How do you turn a Leica into a user? [Archive]

Nick R.

09-22-2005, 09:30

Steve Hoffman

09-22-2005, 09:33

Put it in a half-case from Luigi and go. That will keep it unmarred and you can shoot away...

vincentbenoit

09-22-2005, 09:37

foon

09-22-2005, 09:42

find something to scratch it a couple times..:)
then you won't worry

FrankS

09-22-2005, 10:01

Use a Leica? No one actually uses a Leica, you might mar the finish and reduce its resale value! Put it back on a shelf, or better yet, its velvet-lined presentation case where it belongs!

(kidding!)

rover

09-22-2005, 10:06

That little lever and button on the top right. Just get out there and shoot.

DerekF

09-22-2005, 10:46

You guys do use your cameras, right? How do you use them without feeling guilty?

Yep! I use my MP to adorn my bookshelf and to give the duster a workout every week or so. ;)

All joking aside, I can relate to your feelings somewhat. I generally like to keep my stuff in tip-top shape (not just cameras) as much as possible, but while I knew that I had bought my Leica to use rather than collect (dust), I was initially "worried" about my first outing with it. However, after the first couple of shots out and about, I didn't worry so much about keeping that new camera shine anymore. I don't abuse my equipment, but I don't baby it (too much) either. Also, now that I've had it for a few months, my MP's already begun to show some signs of wear, particularly where the strap lugs are, so I'm not so obsessive about it anymore.

Take everyone else's advice and just go out and start shooting with it. It's the best way to get over the initial worries. Personally, I wouldn't intentionally scratch mine, but to each his own. Eventually, if used, your camera will show some wear anyway, so it might as well start now by actually using it. ;)

dreilly

09-22-2005, 10:47

I think it needs your social security number etched in it in a few places.

Blow the resale value all at once without touching the funtionality, then scratch er up getting nice photos over the years. (I'm only partially tongue-in-cheek there!)

FrankS

09-22-2005, 10:48

There is nothing as beautiful (excluding children and women) as a well-used Leica.

Kin Lau

09-22-2005, 10:50

Send it to me... I'll have it in user condition in a month or two :D

RayPA

09-22-2005, 10:59

That little lever and button on the top right. Just get out there and shoot.

I agree. Just start using it. However, I use a neck strap. It feels safer to me. Coincidentally, the only camera I don't have a strap for is my M4-P. That'll change though. I've been trying out the Domke Gripper strap on my CLE, and I like it. It's fairly cheap too. You can get neck straps with the protectant leather tabs on each end. The Gripper has them. Have fun with your new toy.

:)

Nikon Bob

09-22-2005, 11:05

thpook

09-22-2005, 11:10

Put film in it and go outside?

THis is precisely the reason why I look for user quality cameras. My M2 is in near perfect condition. The imperfections? Bright marks on the top from a top mounted meter, and a couple of spots of chipped vulcanite. It looks nice, but it already has a couple of flaws and that's just the way I like it.

impact07

09-22-2005, 11:25

You're supposed to use these things? Isn't this the "fondling" forum? :)

Seriously though. Just use it. There's no such thing as user vs. collector vs. paperweight. They're more beautiful "used" and while they are valuable in the sense that there are people who'll pay tons for them, they are invaluable for the images you can create. Leica made them all users, but some twisted people torture the poor little guys by keeping them on shelves. Poor Leicas. Set them free.

JoeFriday

09-22-2005, 11:29

I try not to abuse my cameras so I just put the bottom half of a never ready case on it and go use it. It is just a camera after all is said and done. Like new cars the first ding hurts and after than no big deal.
I disagree.. EVERY ding in my car causes me great physical and emotional pain.. I've had professional paint touch-ups on my car 3 times in the past 12 months

on the other hand, I view little scratches, bright marks and minor dings on my cameras to be 'badges of courage', to borrow from Stephen Crane.. when I see someone gingerly handling a mint camera only in safe environments, I think "that's too bad"

it's sort of like a child.. as much as you don't want them to get hurt, you know they're experiencing life when they acquire their scabs.. and they were probably having a great time doing it

dll927

09-22-2005, 11:39

Do you really suppose Oscar Barnack intended that all Leicas be icons?

Garry Winogrand is supposed to have had an M-4 with the pressure plate imprinted with film sprocket holes! And many are the combat photographers whose Leicas are worn to the base metal. They probably still work, with maybe a little CLA once in a while.

I have an M4-2 I bought in 1983, and I use it. Moderately, maybe, and it's still in nice shape, but I'm not about to put it in a glass case.

richard_l

09-22-2005, 11:43

My M3 is the only Lieca I have with a real dent (not just a ding) in it. The dent is in the top plate. Looks like somebody banged it into something while a meter was mounted. Maybe this is why I use the M3 more than the M2 or M6.

Besides denting the top plate, consider using a handgrip until you get more used to the ergonomics of the camera. If you want a strap, the Domke Gripper won't scratch it.

Richard

Brian Sweeney

09-22-2005, 11:46

Get one of the older cases made for the M3 or M2 with the meter attached. They are well padded and will protect the camera. I do not worry about the Mint Canon 7's as much as the mint Nikon's. I use the M3 and M2, but they are EX condition. They are all in cases, and stay well protected and are used.

Nick R.

09-22-2005, 12:01

BTW, I just bought a new car in August. Something else to worry about. But just like I drive that everyday. I'm gonna take the camera out and shoot this weekend. In the meantime, I'm going to look for the Domke gripper strap. That sounds good and maybe some Gaffer's tape. I usually don't like using a case but I'm going to check into the ones Brian mentioned.

Lastly, check out the photos in Vincent's sig. They'll get everyone out shooting. Great stuff!

Roman

09-22-2005, 13:22

Lastly, check out the photos in Vincent's sig. They'll get everyone out shooting. Great stuff!

Hey, I just did that, and WOW, Vincent's pics are great!!! Not sure wheter it I really wanna go out shooting when comparing my own meager results with these excellent pics, though...

Roman

Biber

09-22-2005, 13:34

You guys do use your cameras, right? How do you use them without feeling guilty?
I feel guilty when I don't.

Little Prince

09-22-2005, 13:52

Wow! Vincent's photos are spectacular! I mean it. Such drama and quality.

I wish we could see technical details for those pics. Not that it would make much difference to my output, but even so. Just for the excitement of it. I have had more than my share of inspiration for the day.

hoot

09-22-2005, 13:55

IIRC, some of the photos on his website were taken with a digital SLR. I agree they're quite wonderful... but to get that kind of tonality out of a digicam is even more impressive.

principe azul

09-22-2005, 14:12

Understandable. I have this thing with books. If I pay good money for a new book, I'm very careful for a few days turning the pages, and I wipe the cover of smears every five minutes. I wince if someone else turns the pages. Then after a bit it joins the other books covered with dust on the floor, or heaped into a pile so I can stick a desk fan on top, or fallen behind a radiator.

I think it's entirely normal. Until you get some use out of it, your M4-P is a lovely object and a fair chunk of change, rather than a tool. It's only through use that it becomes a tool for taking pictures. Until then, it's natural to cosset it a bit.

I don't baby my M4. My F3 with motordrive, though, wow, that gets some serious fondling...

principe azul

09-22-2005, 14:31

Yep, it's not the money. It's just some weird psychological thing. I have a new, pretentious Moleskine notebook, and I'm fussing about it, admiring it, and worried that I'm going to screw up the first thing I write in it. Yet I know full well in a couple of months it's going to be bent, torn, inkstained, coffeestained, and dirty from being thrown around everywhere. And I'll have written many stupid things in it.

I've not even taken off the green wrapper, because I think that would somehow make it less new, less out-of-the-shop. Yet I know that I'd never in a million years sit down in public and write in it with the lime-green wrapper on.

I've never worried about scratching my chrome M4 with the metal bits of the strap. Yet the first thing I did with the F3 was put gaffer tape over them. Is it because it's black paint? Or do I just pick and choose my neuroses? :rolleyes:

richard_l

09-22-2005, 14:43

Here'e how the Domke Gripper strap attaches to the lug. All camera stores carry them, I think. They're cheap.

Roman

09-22-2005, 14:53

aki-asahi also sells those:

http://www.aki-asahi.com/store/html/patch/M2M3/set/index.php

Roman

JoeFriday

09-22-2005, 15:20

Understandable. I have this thing with books. If I pay good money for a new book, I'm very careful for a few days turning the pages, and I wipe the cover of smears every five minutes. I wince if someone else turns the pages. Then after a bit it joins the other books covered with dust on the floor, or heaped into a pile so I can stick a desk fan on top, or fallen behind a radiator.
I thought I was the only one with a serious book issue!

ya know, this discussion now reminds me of my iPod.. it's silly, because we're only talking about a $300 gizmo, but I've always been extremely careful with it.. if you haven't seen one, the front is a very shiny white plexiglass sort of material.. it scratches pretty easily.. and the back is a chrome plate that is even worse

as soon as I took it out of the case, I covered the back with a clear adhesive sheet.. maybe doing that to the bottom plate of the Leica isn't a bad idea.. it can easily be removed or replaced, and it's on the surface that few people notice

principe azul

09-22-2005, 15:25

Hi Joe, I think Leica does mess with ones psychology. My MP3 player's a cheapie, but it looks nice and understated. Anyway, I got it home and was horrified to feel that it was made of plastic!

xcapekey

09-22-2005, 15:40

hmmm...don't baby it....i know its expensive and its pretty but it's destiny is to be used....it's pretty sad that so many leicas and nikon RFs never see a roll of film in them....i'd say get over it as soon as you can....see it as a tool and not some ubercamera

the things you own end up owning you - tyler durden

peter_n

09-22-2005, 15:44

Nick I'll 5th or 6th the Domke Gripper strap. Put the strap on, put some film in the cam and a sticker on the top plate with the film & speed, then bring the camera everywhere.

Pretty soon you'll be used to it and stop worrying.

back alley

09-22-2005, 16:49

i don't 'baby' anything i own but i treat everything i own with respect.

my last p was the one in the best shape. not a mark on it. second day out and i noticed a couple of light swirly scratches on the top plate. oh well!
and my favourite p? the one that i dropped. it already had a few small dings and essex banged them all out. now i can see the marks but i can't feel where the dings were.

use it, enjoy it, respect it but no real need to baby it.
imho
joe

Dan Chang

09-22-2005, 17:04

lend your Leica to people who fight in Iraq, it will turn out like this Military Leica M3, it went throught Vietnam war. you will not hesitate to use it!

Gabriel M.A.

09-22-2005, 18:52

How do I turn a Leica into a user? Syntax error...does not compute...

Raucousimages

09-22-2005, 23:25

I am proud of the brassing on my MP I take good care of it but it is well used. The engeneers and master machineists who make fine equipment make it to be used. I also loaned a black Contax G2 to a Special Forces solder in Afghanastan for his 14 month deployment. It came back paint-worn but working great. and the negs are fantastic, Kids in the streets did not shy away from a rangefinder but were scared of a big camera (SLR, motor drive and telephoto lens) like the journalists were using. Too much like having a weapon pointed at them again he said.

jlw

09-23-2005, 04:42

I received my M4-P from Traut and it is beautiful. So beautiful, that I'm hesitant to use it. It's not the price that's getting to me. My medium format rig costs more and I regularly take it hiking without a case, just a shoulder strap. But the Leica feels different. I haven't even put a shoulder strap on it for fear of nicking the paint. You guys do use your cameras, right? How do you use them without feeling guilty? I don't want a closet queen.

Here's a simple suggestion for "userizing" a Leica that's sure to be popular:

Lend it to one of your photographer friends for a weekend, or maybe even a week.

Even if the camera comes back in seemingly perfect condition, you'll be scrutinizing it for flaws and find SOME reason to be positive that it isn't quite as nice as it was. Then your worries are over.

If you don't have any photographer friends to ask, I'm sure there are people on RFF who would volunteer to perform this service.

RayPA

09-23-2005, 07:15

dll mentioned Winogrand's M4. If you haven't seen it, here is picture showing the famous pressure plate...
<source: CameraQuest>

:)

back alley

09-23-2005, 07:33

i'm in it for 'the ride'!!

joe

peter_n

09-23-2005, 07:44

I was "riding" on the subway yesterday and my nice new M7 + 50 Summilux got a bit of a bang on the door when the train suddenly lurched. I was holding it surreptitiously with the Zeiss waist finder at right angles on it and I didn't have a grip on any handhold or anything. These things happen. Everything seems OK though. :)

ch1

09-23-2005, 08:00

I received my M4-P from Traut and it is beautiful. So beautiful, that I'm hesitant to use it. It's not the price that's getting to me. My medium format rig costs more and I regularly take it hiking without a case, just a shoulder strap. But the Leica feels different. I haven't even put a shoulder strap on it for fear of nicking the paint. You guys do use your cameras, right? How do you use them without feeling guilty? I don't want a closet queen.

I think this concern is a symptom of the "eB*y Syndrome" complicated by TV shows like Antique Road....

Before, when we bought something, we bought it because we wanted to "use" it. Nowadays, everytime we purchase an item, whether new or as a "pristine" piece of vintage gear, we get all wound up thinking that if we "use it" we'll "ruin it" (or at least "ruin" its value). It's as if we purchase things with a greater focus on the eventual sale of the item than in the use and enjoyment of it.

I suffer from this syndrome and find the only thing I can do to "cure" it is to just bite the bullet and go out and use the darn thing. This is easier to say than do. I just acquired a near-pristine Nikon S2 and now I am afraid to load in some film and use it!

As Charlie Brown would say: "Aaaarrrghh!!!"

xayraa33

09-23-2005, 08:00

Get another Leica, make sure it is not mint this time, and just use it. But just think, all Leicas were minty looking at one time, someone has to use them & I do not know if you can use a Leica in the afterlife ,if there is such a thing or place...... , so use it in this life.

jlw

09-23-2005, 08:06

dll mentioned Winogrand's M4. If you haven't seen it, here is picture showing the famous pressure plate...
<source: CameraQuest>

:)

I thought you usually got this type of pressure-plate marking as a result of film sitting for a long time in the UNused camera, rather than from using it a lot.

If you're constantly running film through the camera, it's always being pulled across the pressure plate, polishing away any marks, or so I'd think.

xayraa33

09-23-2005, 08:10

You can also do what I do, Use non super expensive, non minty Ltm Leicas, Like a user IIIc or IIIf, affordable, even after a CLA and still a Leica.

Nick R.

09-23-2005, 09:33

You can also do what I do, Use non super expensive, non minty Ltm Leicas, Like a user IIIc or IIIf, affordable, even after a CLA and still a Leica.

Last year, I set out to simplify my camera choices to three quality users (user as in used regularly, not condition): I've stuck with the plan and now have a Hexar AF for point and shoot, a Bronica RF for medium format, and the leica M4-P for 35mm RF. Not using the M4-P would violate my goal, which I see as a means to attain camera sanity.

I paid top dollar for the Hexar and the Bronica so I treat them carefully but take them everywhere, from a leaking coal mine to an overgrown swamp. When I bought the Leica, I expected to do the same with it. I suppose what It comes down to is seeing the Leica as a tool and not a work of art and finding the middle road between abuse and disuse.

back alley

09-23-2005, 09:53

3 DIFFERENT cameras?

i never would have thought...;)

joe

Nick R.

09-23-2005, 10:08

Of course, that doesn't include the RFF multiplication factor!

Flyfisher Tom

09-23-2005, 13:02

With all new equipment, especially Leicas, I tie them to the back of my car and drag them around town for at least 5 miles (sometimes 10 miles for good measure). The kids in the neighborhood love it. Reminds them of sparklers on the Fourth of July.

That way I don't feel bad about scuffing them up :-) I have a good time, the cameras get to go on a fun ride. Everyone is happy!

Take your equipment out, they will thank you.

Bill Ely

09-23-2005, 19:04

The one-half cases made by Luigi Crescenzi (www.leicatime.com) are great! You might consider one.

He made one for my Contax IIa (which you can see on his website under "Other Cameras), and it is beautiful, as well as very functional. I had him make the strap 13mm wide, instead of his usual 15mm, and I also designed the lettering on the shoulder pad. He shows a Contax IIIa on his website, but the case was made for my IIa. The classic red velvet lining was his idea.

We also collaborated on a similar case for my Contax G2, which is also shown. The smooth tan leather and the black finish of the camera are really complimentary.

I am very pleased with the cases. They don't protect the cameras 100%, of course, but they certainly help.