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I wonder if Don or Sherry can fix this camera?? :D :D :D :eek: :eek:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Legendary-Leica-II-owned-by-German-officer-V-2-Rocket_W0QQitemZ300138348901QQihZ020QQcategoryZ300 30QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Oh man. I thought mine were beaters. :rolleyes:
"It's a three! No wait.... knob came off... it's a two."
LeicaTom
08-06-2007, 20:49
Wow!
Now that`s what I call patina :)
...now why can`t I find a grey IIIC K in that condition? :eek:
Tom
landsknechte
08-06-2007, 20:56
That one looks more like it was hit by a V-2 rocket.
(...and oddly enough, the current winning bidder is the same bloke that outbid me on a 1935 Summar earlier this afternoon...)
radiocemetery
08-07-2007, 04:23
Wear appropriate to time spent underwater.
Nikon Bob
08-07-2007, 04:24
Hasn't this one been on before?
Bob
"Minty" . . . "Stored carefully for last 65 years" etc etc ;o)
(...and oddly enough, the current winning bidder is the same bloke that outbid me on a 1935 Summar earlier this afternoon...)doctor_leo better be a reconstructive surgeon! Interesting... red lens RF, 1/1000 shutter speed and yeah, just a hint of lens fungus. :cool:
Dralowid
08-07-2007, 04:36
Yes, I'vs seen this one before.
Just goes to prove that there is now a cottage industry converting Zorkis into these...or is it a Fed?
Michael
alternatve
08-07-2007, 08:18
Yes, I'vs seen this one before.
Just goes to prove that there is now a cottage industry converting Zorkis into these...or is it a Fed?
Michael
I'm afraid this one is the real deal.
I don't think anyone other then a scrap merchant can help this one...
Real deal no doubt - a II converted to IIIa converted to fish.bait converted to door.stop.
Soooo, fellas... how high will it go? Any guesses?
Some military enthusiasts might find it an attractive paper weight/conversation piece. Maybe?
No good: has no military markings.
I wonder when the first FSU will turn up in "Rare SS mouldy cheese covering" :)
Cheers, Ian
Really...... it just needs a little adjustment.....
This camera was up from the same seller 6 months ago and fell thru without a bid...
I'm just curious what I can do with it....
harry01562
08-07-2007, 16:40
This one doesn't appear to me to be fixable. The external corrosion is extensive, and I bet it is worse inside. The cost to replace parts would be incredible, and the camera would lose any ID that it may now possess.
A conversation piece for the person with more money than he can find ways to spend. Easily be the only one on your block to own one. Coupled with a good story, this could be almost anything the owner wanted it to be....
If that's important to more than one monied bidder, the price could be interesting. That's what an auction requires, competition from equals.
Harry
that's painful to look at :(
landsknechte
08-07-2007, 18:25
Wear appropriate to time spent underwater.
Points for the seller not coming up with a story of this camera being pulled from the wreckage of a u-boat.
Seriously, as a chemist, if I get this camera, I hope to be able to look at the long term corrosion that has occurred and maybe learn some things about better conservation of the good cameras that we are all using.
This camera was up from the same seller 6 months ago and fell thru without a bid...
I'm just curious what I can do with it....
You're leaving yourself wide open there ... :p
Anyone got some clever suggestions? :angel:
erikhaugsby
08-07-2007, 19:16
I'm more interested in what might be inside the film cassette--any chance that a picture or two is salvageable from the assumed film inside the cassette?
I'm thinking a loooong stand bath in D-76 or Rodinal, with plenty of whatever that base fog removing agent is.
landsknechte
08-07-2007, 19:21
I'm more interested in what might be inside the film cassette--any chance that a picture or two is salvageable from the assumed film inside the cassette?
I'm thinking a loooong stand bath in D-76 or Rodinal, with plenty of whatever that base fog removing agent is.
I think you'd have better luck scouring local flea markets for abandoned exposed film in old cameras. 40 years in the Baltic might have degraded the film stock a smidge.
This camera was up from the same seller 6 months ago and fell thru without a bid...
I'm just curious what I can do with it....
If I recall he sold a universal finder in the same condition when this camera was listed before..
This camera was up from the same seller 6 months ago and fell thru without a bid... I'm just curious what I can do with it....I know exactly what I'd do with it. Sit it right here on my desk and tell the biggest windy war stories I could dream up. :eek: No chance I'd do any maintenance to it, except maybe super glue that slow speed dial back on. ;) Best of luck on getting it [at a good price]. It's definitely one-of-a-kind.
No good: has no military markings.Whatta ya' talkin' about?! Can't you see that big ol' bullet hole right in front there? Okay, actually, I was passing a military reference with the description, not the camera. When I first read the ad, I thought, "how does this guy know where/who it came from? any Authentication?" .... But hey, he tells a good story... why ruin it? Let it lay. Certainly more interesting than those swastika-laiden-fresh-painted Zorkis runnin' around.
Ideally ... and it is crazy I'll admit, I would like to replace the internals of the camera but leave the outside exactly like it is. Something that looked like that and actually took photos would be a hoot! :)
The perfect tool for photographing 'grunge' bands maybe? :D
Regan's probably outside as I write ... burying a Zorki in the back yard!
I'm half wittedly (sic) thinking it might actually be a good candidate for a digital back conversion.......
I'm half wittedly (sic) thinking it might actually be a good candidate for a digital back conversion.......
Now you're thinkin' outside the square ... I like it! :D
LeicaTom
08-07-2007, 21:04
.....this could this be a start of a RATT movement style of cameras?
- maybe I DO need a TRASHED Grey Leica IIIC K to photograph with......
or a DIGITAL BACK IIIC K?????
oK I need some sleep....I`m starting to see things :)
Tom
David Murphy
08-07-2007, 21:46
Is that the coated or the non-coated Elmar?
landsknechte
08-07-2007, 22:38
Is that the coated or the non-coated Elmar?
It's multicoated. There's a layer of rust, a layer of calcium based crud, some brass patina...
What's it smell like?
I'd put it on a nice wooden base and set it on my desk (if I were to bid on it, which I wouldn't.)
The conversion to digital is a nice idea however.
rolleistef
08-08-2007, 13:53
i think the price is reasonable according to the work accomplished on this fed (zorki?), don't you think? Or is it a real leica??
alternatve
08-08-2007, 21:59
It's real.
Even they won't do such a thing to a perfectly good camera.
Some great ideas so far, and I look forward to actually getthing this thing in hand....
Will update y'all..lb
LeicaTom
08-14-2007, 14:25
Some great ideas so far, and I look forward to actually getthing this thing in hand....
Will update y'all..lb
Congrats on this Leo!
Did you get that link for that Wartime IIIC "Double Red Curtain" that sold in Austria for LESS than $200 that would have been one for the REPAIR SHOP!
Maybe even crazier still was a REAL "Luftwaffen Eigenturm" IIIC that sold here in Sarasota, Florida over the weekend for $500
The "DEALS" are still out there........
Talk to you soon
Tom
Just wanted to let everyone know that I received the camera yesterday.
Looks legit, but no film in the cassete ....darn.
Good news is, all of the parts appear to be present, the seller had them in some small bags that came along with the camera.
I have been able to unscrew the Elmar from the body and to get it freed up for opening. The optics are coated on the interior, but no one tried to clean the exterior surfaces with a rag..... NO major scratches. The back surface of the back element is pitted with some hazing but not too bad. If I can get the iron oxide off of the interior elements, this lens would actually work. Aperture is stuck at f/12.5. Rangefinder sine bar moves a little and the coupling wheel moves.
Body has a few light leaks and every steel screw in it has rusted out mostly. A few left with nubs in the threads that I may have to EDM out ....
More to follow.
alternatve
08-18-2007, 08:25
Just wanted to let everyone know that I received the camera yesterday.
Looks legit, but no film in the cassete ....darn.
Good news is, all of the parts appear to be present, the seller had them in some small bags that came along with the camera.
I have been able to unscrew the Elmar from the body and to get it freed up for opening. The optics are coated on the interior, but no one tried to clean the exterior surfaces with a rag..... NO major scratches. The back surface of the back element is pitted with some hazing but not too bad. If I can get the iron oxide off of the interior elements, this lens would actually work. Aperture is stuck at f/12.5. Rangefinder sine bar moves a little and the coupling wheel moves.
Body has a few light leaks and every steel screw in it has rusted out mostly. A few left with nubs in the threads that I may have to EDM out ....
More to follow.
I wonder what would the reaction if you sent it to DAG or Sherry for a complete overhaul!
I suppose that I would get an "asterisk" camera back!
Actually, I am considering doing just that with the lens.
As for the body, I am planning to replace the screws, save as much of the internals as I can and try to restore function. The curtain drum is free, and both curtain rollers are free and the curtains actually look like they might work, tho they are brittle.
I have an idea about leaving the external appearance alone, and coating the interior with black epoxy to fill the light leaks...... still thinking about how to proceed....
LeicaTom
08-18-2007, 12:45
I suppose that I would get an "asterisk" camera back!
Now that`s FUNNY :D !
Tom
LeicaTom
08-18-2007, 12:48
ohhh I forgot to add the *
"I have an idea about leaving the external appearance alone..."Good for you! The beater to end all beaters. A very interesting project. Good luck and keep us posted.
Progress Report: Got it apart!!!! Most of the steel screws are trash, but all of the brass
is protected with a layer of rust and aluminum oxide. Will have to replace most of the steel shafts and screws, but not much else. The curtains are still whole, but with many cracks, and ribbons are also still intact. have been aboe to remove all but the last 2 screws (diopter adjust retainer screw and the rewind knob screw) which will have to be drilled out. Tomottow....lb.
Hey DrLB, thanks for the update. You don't happen to have an ol' digi-something around to take a few quick.snaps of the work-in-progress, eh? Orrrrr.... we could all just come over to your house for a quick look - right guys?
Naa, serious... it's just mind boggling to me that there is anything inside that is remotely identifiable. A true testimony of the durability of these wonderful little machines. Carry on, good Doctor, carry on.
alternatve
08-22-2007, 03:14
Hey DrLB, thanks for the update. You don't happen to have an ol' digi-something around to take a few quick.snaps of the work-in-progress, eh? Orrrrr.... we could all just come over to your house for a quick look - right guys?
Naa, serious... it's just mind boggling to me that there is anything inside that is remotely identifiable. A true testimony of the durability of these wonderful little machines. Carry on, good Doctor, carry on.
My faith was secured in Leica's durability when I saw two models, one found on Mount Everest after resting there for many years and one model that took a bullet for a reporter (who survived).
It would be a really good story to tell the kids next time if you can get it up and running! Btw, a good leather covering helps keep a lot of light leaks away.
Samuel
Later this evening I'll post the dis-assembled pieces pix.
This is FUN......:D
landsknechte
08-22-2007, 21:14
and one model that took a bullet for a reporter (who survived).
The reporter or the Leica? :D
Here are some of the interior components .... enjoy:eek:
Notice the extreme rusting or lack of the steel screws:D
jolefler
08-24-2007, 12:30
I thought I had an ugly one! :eek:
I gotta say, I'm quite surprised. I expected, take the bottom cover off and fump!.. a pile of rust falls out. But there's actually stuff still intact there. You've definately got your work cut out for you, but hey... you da' Dr. :cool:
Wow, A Leica II with 1/1000...
What she looked like when I first opened here and laid out the major pieces.
erikhaugsby
08-25-2007, 13:21
What she looked like when I first opened here and laid out the major pieces.
That is really depressing. :eek:
Most of what is deposited is iron oxide from the steel springs, shafts and screws. Some amount of white aluminum oxide and green copper compounds. Basic structure is sound and will be repairable.
OOOOOOh....just got my new step rewirnd IIIC (s/n 392205). Later.
Shud have been with previous post.....:o
LeicaTom
08-25-2007, 13:40
Very kool Leo.......you are really coming along on it, I really hope you can get it working again :)
Tom
And some carefully applied solvents for the various metal oxides.....
Fabulous Leo - are you going to put it together ''as found '' as much as possible ?
Once you have finished - I will try to make a copy of it !
dee
Yes, right now, my plan is to use as much of the original camera as possible, replacing only the interior parts necessary to get it functional. The exterior will remain as is, except where I will be putting in opaque epoxy to seal light leaks. That will be done from the inside and then repainted black inside.
Top and bottom will remain as is, just cleaning off the loose stuff that would fall off anyway.
I have a piece of stretchy camera leather and I was thinking of making a sort of sock that could be taken off or put on as desired ... a "dress" versus "grunge" mode as some here have suggested.....:D
pesphoto
08-25-2007, 17:16
I can't believe what you paid for this thing. You must be a bit touched in the head. :)
Keep showing us your progress its very interesting stuff.
Yeah, my girlfriend thinks the same thing .... :eek:
But really, I wanted to learn where the major issues with corrosion and time are in the leica. At this point, I have been able to dis-assemble the Elmar, clean it out of all the rust from the aperture blades .... nothin left of them except some little black pieces of metal flake which washed out easily. The optical path is no longer obscured, however all external optical surfaces are severely etched, from the alkaline soils? This Elmar will never give a theoretical Airy disc again....
I've begun sealing the light leaks in the body and I should finish that sometime this week then comes the interior repaint and reassembly. Probably take about 3 weeks total time.
This is still fun....:confused:
So, now the questions.....
Anyone have any idea about the Elmar age? S/n: 138229 ....None of the charts I find go this low.
Camera s/n is 92035 which shud be sometime in 1935, but is black and shudn't be...according to Cameraquest list, this body is in the first batch of Leica II (Feb to Oct 1932) but shud be chrome, next batch with s/n's greater than 101000 were black????
I have also found an engraved "W" on the underside of the top cover between the two rangefinder sigt tubes.... What's that? PIX tomorrow.
I have also found an engraved "W" on the underside of the top cover between the two rangefinder sigt tubes.... What's that? PIX tomorrow.The plot thickens and I'm hanging on every post, Dr.L. Fun stuff. Hang in there. ツ
I had two earlier assessments that I think are correct. (1) "doctor_leo better be a reconstructive surgeon!" - True. and (2) "Real deal no doubt - a II converted to IIIa..." Factory conversions pretty much negate the serial numbers. Part of the conversion must have been *paint it black.* ... right? The W, I have no clue, but look forward to hearing accurate input on that. Maybe it stands for "waterline" ;)
john neal
08-26-2007, 23:16
Leo,
I have an 11 o'clock Elmar with a similar serial no - the best i have been able to learn is that numbering started at 80,000 in 1931/32 and that 120,000 would have been reached by the end of 1932.
Now this is really gratifying..... I have worked out the chemistry to strip the contamination and corrosion, WITHOUT attacking the base metal of the interior parts.
Most are brass alloys and have been resistant for the most part, to corrosion. There is, however, a little surface etching but nothing to severe.
Anyway, this picture is of the all important pressureplate and filmguide plate area of the restored interior light shield ....these are the ORIGINALS..... cool, huh? :D Please refer to earlier posts for how they started out.....
I have these at the first blackening step, planning to add at least 4 more layers to reach something near the original texture. These steps consist of coating, drying, buffing and repeat. I plan to replate all of the interior parts to match, as closely as my eye will allow, another IIa that I have ( an N-L engraved one).
More on this next step, re-rubberizing the original curtains?????
LeicaTom
09-14-2007, 20:35
Great stuff Leo :)
Ohh I have good news on that "black paint" deal, so that peeler IIIC can be your next project ;)
Tom
Was able to clean the rust out of the Elmar and actually get partially resolvable light through it.....
There, see .....Flamenco Beach in Rio....:D
As you can see, the glass was pretty severely etched over about 80% of the surfaces.... still, there is hope for it?????
Actually, the across the street neighbor's house....not too bad really, considering the lack of clear imaging path through this lens....
Oh, all of these were shot using my Sony P&S DCS-w100, @ 8.4 megapix, infinity focus and handheld through the Elmar.
LeicaTom
09-14-2007, 21:23
Actually, the across the street neighbor's house....not too bad really, considering the lack of clear imaging path through this lens....
Oh, all of these were shot using my Sony P&S DCS-w100, @ 8.4 megapix, infinity focus and handheld through the Elmar.
Wow!
Now thats some real soft "bokeh" :)
Tom
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