Kiev 4AM jammed!

[jan normandale]

can anyone help? here's the situation

I have a problem. The shutter will not release, the film advance is also 'jammed' and will not wind in a clockwise direction unless I hold down the shutter release. When I have the film advanced in that way the shutter will still not release. I have also tried to release the shutter using the timer. No luck there either.

This all happened after taking about 5 exposures. I have now rewound the film back into the cartridge and removed it from the camera. I still am not able to turn the film advance dial on the Kiev. Strangely when I hold the shutter down and rotate the film advance dial in a clock wise direction the dial aways goes on half rotation and stops on the 500th setting, then I hold the shutter release down again and the dial rotates the remaining half rotation to the B setting.

I am unable to rotate the speed setting on this dial when I pull/lift up the dial and try to rotate it in a clockwise direction. It feels like it is locked or frozen at the B setting.

Any ideas or experience here. I love this camera and it's glass. I don't want to lose it.

[Ash]

I have no idea on a fix, probably needs the top plate off and a bit of a tweak. good luck!

[FrankS]

This probably won't help, but remove the back and rotate the film sprocket wheels in the direction of film travel. Also take a lookie at the shutter curtains to see if they look straight and on track. Good luck.

[jan normandale]

Ash.. if I take covers off anything I always make things worse. I am experienced at this lal!

Frank... I've done that and the take up does rotate. The shutter curtains are not moving..

thanks for the thoughts

[JohnM]

Last resort - Yuri at Fedka.com in NYC has a technician who works on Kievs. Turnaround time is stated as being a little over a week.

(I have literally just sent my 4am to them this week - the CLA is $80, add $25 if the shutter ribbons need replacement.)

[w3rk5]

I think I know what's wrong. Just a wild guess though. I think what happened is the lower curtains got unhookd from the top curtain.

It's not a difficult thing to fix if that's the case. Check out this link from The Kiev Survival Site on how to remove the "film plane casting" to see.
http://www3.telus.net/public/rpnchbck/the%20basics%20back%20film%20plane%20casting%20rem oval.html

I know this answer is a little vague. Just let me know if you don't get it. :)

[colyn]

I had my 4am jam up like this once. I found the shutter button was not fully returning to its full up position. I placed a couple of drops of oil around the edge of the button and let it sit over night. It started working right then.

[jan normandale]

w3rk5 and Colyn; I'm going to try both. Thanks for the ideas

[ErnestoJL]

Jan:
Two questions:
a) The shutter speed dial allways returns to B?
b) If so, does the shutter work properly (set in B)?

If yes, perhaps I can bring you a clue.
When I bought my Contax II, I had the same problem, the camera´s shutter only worked on B setting. The reason why it happened was a tiny spring that was broken right under the top cover, and inmediately under the speed dial. This spring is part of the speed selector assy, and keeps a lever clear of the dial detents at any sppeds other than B. If it´s broken the speed cannot be changed, and the shutter works in an unpredictable manner.

May be this is part of your problem. Hope it helps.

Ernesto

[jan normandale]

Ernesto, I'm begining to think I have a problem like you are suggesting. I might just send it out or see if I can find another.

[w3rk5]

Good luck with it Jan..........would appreciate an update when you get this issue taken care of. Thanks.

[40oz]

FWIW, sometimes the shutter on my Kiev 4 would apparently not trip something when I took a picture. So I could turn the film advance wheel about half a turn, and then it would stop. The first time, I was near the end of the roll anyway, so I assumed that's all it was. But it happened again on the next roll only a few pictures in, so I fully depressed the shutter, and something clicked and I could advance the film/wind the shutter. This happened a few more times on that roll, and once on the next roll, and same solution each time. Now, two more rolls later, it hasn't happened again. It has a 79******.... serial, so it was probably just sitting too long. The pictures were, well, fantastic, so I have no doubt the shutter speeds are right where I expect them to be.

IMHO, the camera is worth having when it is working properly, so if yours doesn't loosen up and resolve itself in a few days, I'd get it fixed. It's worth it. I got mine for far less than $100, and there is no way I could get as nice a piece of glass and camera for anywhere near the money. I could spend 5 times as much for much less.

[Spyderman]

It sometimes happened to me as well. It was always a slow speed B - 1/5. Try lifting the shutter speed knob, and move it beteen slow and fast speeds. Maybe set a fast speed and try to release it...

[mpt600]

Maybe try www.kyphoto.com/classics for a fix. They're usually pretty good.

[jan normandale]

40, spyder and mpt... I'll check these out too. Sometimes it's worth a bit of extra effort because the process of packaging and mailing then waiting is even longer!

[Xmas]

Jan
Fisrt dont try force, you probably have the Ru wax syndrome, one of the two clock work latches under the speed selector, has jammed from solidified grease. Less likely is a broken spring, it is still 'easy' to replace the spring. Even a 25 year old leica made in Canada will have this problem.

Please post where your shutter curtain is - is it up or down - the join between the top and bottom curtains should be just visible at top or bottom of film opening. And what speed does the dial stop at, i.e. what speed were you using. If the speed is a slow speed then the logic problem can be in the body of the camera and the main casting may need to be removed to address, (again wax) quite difficult and about 7 hours work (for me).

Alas in any of these cases the fix is remove the shutter knob which needs a pin wrench or a good pair of circlip pliers, if you dont have circlip pliers in your tool box for the auto, from stripping a diff or gear box, then you probably need to send the camera out to the local watchmaker or a Kiev specialist. If you give a watchmaker the Kiev survival link, it is a Canuk site, he should have no problem as the Kiev is merely a large watch/small grandfather.

It may be cheaper to buy another Kiev body which comes with a CLA and warrenty. You can put away the old body as a toy for a nephew or cousin who is handy with a screwdriver...
Noel

[jan normandale]

Noel, I don't have any of the tools you mention. i think buying them and then trying the repair may be more costly than passing it in for a repair. Thanks for the thoughts.