picture 3 the background specular highlights seem to jump in front of the focussed distance. For me I do not find these traits too appealing.


The bokeh certainly isn't as good as say a canon 50 1.2L/85 1.2L and not as good as the distagon 35 f2 either from what I've seen, but I think it's only in certain circumstances. The planar still has that nice in to out of focus character specific to zeiss lenses - it's also the sharpest lens they've ever made.... they measured it at something like 350lpm @ f4 and 250lpm @f2 which is much much higher than most leica/canon L or nikkor glass.

I'd love to get a distagon 35 f2 but at the moment I'm more interested in a fast 50.

[NIKON KIU]

Like it more than my old m6.

I need more people like you :D
50mm f1.4 in AIs mount are sold around US $150 on ebay. pretty cheap when you consider $500 for the Zeiss

Here is an ebay example:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Nikon-Nikkor-50mm-1-1-4-AIS-lens_W0QQitemZ250172726918QQihZ015QQcategoryZ48556 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Can probably steal one for under $100 if you have patience

Now you need an FM2n ;)

Kiu

[kjoosten]

Ah - and that is where personal preference comes in. I rather like the bokeh in the image samples. *shrug*

Not to continue hijacking this thread, but...

I've noticed the character of the bokeh changes (improves to my eye) when the Planar is stopped down to f/2 or f/2.8. These were shot at f/2.8, I believe.

http://k43.pbase.com/g4/10/127410/2/63199695.8tuuSLi5.jpg


http://k41.pbase.com/g4/10/127410/2/63199676.wZATe2T2.jpg

[jaffa_777]

Yes the bokeh of the new zeiss zf's is certainly different. Are the zm's different? I happen to like the swirling bokeh, a bit like the noctilux, but it certainly can create distracting backgrounds when there are highlights coming through the leaves of trees. But for all other purposes, this lens does exactley what I want it to do, nice and extremely sharp in focus areas with smooth trasition to the out of focus area.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1011/1203259470_4505e91f99_o.jpg