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I just want to share the kind of mails I receive from Leica. Now imagine Nikon, or Canon, or.....
At the outset I would like to take the opportunity to wish you and your loved ones a very Happy, Healthy and Successful 2007.
I would also like to thank you very much for your comments regarding your experience with the recently acquired LEICA M8 which I have transmitted to our Product Management. Concerning the batterie issue, you mentioned that you will come to our Customer Service in Solms in the near future. I am sure that our colleagues can help you concerning this topic.
We thank you for being a loyal Leica enthusiast and customer and wish you furtheron much enjoyment with your LEICA equipment.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards
Words are cheap.
I'm not sounding harsh am I?
Cheap? That is the first time I heard you say that about something coming from Solms. It appears there is still hope for a better world. :) ;)
IMO the fact there's nothing even remotely like an apology in their note smacks of supreme arrogance. Then again something tells me there was nothing in anything you wrote to them that would suggest you were expecting one :D
What on earth should they apologize for? Selling me the most satisfying camera I ever owned???
What on earth should they apologize for? Selling me the most satisfying camera I ever owned???
If you were not in the Netherlands I could have sworn you were Michael Reichmannn :D
Dave
zuikologist
01-08-2007, 13:35
Notwithstanding the circumstances of Jaap's communication with Leica, it is indeed refreshing to see a level of civility from a large (ish) company. It is not always the case...
What on earth should they apologize for?
I can believe you don't care, but I can't believe you don't know.;)
Hey,
Jaap is just extremely satisfied with his camera. I can respect that. Other people have problems with the Leica M8 for valid reasons. I think it would be safe to assume that the majority of people likley expected less problems with the M8's initial debut. Some people are just less willing to cut Leica some slack.
willie_901
01-08-2007, 19:09
Does anyone know a word for beyond surrealistic?
With all due respect - is the OP a gullible child or does he work for Leica?
Thread after thread after thread. I don't think the current business form of Leica is a publicly held company; but if it is then maybe he's a stockbroker trying to push a "pump and dump" scheme?
I can give my e-mail address to anyone who sells me something and get a thank you!
At the end of the day, why would anyone shill something so hard for so long if he wasn't getting something for it?
JeffGreene
01-08-2007, 19:47
My understanding is that he's a healthcare professional with no ties to Leica. He simply is very satisfied with his camera. There's no return involved here.
My understanding is that he's a healthcare professional with no ties to Leica. He simply is very satisfied with his camera. There's no return involved here.
I can understand enthusiasm - but you do realize that every new thread he posts here results in an additional Google "hit"? That's what make me wonder about being a shill.
Funny too that his OP on this thread gratuitously disparages Nikon and Canon which, last I checked, do not even make digi RFs and so do not compete with his beloved M8!
What's the point of that negativity?
I have a friend who used to work in a fish market - she always told me a that opening the door every morning was an olfactory adventure.....
Anybody else old enough to have heard the story about railroading's famous Pullman Company and its "bug letter"?
saxshooter
01-08-2007, 20:43
jlw: just googled it. priceless!
I have often wondered how intelligent people get drawn into strange religious cults and wind up shaving their heads ... dedicating their lives and handing over their hard earned life savings to some enigmatic figure who has orgies with female followers in the back of a Rolls Royce .......... I think I'm working it out!
They sadly, often finish in mass suicide ... I sincerely hope Jaapv escapes that bit ... he seems like a really nice fellow! :angel:
David Murphy
01-08-2007, 22:21
I just want to share the kind of mails I receive from Leica. Now imagine Nikon, or Canon, or.....
I'm impressed. This is old wold customer service -- hard to find these days (old or new world!)
I'm impressed. This is old wold customer service -- hard to find these days (old or new world!)
Ever give $ to a politician? Geez, talk about "fawning" follow-up e-mails!
I guess I have my spamblocker set too high! I keep tossing out all those e-mails from Nikon.
Oh, BTW, I bought a Nikon D-70 a couple of years ago and every other month or so they keep sending me this darned magazine. Seems as if all the shots in it are now taken with later models.
Isn't the Japanese culture even more "old world" that Europe's? ;)
Stephanie Brim
01-08-2007, 22:47
Seemed like a nice enough email to me. Doesn't seem to be an automated email, that's for sure.
Jaap may be taking his love for the M8 a bit too...far...but this email from Leica does indeed remind me of one of the good things about them: while they may be struggling in a changing market, they'll still reply to email personally.
Jaap may be taking his love for the M8 a bit too...far...but this email from Leica does indeed remind me of one of the good things about them: while they may be struggling in a changing market, they'll still reply to email personally.
Stephanie
The reason Jaap takes his love of the M8 "a bit to far" is when there are only two girls in town (the M8 and the RD1) its easier to love the sophisticated lady rather than the orphan. Because I'm still on the waiting list for the princess, I'm still enamored with Ms Epson, the only other girl with that rangefinder form!
Rex
..ARF!
With all due respect - is the OP a gullible child or does he work for Leica?
Thread after thread after thread. I don't think the current business form of Leica is a publicly held company; but if it is then maybe he's a stockbroker trying to push a "pump and dump" scheme?
I can give my e-mail address to anyone who sells me something and get a thank you!
At the end of the day, why would anyone shill something so hard for so long if he wasn't getting something for it?
Maybe- just maybe- might it be to offset the negativist nonsense that sometimes contaminates this forum?
Now just think for a moment - the users of the M8 are happy about the way the camera delivers and are posting numerous photographs, some of them pretty good, and some non-owners are hammering it without any apparent experience in real life or even any knowledge beyond parroting, which is something different from giving respectable and reasonable opinions. Apply a simple logic: if there is a hidden agenda, whose will it be? Or is it simple unreasoning Internet-rage, something akin to road-rage, it seems?
From another forum, by an experienced and proven photographer:
Overall I must say having dumped Canon [5D] for Leica, I don't feel I'm missing much but gained a lot (for my requirements) others may feel different. For me it's the clarity and detail that the Leica can render, the images have a look or feel that I'm very comfortable with at the moment.
It's funny(for me anyway) the more I use the M8 the more I understand why this brand has such a strong following. Even to the point where I'm enjoying my photography even more than I did before and I did not think that was possible.
seeing the direction of this thread. I would just like to say
OUCK FSU!!!! phuck the buckeyes!
and yet another thread will slowly trundle into the nether regions of human interaction.
Classy...really classy....
Dave
With all due respect - is the OP a gullible child or does he work for Leica?
Thread after thread after thread. I don't think the current business form of Leica is a publicly held company; but if it is then maybe he's a stockbroker trying to push a "pump and dump" scheme?
I can give my e-mail address to anyone who sells me something and get a thank you!
At the end of the day, why would anyone shill something so hard for so long if he wasn't getting something for it?
I'MO that's a ridiculous notion, not to mention a personal attack that I would expect left standing on photo.net but I'm dismayed has not been deleted here. Jaap and I share the same enthusiasm for the M8's many wonderful attributes but disagree vehemently on it's shortcomings.
Jaap has not made ludicrous statements touting the M8's lack of a sufficient internal IR filter as some sort of ingenious idea on Leica's part. He's simply willing to endure the filters because the alternative is foregoing the M8 entirely. I opted to pass on the M8, but not without great disappointment. I suspect that as soon as Leica brings out a new version that does not need the IR lens filters, Jaap will be one of the first in line to trade up (and I'll be in line to buy one). The whole zen of being an early-adopter just doesn't appeal to me. Clearly Jaap and I are cut from different cloth, but I have to say that all our disagreements have been respectful, and he's a true gentleman, entitled to his opinion and undeserving of malicious accusations.
Anybody else old enough to have heard the story about railroading's famous Pullman Company and its "bug letter"?
Yeah, but the note that said, "Send this guy the bedbug letter" was stuck in the envelope along with the bedbug letter by mistake. That's different from what's happening here.
You don't have to be very old to know about the bedbug letter. You just have to have run across it somewhere in your voracious and eclectic reading.
JeffGreene
01-09-2007, 13:01
Anybody else old enough to have heard the story about railroading's famous Pullman Company and its "bug letter"?
I was two when the Playboy piece was published, but I do believe Leica is sincere and honestly concerned about maintaining good relations with their customer base. Granted that the IR filter issue might seem an unacceptable workaround to some, but there is no question about overall image quality for the camera. I don't own one, but have experienced and even published here on the forum similar IR issues with my RD1. With all the other QC issues with the Epson the IR one seemed to have slipped through the cracks. So if anyone out there is totally dissatisfied with their M8, I'd be glad to take it off your hands for 2K. :D
I don't see what all the fuss is about. Jaap has been having good experiences with his camera and has been letting us know.
The Email from the Leica seems sincere.
I think there are too many sceptics about and people who can't be happy for their fellow man.
JeffGreene
01-09-2007, 18:17
I don't see what all the fuss is about. Jaap has been having good experiences with his camera and has been letting us know.
The Email from the Leica seems sincere.
I think there are too many sceptics about and people who can't be happy for their fellow man.
Couldn't have said it better myself!
Gabriel M.A.
01-09-2007, 18:28
With all due respect - is the OP a gullible child or does he work for Leica?
How far do people have to go before they are called on their lack of respect?
Gabriel M.A.
01-09-2007, 18:31
Ever give $ to a politician? Geez, talk about "fawning" follow-up e-mails!
Makes sense now, why Customer Service in this country is an oxymoron.
JeffGreene
01-09-2007, 18:46
How far do people have to go before they are called on their lack of respect?
Gabe:
Athena has a right to express her opinion. I would just caution her to avoid moving into "ad hominem" commentary about individual members. JAAPV has always been a great resource to many of us here. She is entitled to express her opinion about Leica as a corporate entity, but be warned. This is not photonet. She has no right to impugn JAAPV personally. He has helped me immensely as I adjusted to my new Leica gear. I would caution Athena that she is moving in a trollish directioin, and that kind of behavior is not appreciated here.
Gabriel M.A.
01-09-2007, 19:02
Athena has a right to express her opinion.
I agree; I didn't say she/he shouldn't. I have expressed mine as well. There are just respectful ways of doing it.
Just one thing: why do I get addressed on this? Did I offend you or her/him or anybody? Did I say something I shouldn't have?
JeffGreene
01-10-2007, 08:10
You didn't offend me! I felt JAAP had been misinterpreted by Athena. That's all.
First of all- thanks for all the kind words in my direction, but really folks, let's lay this matter of the owl-eyed lady to rest.
For one thing Patricia is starting to wonder why I am blushing all the time when sitting at my screen, and secondly I am not nearly as offended as I should be. Contrary to popular belief my daily job is 80% dealing with people in various stages of stress - prone to say and do all kind of silly things, and only 20 % is high-tech hobbyism.
So rash words don't bother me that much. The only last thing I want to say about this matter is that I do share Ben's disappointment that the moderation did not step in. But water under the bridge.
Back to Leica customer service. The e-mail I quoted was not a single occurence. I would not have dedicated a whole thread to it in that case. Since buying the M8 - and indeed over the years before that- I have had contact with Leica on a number of occasions and each and every time their response was in the same class as the e-mail in the OP. I do feel that it needs to be said that in my experience, Leica has always attempted to behave in a responsible and client-friendly manner to its customers, to the extent that I have come to the conclusion over a period of 35 years that the corporate mentality is: customers first. This also leads me to believe that the failure to be upfront about the IR issue of the M8 is a honest misjudgement or even an in-company communication failure and as such does not warrant strapping Leica to the guillotine.
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