View Full Version : Load A Leica Bottom-Loader!
There has been so many posts by people who find loading a bottom-loading Leica, FED etc. a chore that I've done a very quick down & dirty "How To" in pictures. I hope this will take the "mystery" out of stuffing film in the bottom of those cameras!
There are eight pictures so this will be done in two separate posts.
Picture One: You need the film, a pair of sissors and the camera.
Picture Two: Pull about 3 1/2 inches of film from the cassette. Four sprocket holes from the cassette, begin your cut and try to approximate what you see here. I add the little snips on the end to sort of round the leader but it's not necessary.
Picture Three: Remove the bottom of the camera body and remove the take-up spool.
Picture Four: Insert the leader under the flat spring of the take-up spool as shown. Note that the film is up against the flange of the spool at the top.
Picture Five: A closer view of the film in the take-up spool.
Now go to the second post for the remainder of the pictures and instructions.
There has been so many posts by people who find loading a bottom-loading Leica, FED etc. a chore...
This may sound wierd, but I can load my M quicker than I can load my R2 or my CLE. I actually prefer bottom-loading. :D
Picture Six: With the cassette in your left hand and the take-up spool in your right hand, pull a little more film from the cassette. Now insert BOTH at the same time BUT twist the take-up spool slightly clock-wise so that the film is against the back of the loading chamber and at 90 degrees to the flat spring that is holding the film to the spool. The idea is to clear the sprocket teeth. Seat both the cassette and the take-up spool at the same time. Note that the film is clear of the sprocket teeth.
Picture Seven: With the film rewind clutch in the film advance position (rotated back toward the film advance knob), make sure the rewind has engaged the cassette properly. Now pull the rewind shaft out and s-l-o-w-l-y take up the slack in the film. As you do, watch the take-up spool and ensure that as the film tension increases, the film holes engage the sprocket teeth. Seat the rewind shaft to it's normal position.
Picture Eight: Note that the film holes are engaged by the film advance sprocket teeth.
With the bottom still off, advance the film one frame and note that the film takes up and that the rewind knob turns to indicate that the film is being advanced. If all has gone as expected, you can replace the bottom, fire the shutter and advance the film once again and trip the shutter. Set the counter to zero and you're ready to advance to frame one and take pictures.
Piece of cake........ right? ;)
back alley
06-08-2005, 19:45
This may sound wierd, but I can load my M quicker than I can load my R2 or my CLE. I actually prefer bottom-loading. :D
you're right ray, it does sound wierd!
-----------------------------------------------
nice job walker!
thanks,
joe
This may sound wierd, but I can load my M quicker than I can load my R2 or my CLE. I actually prefer bottom-loading. :D
I'm not surprised. Bottom loading may take a little practice but it's NOT as difficult as people make it out to be. Leica made bottom loaders for at least 30 years before going to an open-back loading camera and then it wasn't a fully-open type.
I just hope that this post will help take some of the challenge out of it for those who have never loaded a Leica through the bottom before.
Joe, this was a very quick project and not as comprehensive as I'd like to do. When I get the time, I'll try to do a better job with more and better pics.
Walker
Fedzilla_Bob
06-08-2005, 19:49
It's kind of like catching one of those public service anouncements that teach you something you didn't realize was good to know.
bottom loading is easy and fool proof. you just need a pocket.
It's all straight forward and easy for me until it gets semi-dark, such as an outdoor concert.
I like to visually check to see if the sprocket holes in the film are aligned with the sprocket teeth before installing the bottom cover. So I've added a miniature LED flash light to the lanyard of my light meter. Also, the film clip on the Leica take-up spool is a bit tighter than its Russian counter part. Having the light dangling from my neck helps here as well.
Another reason for the LED is that my light meter has no back-light.
captainslack
06-09-2005, 15:27
Thank you, Walker!!! Excellent timing!! I'm expecting a Zorki I in the mail pretty soon and this thread will be invaluable!!!
For you FSU bottom feeders---er loaders it might be worth noting that some of the later FSU spools for these camera have a hook that hooks through a film sprocket hole rather than the Leica-Type tensioned clip. Makes for a sure-fire hook-up ....BUT... when you rewind, the piece of film right at the end of the leader usually breaks off at the sprocket holes where the hook is. It's a good idea to keep the camrera bottom down until you remove the bottom plate. Otherwise that tiny piece of film can get into the gear train and cause problems. Almost every FED or Zorki 1 I've ever opened has had at least one piece of leader floating around in critical areas or already jammed into a gear.
crackers
06-14-2005, 05:30
For those hooked spools ... using fingernails, tear away the outer edge forming the last few sprocket holes so there will be no chips.
I believe the original poster is providing a guide for loading film into a Leica thread mount camera, not an M. Loading an M is a entire different thing and it is fast.
By now a book could probably be produced with all the articles that have been written about how to load a Leica RF. The story goes that the bottom-loading idea was to make a sturdier body. I don't have any screw-mount models, but I don't find my M4-2 so damned difficult to load.
About all those articles - Did anyone ever hear of an INSTRUCTION BOOK - probably provided, at least originally, with every Leica ever made.
richard_l
07-13-2005, 18:53
.....I don't have any screw-mount models, but I don't find my M4-2 so damned difficult to load.....
Is the M4-2 supposed to be hard to load? I thought it loaded just like the M4 and later M cameras.
Nikon Bob
07-13-2005, 19:12
If the M4-2 does load like the M4 than it is very much easier to load than the screw mount models.
Bob
For screwmount models, I would recommend the following in addition to the excellent info in the original posts...
If your camera has a "T" option (my IIIc has it...), remove the lens, set to "T" and fire the shutter which will open the shutter and keep it open. As you slide the film and spool in from the bottom, the film often snags on the edge of the shutter window and it is now easy to see and to gently guide it past that point with your finger and all the way in to place.
The operative word is GENTLY.
Hope that helps...
Tuna
richiedcruz
07-26-2005, 19:18
Now that I have run some rolls through my IIIC, there is one thing that I have noticed that may make things easier for some people.
When you put the film leader into the spool, it should be jammed under the tab pretty good. If you tug on it, the film should offer some resistance. If it comes right out, pull up on the tab a bit until you can get it far enough for the film to do so.
When you are rewinding a roll, this allows you to tell when you have wound all the way back to the leader. Which I find makes things easier, when I am loading up reels.
Hope that helps people avoid the dreaded 36 shots of air that seems so common to first time bottom loader users :D
Richie
I believe the original poster is providing a guide for loading film into a Leica thread mount camera, not an M. Loading an M is a entire different thing and it is fast.
My M3 loads with a take-up spool, not the three-prongs......
As someone else stated, there is not much similarity between loading a Leica M and a true screw mount bottom loader. You don't even have to cut a special tongue when loading an M because the pressure swings up and out of the way.
A key in a bottom loader is to cut the tongue long enough so you can hook it to the take-up spool with the full-width film still on the cassette side of the actual 24 x 36 frame where the film is exposed. That way, when you begin pulling the film across, both edges will be riding on the film rails and can't curl up and get hooked in the frame. Another key is to make sure the leader sprocket holes mesh properly with the teeth of the take-up sprocket.
It may sound technical but it really isn't once you get the hang of it. I can cut an appropriate leader without using a template and the film will load properly the first try 9 out of 10 times (about as good an average as I have on a non-autoloading SLR). IT REALLY ISN"T THAT DIFFICULT.
I wonder if Henri C-B found screw-mount Leicas hard to get along with.
Yes, the M4-2 loads like any other M series - which is a good bit easier than the LTMs.
Excellent thread. Dare I add though, that its isn't mandatory to cut the film at all. All you need is a thin business card as follows.
1. insert the leader into the take-up spool as normal
2. drop the spool and film cassette into the camera, so they are just inside the base
3. slide the business card into the camera between the film and the shutter housing until you encounter resistance (you may need to angle the card to get it fully home). the card should be inserted at the centre point of the housing
4. push the film home, and wind-on one frame (hold the card while you do this, or it may get sucked towards the take-up spool). fire the shutter
5. remove the card, and replace the bottom. wind-on and fire the shutter once or twice more, then begin your shooting
Obviously it pays to practice this method with no lens mounted before doing it in earnest, but its much faster than trimming the film. :)
john neal
09-06-2005, 23:34
TimF is right - both by Canon IID1 and IVf came with a thin piece of paxolin, slightly larger than a credit card for just this purpose. If you have a canon RF case with a slim pouch at the back, that's where the card should be.
Mark Wood
09-07-2005, 01:54
The "credit card method" for loading screw mount Leicas seems to be gaining a lot of popularity if the web sites I've seen are to be believed. I've tried it and it works BUT...
Inserting anything other than a properly trimmed film into the camera opens up unecessary risk to the camera innards. I've spoken to a specialist Leica repairer in the UK at length about this and he of course, gets to see the casualties from this sort of thing. In particular, poking fingers and other implements(!) through an open shutter to properly locate the film can easily lead to damage to the pressure plate. My IIIc had a seriously damaged plate (that put deep scratches along film) from a previous owner doing something along these lines but I was lucky in that a spare one was available-this won't be the case forever.
Cutting a film leader certainly needs a bit of care and forward planning but it pays off in the end. I believe that brand new copies of the original Leica template are even still available although sadly, they aren't cheap. (The instruction sheets in boxes of Kodachrome even had cutting instructions and a template in the 1980s!) A properly trimmed leader and a bit of practice and you can load a screw mount first time, every time - honest!!
Point taken Mark. It definitely needs to be stressed that any business card used for this method must be thin (no thicker than stiff paper really). If the film is pushed down sufficiently, there shouldn't be contact between the card and the pressure plate.
Mark Wood
09-07-2005, 04:51
Cheers Tim, I just don't want to see these beautiful cameras disappear! The few times that I've tried to load a film with a card have always left me fiddling with the film to make it sit properly on the sprocket drive. That's something I've never found with the longer leader as a gentle turn on the rewind knob after dropping the film and take-up spool into the camera always seems to make it hit the sprockets first time.
Until I found an ABLON template at a sensible price (very difficult), I used a homemade copy, put together from two sheets of thin brass (from a model shop) and in true "Blue Peter" style (apologies, that's a 1970s UK thing...), some clear sticky backed plastic which acted as a protective covering and a hinge. I guess a similar template made from thick cardboard would be just as effective.
Nikon Bob
09-07-2005, 05:07
Mark
I have never tried the credit card trick but like you have made my own template from an aluminum T-square used for dry wall cutting. The film is held for cutting between the aluminum halves by large office paper clips. The longer leader works well as it should.
Bob
Mark Wood
09-07-2005, 06:21
Hi Bob. I tried to mimic the ABLON template shape with the brass sheets (it was thin enough to cut with scissors) to make sure that the leader didn't tear. The only advantage that the beautifully engineered Leica template really has is the locating pins for the sprocket holes which make the whole thing foolproof.
One caution to anyone cutting a leader - make absolutely sure that the cut towards the edge of the film as you cut the curve does not go through a sprocket hole as that's a recipe for bits of film in the shutter and torn film. If the film tears at allas you cut it (tricky to avoid this problem using scissors), resign yourself to a 33 exposure film and start again!!
Do ABLONs still turn up on eBay? That's where I got mine; in fact it was the very first item I ever bought from that site, and (small world) the seller was a guy who worked in the Leica dealer I go to!! :D
Mark Wood
09-08-2005, 03:13
I've never looked for one on eBay - mine came from a "classic camera" dealer quite a while ago. Ffordes (a well known UK dealer, now in Scotland) are advertising a new template for around £50-60 and a UK camera repairer called (I think) Ralph Worman also advertises one on his web site but without a price. The latter looks pretty much the same as ABLON.
atelier7
11-17-2005, 07:10
I'm trying to load my IIIc for the very first time. When I try to put the film cassette and spool in, there seems to be something that prevents the film from slotting in easily. When I shone a light into the slot, I noticed that there is a metal ring that is attached to the back of body. (it seems to be about the same diameter as the front ring to screw the lens in). there are 2 points on this ring in the film slot which jut out and they appear to be blocking the film. Is this normal???
Nikon Bob
11-17-2005, 07:44
I just checked my IIIc and think I saw the two points that you mentioned so I would guess that that is normal. Have you cut the leader as suggested?
Bob
Yes, cut the leader, it is the only way the film will slot in. Make sure the film is wound on the take-up spool in the right direction too.
atelier7
11-17-2005, 10:48
Eureka!!! It works! I did trim the film as per the instructions and photos, but had to make sure the film leader was a bit narrower. Once again, this site has proven to be a source of invaluable information!
Nikon Bob
11-17-2005, 11:43
Strange as I just extend the leader at the same width as the supplied short leader.
Bob
I find reverse winding the film on the take-up spool-just a half-turn- helps get the film to load, untrimmed. I sometimes have to do the "through-the-lens" trick, but it doesn't take any force.
Ronald M
12-12-2005, 05:25
All I can add is cut off 24 sprocket holes on the top half. Then when you load, allow the tinyest bit of full width film protrude from the cassette, 1/8 inch. Other wise what tends to happen is getting a full width from the cassette requires more force than the tension on the take up spool has and film does not transport.
It is also possible to set the camera on T, and just push the film against the pressure plate and up into the channel. Current 8 sprocket hole trim works fine for this technique.
Pherdinand
12-12-2005, 05:34
A whole thread about how to load a bottom loader... See? that's why i say "no bottom loader for me thanks". :D
Nikon Bob
12-12-2005, 06:17
A whole thread about how to load a bottom loader... See? that's why i say "no bottom loader for me thanks". :D
Just look at it as a labour of love for old things (my wife does)
Bob
Twenty-two holes should do, Ronald: enough for me, anyway.
Ronald M
12-13-2005, 02:53
I used to use 21 or 22 and had trouble. It is suppoed to be enough, but either the rewind clutch slipped or the film came off the rewind reel. Either case no transport.
Using 24 allows me to set the full width exactly so no extra force is requied to get the full width from the cassett. Might be something special with my 111f, I don`t know.
Never had a missload with the M3 or M6 as I can see the sprocket holes are engaged. I wish I could see what happens and then I could make a better analysis and fix. Two different repair people have looked at the camera and found nothing wrong.
jorgef2002
02-06-2006, 06:36
Fellow Photographers,last night in ebay I won a leica M2 with a lens,summicromF5.cm 1.2,for $739.00,the camera is in good shape a nick here and there but overall clean,question I do a lot of street photography,and I need a 35mm lens,I am looking at a voiglander,and a leica,or I will not know the diference ?,what about the price did I do good,lens ,camere and case for $739.thank you and please advice.
jorgef2002 :bang:
captainslack
02-23-2006, 10:58
Shouldn't this thread be in the Screw-mount forum now?
srtiwari
04-22-2006, 11:21
For anyone eagerto buy an ABLON.... :rolleyes:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=800431088&is=USE&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation
It looks like a keeper. :angel:
But, I'll keep my trusty scissors.
Shouldn't this thread be in the Screw-mount forum now?
Why? An M2 is M Mount.
This thread has been resident and stuck in the Leica M forum for a while. I thought it made sense to copy and stick it here in the LTM forum too.
atelier7
07-04-2006, 19:36
it's all part of the charm of a barnack... bottom loading, separate viewfinders, no meter, knob winding... i'm almost beginning to wish i had my bessa r instead!
I found a 15.00 copy of an ablon, it's not a Leica but it works
http://cgi.ebay.com/COPY-of-Leica-ABLON-Metal-Film-Trimming-Template-Guide_W0QQitemZ7630961440QQihZ017QQcategoryZ30030Q QssPageNameZWD1VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
At the Newprt Boat Show last weekend, I changed film in maybe 1 to 1.5 minutes, no trimming required, using the old thumb through the shutter method (as always). Yes, my SLR is quicker, but not by much.
Peter_Jones
02-23-2007, 12:48
I have tried 3 methods and found the business card works for me. First time I tried this method I dislodged a chunk of old film - could have been there decades ! I have since had a good look and root about (carefully) and am confident there are no more bits in there. (Touch wood)
Pete
SteveM(PA)
02-23-2007, 12:54
I think we should have a little YouTube permalink to some demonstrations of the various methods. I don't have a decent movie camera, nor am I particularly fast at it:)
The only problem with any of this is
- the 22, 23 or 24 hole dispute, I'm a 22 person
- the credit card, bus card or Zorki case card or finger on plate may cause damage dont do it...
- the knife or scissors will be confiscated when you fly, I use a swiss army penknife
Noel
East Ridge
03-21-2007, 11:01
umm....I'm the new kid in town; where do I find the second post on Leica Bottom Loading instructions? I have loaded before without trimming the film leader, is that not the best way?
laptoprob
03-22-2007, 10:18
Just back from Valencia (Fallas) with the IIf and CLE. The IIf did most the work. Because we only took hand luggage on the plane: no scissors. So I tried to load a film without trimming it, no problem. So why does it seem to be necessary anyway?
tedwhite
03-29-2007, 08:17
I just bought a IIIf red dial w/self timer yesterday. The guy who sold it to me, a decades long Leica rf owner, demonstrated film loading with a roll of my TriX.
I went right out and shot about 15 frames before I realized the rewind knob wasn't rotating. In his defense, the gentleman is 83 years old and had quite shaky hands.
So I went to the thread on manuals, read the loading portion thoroughly, and got the next roll in properly. I could see the gear teeth had engaged the film properly. I back wound the rewind spool a tad to make sure, then closed up the camera. Rewind knob now rotates when I advance film.
Many thanks to everyone for all the instructions and comments.
My lens on the IIIf is either the cv Color Skopar 35/3.5 or the Canon 50/1.8. Don't have any Leica lenses as yet.
Ted
I read a website once dealing with reloading film and the person said to remove the lens before doing anything else. Is this only for precaution to not damage the lens?
tedwhite
04-07-2007, 16:09
Perhaps, with the lens off, one could reach in and guide the film. But there would then be the risk of curtain damage, I think.
If you live in the UK, contact veteran Leica repairer Malcolm Taylor (see contact details in his Amateur Photographer ads) who will supply you with an excellently made copy- very smooth finish and no sharp edges. He can also supply take-up spools for LTM bodies. Repairs and CLAs of LTM and M bodies, and lenses, are his forte! I bought an M3 from him in the mid 80's which still runs as smoothly as butter.
Regards
eia41
Great!!! I just received my Canon IIb and was wondering how the hell I was going to load the film in it, as it is my very first Leica film loading style camera. Thanks a bunch!
Trawlerman
06-09-2007, 19:11
Many thanks for posting this vital information.
I just got a Leica III and would have just gone ahead and tried to load it with a normal roll of film had I not seen this sticky. As it is, I loaded up my first roll of NPC160 in moments qith the aid and advice that I found here.
Many thanks.
BTW, I just scored an ablon from an eBay seller in the US so in future I will be sure that my film trimming is done correctly.
richard_l
06-09-2007, 19:59
Just back from Valencia (Fallas) with the IIf and CLE. The IIf did most the work. Because we only took hand luggage on the plane: no scissors. So I tried to load a film without trimming it, no problem. So why does it seem to be necessary anyway?There's a kink (or warp) near the beginning of most rolls of film which may prevent the film from being inserted all the way. If for any reason, the film hangs up on the inside edge of the film gate, there's a problem. Although this is a no-no, I just insert a playing card into the slot where the film goes, then insert the film between the card and the pressure plate, then remove the card.
The 'correct' method is to trim the leader, which provides a sort of ramp which makes the film ride up into the correct position as it is advanced. I don't like to do this if the film is being commercially processed, since it could bother someone who is not used to handling film with such a long leader.
The kink in the film is what causes most misloads with Leica LTM and M cameras. I.e., it prevents the film from being inserted correctly.
Richard
hou baloo
07-04-2007, 06:15
I went right out and shot about 15 frames before I realized the rewind knob wasn't rotating.
Ted
Irrespective of the loading technique or even of the camera, I always tension the rewind knob/crank before winding up to frame 1 and watch it turn to make sure the film is engaged on the takeup, a lesson I learned from once taking 45 frames on a 20-exposure roll :p
Hou Baloo, I do the same. To make it easier, I wind up the film in the cassette before loading.
350D_user
07-10-2007, 01:55
Irrespective of the loading technique or even of the camera, I always tension the rewind knob/crank before winding up to frame 1 and watch it turn to make sure the film is engaged on the takeup, a lesson I learned from once taking 45 frames on a 20-exposure roll :p
If the sprockets miss the holes though, winding the film too tightly will cause framing issues.
... the voice of experience! :(
Thanks for this thread. I just loaded my IIf with what appears to be successful results (the rewind knob turning). Trimmed 22 holes back, used the rewind knob to tighten the cassette up, put the bottom plate on and advanced two frames, knob was turning just fine. Of course the real test will be whether I get any pictures out of it...
shadowfox
09-23-2007, 12:34
Timely thread! I often wondered why we bother with cameras that needs this much effort to load. But on a camera show recently, I handled a IIc. What a smooth piece of machinery. So I'm willing to give it a try.
If the time I spend shooting with these bottom loaders is enjoyable plus the result is good to excellent, I'll keep using them.
Now I just need to find one I can justify buying :D
I don't like to do this if the film is being commercially processed, since it could bother someone who is not used to handling film with such a long leader.
Film lengths are standardised for automatic processing. I used to use an automatic Mafina processor at home where 135 film was spooled diagonally on a drum about 40 cm in diameter. If the film length wasn't right, the film didn't fit. One film that I had problems with was Fomapan 100, which is slightly longer because its predecessor film used to be shipped with a Leica leader. Foma just changed the leader and kept the length. I regularly had problems developing Fomapan 100 because it didn't fit on the drum. In the end I had to trim the film constantly by hand before spooling it on the machine.
If the time I spend shooting with these bottom loaders is enjoyable plus the result is good to excellent, I'll keep using them.
Now I just need to find one I can justify buying :D
I suggest an M4-2, I just recently acquired one and it's much easier to load than the M3 I tried long ago.
Cheers,
B.
Paul C. Perkins, MD
10-06-2007, 18:05
In fact - I find loading my M-2 far easier than the M-4. On more than one occasion I've had to make multiple attempts to get the film to positively engage on that silly-*ss triple sproket. I have the manual - and it yields no clever insight on how this can be accomplished.
Paul
On my M3, I found that trimming the leader as you would for a bottom loader makes loading much easier. Back in the 1950's 35mm film had longer leaders than what we're using today.
landsknechte
10-07-2007, 20:35
Out of curiosity, were the long leaders universal originally, or are our modern shorter leaders just the one style that caught on?
BTW, the best real world test to see if you've mastered this process it to shoot HIE.
PHOTOEIL
10-07-2007, 22:00
Step #2 is not needed with a M5, just slide in the straight film-end, no cutting, just to make you a little jealous...;)
Vince Lupo
10-17-2007, 22:49
No need to trim the film leader to load a Leica TM. Here's how I do it, for anyone who's interested: Set the main shutter dial on 1/20 (if it's a short-bodied), and then set the slow speed dial to 'T'. Next, trip the shutter to open it. Remove the lens. Remove the bottom plate. Feed the film tongue onto the takeup spool, then guide the film down the slot and into position (if the edge of the film gets caught by the edge of the shutter opening, just push it in with your finger). Rewind the film slowly until the tension is taken up. Close the shutter by turning the slow speed dial. Replace the bottom and the lens. Advance the film and you're golden. I've been doing it this way for 20 years - even with a MOOLY motor and a transmission arm. The only issue is that if you're on the move you have to juggle a lens, bottom plate and the film. But, I just shot 20 rolls in Europe using a black Leica III, and a IIIa with a MOOLY and it didn't pose a problem. So put your scissors away!
rtphotos
12-04-2007, 14:55
Thank you, doubs43 for posting your instructions and the photos! I just received a Leica IIf from Igor Reznik and loaded the film correctly on my first try. :)
As one with 3 thumbs and who took hours to load his first roll of bl&wh film on a spiral, I am relieved. :D
Now off to test this wonderful looking camera (w/summitar and sbooi) with correctly loaded film!
all the best,
rt
ray*j*gun
12-30-2007, 05:12
I have had mu tiny Swiss Army Knife also taken from me by the airlines so heads up!!
[o] Marc
02-23-2008, 04:37
Thanks for this excellent set of instructions - I believe I successfully applied them to loading my newly received IIIa.
rtphotos
03-29-2008, 23:13
Hey, where did doubs43 instructive pictures go?! :mad:
Somebody bring them back!
rt
Is there a live link to the pictures?
There has been so many posts by people who find loading a bottom-loading Leica, FED etc. a chore that I've done a very quick down & dirty "How To" in pictures. I hope this will take the "mystery" out of stuffing film in the bottom of those cameras!
There are eight pictures so this will be done in two separate posts.
Picture One: You need the film, a pair of sissors and the camera.
Picture Two: Pull about 3 1/2 inches of film from the cassette. Four sprocket holes from the cassette, begin your cut and try to approximate what you see here. I add the little snips on the end to sort of round the leader but it's not necessary.
Picture Three: Remove the bottom of the camera body and remove the take-up spool.
Picture Four: Insert the leader under the flat spring of the take-up spool as shown. Note that the film is up against the flange of the spool at the top.
Picture Five: A closer view of the film in the take-up spool.
Now go to the second post for the remainder of the pictures and instructions.
Hey, where did doubs43 instructive pictures go?! :mad:
Probably went the way of the dodo with the server change and/or recent changes in how long gallery pictures survive (which is, incidentally, why the latter was a fundamentally bad idea as it was proposed).
Lesson: Don't link to RFF gallery pictures if you want the images to persist.
The best idea is probably to attach images to the post itself as file attachments. Then either link to them normally using [IМG]http://......[/IМG] tags, or include them in the posting itself using [АTTACH]nnnnn[/АTTACH] tags, where nnnnn is the number of the attachment (visible from the attachment URL).
rtphotos
07-18-2008, 00:04
Probably went the way of the dodo with the server change and/or recent changes in how long gallery pictures survive (which is, incidentally, why the latter was a fundamentally bad idea as it was proposed).
That is a terrible shame!
thanks, Phillip.
rt
frederik@shaw.c
07-24-2008, 11:00
My inherited IIIf came with the ABLON template, which I used to think was used just for cutting leaders on bulk film. In the meantime (for 30 years or more) I loaded the camera with standard short-leader film without removing the lens and using business cards, etc. I never had any trouble. The ABLON came with a neat little notched knife that's run along the edge of the template -- no snags and eliminates the need for a cutting board.
My inherited IIIf came with the ABLON template, which I used to think was used just for cutting leaders on bulk film. In the meantime (for 30 years or more) I loaded the camera with standard short-leader film without removing the lens and using business cards, etc. I never had any trouble. The ABLON came with a neat little notched knife that's run along the edge of the template -- no snags and eliminates the need for a cutting board.
I bought two ABLON type leader cutting templates made in Taiwan from the USA for my bottom loader, then sold the camera. They work great and are "idiot-proof", but loading a was a real pain in the......so me and my sweet Leotax had to part ways. They are both new, very nicely made of steel and have a satin chrome finish. I'll take $35.00 for each shipped free to anywhere in the world from Korea.
Thanks,
Bill
Charles Woodhouse
08-16-2008, 00:53
Hi Bill, I'm very much looking forward to your sweet Leotax, and I'm glad other forum members weren't interested. Thank you.
When I graduated to 35mm way back in '61 memory tells me all the films available then were finished with long leaders for bottom loading cameras,and I remember my father could load them easily into his IIIa(bought new in 1936).
I carry a little pair of nail scissors and my index finger is 4cm from knuckle to tip,so I just pull the film out to that length and recut the leader.I tried using an ABLON but found the blade snagged on the curved edge.
mnmleung
09-17-2008, 04:53
I carry a little pair of nail scissors and my index finger is 4cm from knuckle to tip,so I just pull the film out to that length and recut the leader.I tried using an ABLON but found the blade snagged on the curved edge.
Thanks for the tip, Charles ! Ming
I use both a black dial IIIf and a IIIc converted to a IIIf and the following procedure works perfectly. I snip the leader off completely, stick the flat edge of the film under the spring on the take up spool, making sure the film lies evenly top to bottom on the spool, pull out enough film to make loading the cassette and the take up spool into the camera painless, tighten the tension on the cassette, put on the bottom and away I go. Works every time.
David 11084
02-14-2010, 13:01
A leitz Ablon is the only way to go. Good light is also crucial in order to see the sprockets and film engage.
I am heartened by all those who say that it soon becomes second nature.
Satisfying though!
David
-doomed-
02-14-2010, 13:51
A leitz Ablon is the only way to go. Good light is also crucial in order to see the sprockets and film engage.
I am heartened by all those who say that it soon becomes second nature.
Satisfying though!
David
Eh, it's not necessary , a good pair of nail scissors, or trim several rolls before leaving the house and have them at the ready to load and go. This has become second nature and I'm faster loading a bottom loader than a hinged back camera.
coelacanth
02-14-2010, 14:25
For IIIf (or other Barnacks) I do what -doomed- said. I've got several precut rolls of Tri-X with the cap marked "B" for Barnack.
Never missed the film loading with either IIIf's or Ms. I think it's more fool proof than regular back door loading.
David 11084
04-14-2010, 12:27
The Ablon is the way to go. Once the film is inserted and tweaked with the rewind knob to engage you are home and dry. It does take practice but as several members have said it really isn't that difficult. I have put 6 films through my 1928 1A and each time it has been easier-so much so that I am now ready to take pre-cut film with me and load whilst out and about. The first 6 attempts were a real study in concentration under a bright light!
David
literiter
05-06-2010, 04:41
I used the leader trimming method twice, with success, when I first got my iiif. Then I was stuck without trimmed film or anything to cut it with.
I put the removed the lens, set shutter to T and wiggled the film in. Easy and no leader loss.
I think that having trimmed film in the bag is a better idea however.
the leader needs to be cut very far from close to the leica template. Good enough is good enoug (zorki 5)
To cut a film to fit a bottom loader is not rocket science. No need for a template just cut it close to what you have read on the internet. you will feel it if you have not cut it enough, the film will not fit...... if yes cut it a little more.
David 11084
05-21-2010, 13:43
Hi Mark, I too use the ABLON....essential!
Last weekend i managed to load some pre-cut film wh
ilst out and about; a far cry from struggling for ages to load my 1A when i first had it!
I love the sentiment about keeping these Barnacks alive!
David
i count 22 sprocket holes... steady hand with a tiny pair of folding scissors... trim... i like making a nice rounded tail... memories of elementary school construction paper projects... load... rewind a bit to take up the slack and have the holes fall onto the sprockets... it's all easier than the wordy descriptions make it out to be.
newspaperguy
06-22-2010, 04:02
Hasn't anyone read Stephen's bottom loading instructions
on the CameraQuest site? Simple does work... y'know?
rogerzilla
02-13-2011, 11:00
I must admit, I've never checked engagement of the sprocket teeth. It Just Works.
I have used the alternative method of NOT trimming the leader but first slipping piece of thin card into the film gate to guide the film over the rails. This takes about the same amount of time and you might get a couple more exposures out of a roll.
Aren't most purchased film in the canister already cut for the lead-in?
There's one thing that helped make loading film go smoothly. It was stated in the original manual: Before loading, engage and wind up, press the shutter, then wind up again, and this time, DON'T press the shutter. From here when you load the film things will be in the right position. The take up spool and the film roll should and will set into their respective places at the same time.
Aren't most purchased film in the canister already cut for the lead-in?
Obviously they are, but the lead part isn't long enough. The idea is that the cutout in the longer leader misses the sprocket teeth and the film easily falls into place, and when wound on the teeth then engage with the film.
I find the Cameraquest solution with modern film the easiest and safest in practice even though it does at first seem more long winded than other methods.
Steve
paulfish4570
05-21-2011, 11:40
there are no pictures for me to see. :(
iiif arriving early next week ...
The thread is pretty old, 2005. This instruction is all you need. I have a template that came with my Zorki that makes it easy.
http://jay.fedka.com/index_files/Page345.htm
paulfish4570
05-21-2011, 12:32
thanks, Greg. that will do.
rodfelici
08-22-2012, 14:15
I live in Italy. Here, a very expert repairman showed me the perfect way to load my Zorki I (or for all the bottom loading Leica).
You have to insert the film, then set the shutter lever like as you just closed the bottom. Unscrew the lens. Set the time B and open the curtains. Through the curtains, you will see the film. Eventually adjusst the film vertically with your finger. Mark the frame with an "x", with a soft point marker keeping pressed the button, then release.
Advance one frame. If there is no more the sign, the film has been loaded correctly, and you wasted only two frame.
It is really a perfect way to load, and a precious ssuggestion. I was almost throwing my Zorki because I lost a couple of rolls that I loaded in a wrong way before those instruction.
To cut the film is no more necessary according to him. He told me that it was necessary (for some reason) only with the old film, that was really tiny.
Thomas78
08-23-2012, 10:58
I, personally, think it is much easyer & safer to just cut the film in the right way at home where I can take my time. It only take between 30 and 60 s and it saves me the hassle in the field.
I, personally, think it is much easyer & safer to just cut the film in the right way at home where I can take my time. It only take between 30 and 60 s and it saves me the hassle in the field.
you can't beat that argument! I always do that with my IIf.
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