View Full Version : Zeiss Ikon SW Superwide Camera
Thornwood, N.Y. – The Zeiss Ikon SW is the 35mm precision camera for uncompromising super-wide photographers. Compatible with M bayonet mount lenses, the Zeiss Ikon SW was designed specifically for use with one of the ZEISS high performance super-wide angle lenses: Distagon T* 2.8/15 ZM or one of the Biogon T* types from the ZEISS ZM range.
An accessory shoe directly above the lens takes the corresponding super-wide Viewfinder 15mm ZI, 21mm ZI or 25/28mm ZI. A second shoe is also built-in to take a flash, a bubble level or other accessory.
The electronically controlled metal focal plane shutter offers speeds ranging from 1/2000 sec. – 8 sec. in automatic mode (AE-lock is available) and 1/2000 - 1 sec. + B in manual mode. The fastest flash sync speed is 1/125 sec.
The Zeiss Ikon SW offers the same extremely high image quality as the current Zeiss Ikon rangefinder camera, which is far above today’s digital cameras. It is fully integrated into the Zeiss Ikon system. Since the Zeiss Ikon SW comes without the complex rangefinder mechanism, the price is considerably more affordable than other rangefinder cameras.
The Zeiss Ikon SW will be available beginning October 2006 in a choice of chrome or black finish at a list price of $999.00.
SolaresLarrave
08-24-2006, 14:22
The answer to the Bessa T? ;)
Thanks, Jorge! I'm not in the market for anything like this, but I'm sure it should interest some people. Let's bump it! :)
Francisco, it looks more like the Bessa L to me. And only slightly more expensive.:p
Kurt M.
cinematix
08-24-2006, 15:07
Yes, It looks like fancy expensive Bessa L... I like it though..
SolaresLarrave
08-24-2006, 15:18
Ooops, I never got those quite right. True, it's a nice(ly expensive) Bessa T.
robertdfeinman
08-24-2006, 15:49
Considering you can get a Bessa L for under $100 and a screw to bayonet adaptor for about $60 why would anyone need this, except for snob appeal.
With the L you can also use the 12mm Heliar directly.
I think as film cameras become less common the status factor will be more important to makers. We will be seeing more of what I consider "doctor's" cameras.
In the old days these were just Leica's and Hasselblads.
back alley
08-24-2006, 16:12
i'd like one.
it would pair up with my zi and i'd use it as intended with a wide angle lens. be nice to have the same camera/meter etc fo my lenses.
What's the point? Spend a little more and get the normal body with RF.
back alley
08-24-2006, 16:39
if i wanted to keep a 21 or the 25 on it and never focus again.
back alley
08-24-2006, 16:40
it's funny, people thought the bessa l and the t were good ideas and added to the rf world/culture but because this is more expensive everyone spits on it.
makes no sense to me.
joe
it's funny, people thought the bessa l and the t were good ideas and added to the rf world/culture but because this is more expensive everyone spits on it.
makes no sense to me.
joe
I don't think people are spitting on it per se.. but I would question the motives.
Cosina is clearly making the Zeiss bodies to Zeiss specifications.
Cosina, some time ago now (if memory serves correctly) cancels the Bessa L and Bessa T.
Suddenly (i.e. out of the blue) the Zeiss SW appears as though the Bessa L and Bessa T never existed.
Not that there's anything wrong with producing this type of body again but it does sort of smack of a money grab by whomever (be it Zeiss OR Cosina) to those willing to spend the coin.
The flip side of this, of course, is the same thing can be said of Leica and the LHSA who produce "special editions" for people to collect while not adding any significant advances to the actual product line itself.
Just my meager 2 cents worth,
Dave
Dave, I think Cosina is payed by Zeiss to produce those cameras.
back alley
08-24-2006, 17:35
and cosina, like other camera makers has discontinued products that had a limited shelf life.
Dave, I think Cosina is payed by Zeiss to produce those cameras.
Perhaps yes.. but what I'm questioning is the following:
Is it the dog wagging his tail or the tail wagging the dog?
Is it really Zeiss who's said "You know what we'd like.. something like a SuperWide camera" or is it Cosina who's said to Zeiss "You know what would be cool for you guys to have in your product line . . . "
And seeing as how Cosina has produced a camera like this before; I'd hazard a guess that it's the latter rather than the former.
I'm just questioning it, that's all, as I certainly don't know the truth behind the speculation I'm making. I'm sure, that if it's anything like the former Bessa L / T offerings that it will be well received if not more so.
Dave
back alley
08-24-2006, 17:51
but then we get back into the argument that the zi is a rebadged bessa and that then this sw is a rebadged l or t.
and i just don't believe that.
if anything cosina is making better cv gear because of the zeiss influence.
but then we get back into the argument that the zi is a rebadged bessa and that then this sw is a rebadged l or t.
and i just don't believe that.
if anything cosina is making better cv gear because of the zeiss influence.
I'm not stating that this is a rebadged anything.
I'm quite aware that it's a "different" camera body - it's clear in the shape and make but the concept is the same. Now one can argue that the concept is going to be the same merely because it's a rangefinder and that you can only do "so much" with that type of camera but what I am saying is that I really question the fact that Zeiss requested Cosina to make this body rather than Cosina influencing Zeiss since they (Cosina) already know the way to make said bodies (having had previous experience with the Bessas).
I don't doubt that these will/are more durable than the previous Bessa offerings, which were great deals and a great way for folks to get into RF photography without splurging a small fortune, but again I just question what motives are driving this (other than the obvious sales one.. which some may argue is the only thing that matters).
Dave
"You know what we'd like.. something like a SuperWide camera" or is it Cosina who's said to Zeiss
"You know what would be cool for you guys to have in your product line . . . "
Dave
#1. OEM
#2. ODM sale pitch
both the OEM customer and the manufacturer interact, you can't define who is tell who what to do...
but I would say it should be Zeiss idea, remember the Hologon Super Wide camera 20 (or so) years ago?
Zeiss can sell a thousand or two, easily..
Some professional don't want to be caught dead with a Bessa L on assignments...
Is an image thing....
back alley
08-24-2006, 18:18
for me, it's like this...if i could get a bessa t for 50 bucks, i would buy it.
if i had the cash i would buy the sw in a new york minute.
right after i got the black zi body :)
Exactly. The Hassi SWC. Older than the Bessa L.
Oh, that one too.
I meant the Hologon Super Wide based on the Ikon SLR before the whole series dies...
Saw it once or twice, but I can't remember the name.
Zeiss seems to have a great history with SW, all went back to aerial surveillance lens, huh?
Todd.Hanz
08-24-2006, 18:26
it'd be nice if this was a pano format like the Xpan, it would make a bit more sense and probably sell better.
Todd
flashover
08-24-2006, 18:28
hum I just bought Andy's Bessa L and 25/4 for 200 bucks. Other then the mount what has this camera got that's worth 1k more the name?
A $1,000 for an extra mounting shoe and no finder?
I didn't know the Bessa has AE and well as metering in manual exposure? Nor did I know the Bessa and SW both have the same shutter, reliability, and QC.
I think if you don't understand the benefits of this camera, I would suggest you not buy one. But to disparage it seems a little harsh. I think it is a great tool if someone was looking for a superwide 35mm camera. The price is not strange either. At least not for a professional. Having the use of a superwide camera, I can tell you it is a great specialty camera.
Hats off to Zeiss Ikon for making such a camera. It is nice to see companies producing excellent tools for the sake of it rather than just looking to appease consumers with flashy gear just to be popular. I hope they make other innovative products when most camera manufactures are just trying to get market share.
I too thought immediately of the Hasselblad SWC, but that was only because of the name. More important was that what came to mind was a design with a curved film plane, since cameras with those have been made and possibly still are made.
Since, however, this "new" Zeiss can take any M mount lens, it is in principle no different from the Bessa T. Their screw predecessors were the Bessa L and the Leicas prior to the II. It remains possible to use a separate, or shoe mounted, range-finder on such cameras and transfer the distance read to the lens in use.
Cosina would have had no reason to encourage Zeiss to design or market this or any other kind of camera unless it had a financial stake in that company, or a profit sharing arrangement which would bring it a little extra for its experience with the Bessas L and T. For years it has been mainly a maker of what it has been paid to make. Possible it has contributed to design, but such things seldom emerge from drawing offices.
[Correction] Not "the Leicas prior to the II" but all Leicas, earlier or later, which had no range-finders built in: Ic, M1, MD, etc. Only the early ones were used with accessory range-finders such as the FODIS, and I got muddled.
KoNickon
08-25-2006, 13:18
This is an M mount camera, with autoexposure, neither of which the Bessa L has. Is it worth $1,000? I don't know; I would say it's priced rather high. But it's not as extreme a price, relatively, as that of the ZI external finders.
Todd.Hanz
08-25-2006, 13:25
the perfect thousand dollar "hip shooter", how vogue :)
I do agree with many of your statements...
But don´t forget: this little item (expensive, not worth the money etc...) gives our rangefinderworld another member.
Welcome Zeiss Ikon SW!
Greetings to you all
Bully
$1000 for a metal box to put film in? Not to mention an ugly metal box... No thanks... I'll stick with the Bessa L
Why would anyone choose to pay this much money for a camera without a rangefinder when the normal version with rf is not really much more? I understand the ZM 15mm is not helicoided and all that but wouldn't it be better to have a camera that will work with your other lenses? Guess focusing a 25mm at close distances wide open isn't exactly a piece of cake. At least the Bessa L was cheap.
whitecat
08-26-2006, 02:55
Wouldn't a Bessa L do the same thing?
ZeissFan
08-26-2006, 04:04
The Bessa-L does the same thing. However, you can't mount Leica M-mount lenses to it, as it's LTM. So you couldn't buy any of the Zeiss glass and use it with the Bessa-L.
This camera would work well for the purists -- those who want Zeiss glass mounted to a Zeiss body. Or for those who want a dedicated body for superwide lenses AND have the pocketbook to pay for it.
Nachkebia
08-26-2006, 04:17
ugly metal box are you a window shoper? :D
are you a window shoper? :D
In this case, yes. the Zeiss IKON is an ugly duckling next to a Leica M. This one looks it was born with its eyes shut.
I like how the Zeiss logo, "Zeiss, Ikon", and SW are spread out evenly and unimaginatively across the front face of the camera. Looks like the designer used MS Word to design this body and was limited by the document margines.
Nachkebia
08-26-2006, 06:30
ywenz : You are funny :) I am designer though :D
ywenz : You are funny :) I am designer though :D
I just looked at your gallery.. amazing pictures!
Nachkebia
08-26-2006, 07:03
ywenz : Thank you but zeiss ikon is great looking camera :D ofcourse leica is a beauty but zeiss has something individual, it is more stelar, it is somehow medical in some way, whole zeiss brand has medical aesthetics to me, thanks god my zeiss ikon does not have that blue zeiss logo :D
back alley
08-26-2006, 12:15
the zeiss reminds me of the minolta cle and i like the look of both.
This is the most expensive stupid camera i've ever seen. By the way this is a RANGE FINDER forum. This camera doesn,t even have a range finder !
A Bessa L for $100 is ok but this camera for $1000 is really odd:eek:
This is the most expensive stupid camera i've ever seen. By the way this is a RANGE FINDER forum. This camera doesn,t even have a range finder !
A Bessa L for $100 is ok but this camera for $1000 is really odd:eek:
Yeah! There should be a law against things like this.
RIVI1969
08-29-2006, 09:32
Could I ask what is the benefit of using this body over any other regular rangefinder camera with the same lenses?
Could I ask what is the benefit of using this body over any other regular rangefinder camera with the same lenses?
Counter question, what is the benefit of a built in view- and rangefinder with an uncoupled lens and external viewfinder?
Does anyone here shoot strictly wide?
monochromejrnl
09-19-2006, 14:17
for that sort of money + the cost of a lens you might also considered a used Hassy SWC!
back alley
09-19-2006, 14:29
Does anyone here shoot strictly wide?
i seem to be moving in that direction.
joe
Jon Perry
09-19-2006, 16:24
Nice!
It's an up market Bessa L. :)
It seems like for the price of the 15 or even the 21 it would be a better deal to get a hassy swc
Somehow I don´t get the concept of this camera! with the Bessa L it was the cheapest alternative for using the 15 Heliar and this worked sales wise but 1000$ for AE in Superwide?? Ain´t TTL lightmeters fooled easily by WA lenses anyways?
otoh I salute Zeiss for bringing out exotic Film equipment in these digital times!
BUT I much rather have my Leica Standard WA (Leica L or whatever you wanna call it ;) ) plus incident light meter...
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=28397&d=1150191828
What does this camera provide me over my Canon Model P and Gossen Luna Pro--$400 total? CV wide/ superwide lenses come w/ a dedicated VF. Am I missing something here?
Bill, hows about mounting M-Mount lenses on the camera?
Bill, hows about mounting M-Mount lenses on the camera?
If "the camera" is my Model P, impossible. LTM to M--OK w/ adapter, but not the reverse.
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