View Full Version : Front element for 50MM Summicron
I recently acquired an M2 with a 50mm Summicron, collapsable. The lens has a frozen aperture ring and has excessive cleaning marks. Anyone know where one can get a new front element for this lens at less than an arm and a leg? Please advise.
Johne
I can still use my screw mount lens with adaptors so I am not desperate----yet.
I think arax does this. Does anyone have the address?
phototone
09-12-2005, 21:17
You don't need a new front element, you just need this front element polished and re-coated. At the same time this is done, you can clean (or have cleaned) the aperture ring and re-lubricate it so it will turn smoothly. There are several ways to have this work done, and if you look through previous posts, you will find a long thread where I and another member sent our front elements off to Arax in Kiev, Ukraine and for a very modest fee had them polished, recoated just like new, except they are now multi-coated to modern standards. Another option would be to send the whole lens to DAG camera repair here in the States and have him do the whole job. It will cost 5 times as much, though. The polish and recoat from Arax was about $35, plus modest shipping each way. Expect to pay in excess of $250 from DAG, but he will go through the whole lens and clean and lubricate. You can do this cleaning and lubricating yourself if you are handy with tools. The likelyhood of you finding an un-scratched Summicron front element are very remote, unless you get a lens that is good overall, and you wouldn't want to take the front element from a good lens.
Brian Sweeney
09-13-2005, 02:50
Can you post the address and contact information for Arax?
Brian, you can use http://araxfoto.com
You'll find contact details there, together with mail form for contact.
Denis
Brian Sweeney
09-13-2005, 03:39
Next cheap collapsible Summicron to come along...I will give this a try!
@phototone
Arax only wants the front glass. Do you have any "how to" suggestion on CLA the lens? I am a klutz with tools. I got into my Zorki 2S and wound up sending it to Oleg for CLA [and re-assembly!]. Sherry Krauter said that the lens is in two parts. How do I get them apart and how do I clean? Or do I not tempt disaster at all and have someone else do it.
Just curious.
Johne
phototone
09-13-2005, 09:19
@phototone
Arax only wants the front glass. Do you have any "how to" suggestion on CLA the lens? I am a klutz with tools. I got into my Zorki 2S and wound up sending it to Oleg for CLA [and re-assembly!]. Sherry Krauter said that the lens is in two parts. How do I get them apart and how do I clean? Or do I not tempt disaster at all and have someone else do it.
Just curious.
Johne
While it is true that Arax only wants the front glass, he will, if pressed take the whole lens. You might explain to him that the lens needs cleaning and lubricating and you are incapable of doing this, and have no one available to do it for you.
However this could be a good opportunity for you to learn about these things. There are books available on Leica camera and lens repair. The Tomosoy one in particular gives instructions on lens dis-assembly. You will need a couple of specialised tools, that are available from Micro-Tools. Once you get the "hang" of it, you can take the satisfaction in cleaning and lubricating all of your future lens purchases that need it. You can feel confident in purchasing "less than pristine" lenses at good prices and make them into good "shooters". A Summicron is not a holy relic. It was built by a human. It can be repaired by a human.
Well, sounds challenging but since I am older than home-made-sin, I question how deft I can be. Thanks for the info. Johne
PS I am "pressing" Arex to do it all.
Arax does CLA as well as polish/recoat.
I sent my old elmar for CLA plus polish/recoat and the total cost was $76 including shipping back to US.
blee017
Sounds like a deal! Thanks. Johne
For better, I hope, it is in the mail. Time will tell. Johne
29 Sep 2005 FYI
Fifteen days since last post. Heard today and paid for work. Full CLA, repolish, and recoat front lens element. Total, including return postage, $101.++ [There is a 5.5% to transfer funds--well worth it!] Will report result when arrives.
Johne
Was recently told it "is in process." Waiting-----------waiting----------waiting. Johne
My Elmar sent in early September hasn't returned yet. :bang:
blee017
Did you have similar restoration service? Just curious.
Johne
Yeap, CLA plus front element polishing/coating.
blee017
Ouch! Hope it means that he is so professional and skilled that he has a backlog.
Johne
They do have a backlog, I guess, as their website mentioned a three-week vacation in August.
Also, it seems that they don't do polishing jobs on site.
Here's what I heard from Gevorg.
"I give them to my optic technician. He bring them to factory and control the process."
I didn't expect a fast turnover when I shippied mine to Ukraine so as long as they do a good job, I'd be a happy camper. (fingers crossed)
John
blee017
If I hear anything I will pass it along. In the meanwhile, NVP [Norman Vincent Peale--"Power of Positive Thinking" ] ( :-)
John
phototone
10-17-2005, 10:05
My suspicion is that these repairs go in and await a regular "coating" run at the plant that coats the lenses for Arsenal regular production. Therefore it may take longer at some times of the year, depending on the production schedules. I have dealt with Arax for a couple of years, and have yet to be disappointed with him. I have (so far) had three front elements polished and recoated via his services, and they have all been first rate.
phototone
Thanks! We needed that.
Johne
Mike Kovacs
11-07-2005, 15:16
I'm very curious about the quality of work these Arax guys do. I have a few Zeiss lenses that I would like to have polished. They are prewar so no coating wanted.
Problem is, a couple are collapsible 50/2 Sonnar in Contax RF mount and I understand that they want the lens out of the metal mount. In this lens, the front element is held by friction to the barrel and permanently held into the namering.
Also, I wonder if they have a minimum size - another is the TINY front element from a Tenax I 35/3.5 Novar.
Mike,
I suggest that you contact the following:
Gevorg Vartanyan,
http://araxfoto.com/
Johne
I got my Elmar back a few days ago.
Although I haven't tested it with film yet, it looks good. :p
Here are a couple of pics.
Notice the purple/blue coating on the front element; it was an uncoated prewar Elmar.
As for the minimum size, they can work on Elmar (19mm filter thread) so I guess the Tenax wouldn't be a problem.
John
My compliments. It appears that you transformed a" pig's ear into a silk purse", to steal an old adage. I wait anxiously to see mine [enroute]
Johne
See, if you guys (and the previous owners) had simply protected that front element with a filter, you wouldn't have to go through all this! :) :) :)
Frank,
With all respect, I cannot be responsible for someone's action fifty years ago [except my own!!!].
JOhne
Please notice the 3 smileys.
phototone
11-16-2005, 09:42
I'm very curious about the quality of work these Arax guys do. I have a few Zeiss lenses that I would like to have polished. They are prewar so no coating wanted.
Problem is, a couple are collapsible 50/2 Sonnar in Contax RF mount and I understand that they want the lens out of the metal mount. In this lens, the front element is held by friction to the barrel and permanently held into the namering.
Also, I wonder if they have a minimum size - another is the TINY front element from a Tenax I 35/3.5 Novar.
I have heard that they will take a lens in mount, but would prefer not. As far as polishing an uncoated lens, well you can only take that so far. The success I have had with having three Leica lenses polished and recoated I attribute to the fact that it was basically "only" the coating that was abraded. Early Leica lens coatings are very soft. I would be very interested in hearing from someone who has had an uncoated lens polished. And, considering that, why not just go ahead and have it coated while you are at it? Are you very concerned about changing the characteristics of the lens, with just the front element coated? I would think the difference in the "look" from the lens would be minimal.
Frank,
Your answer deserved 4 :) :) :) :) ! That is why I retorted.
Johne
The lens arrived today. It appears that the front element no longer has any of the heavy markings and is so clear that it could be new [but with better coating than from the factory]. Now to try it out. ARAX and Gevorg Vartanyan proved to be pleasant to deal with on this venture. I found it hard to wait but Gevorg assured me that all was well and not to worry. I took his advice. There is a time element to be certain, but that is to be expected. Now a "throw away" is a prized tool.
John E.L.Robertson
If anyone is interested, I posted picts with this lens at http://www.gallery.swannsway.ch
Johne
Now that it has a modern hard coating, you won't have to worry about protecting the lens with a filter. :)
Frank.
Right! I am amazed by the results on this lens.
John
Check my gallery and rate picts from this lens.
Johne
Dan Chang
11-25-2005, 20:18
Check my gallery and rate picts from this lens.
Johne
from your tiny pictures, the lens wide open has flare, not looks great.
Dan,
Thanks for comment. Which picture do you mean? The four are in gallery section "rate this picture.". This worries me. Can you be more specific? Thanks.
Johne
Johne,
If I'm not mistaken, Dan's comment is about the size of the two pics titled "Remember?" and "New Toy". (He's pulling your leg. :) )
More seriously, I think the scanned images could be sharper.
What scanner do you use?
Have you checked the cleanliness of the scanner optics?
Here's a related link: http://www.vad1.com/photo/dirty-scanner/
John
@Blee017
I save in Tiff and use 600 pixels in jpeg for maximum for posting on sites such as this. Another site has a limit of 120 KB. Just a comment. [I find all this a bit daunting! as I tend to think in X and Super X B&W.
Johne
@Blee017
I save in Tiff and use 600 pixels in jpeg for maximum for posting on sites such as this. Another site has a limit of 120 KB. Just a comment. [I find all this a bit daunting! as I tend to think in X and Super X B&W. Thanks for the tip on the site about cleaning the scanner. I'll check on that.
Johne
Branestawm
11-26-2005, 14:01
I've got a Summar that would benefit from the Arax treatment. I know it's not seen as one of the more desirable lenses but given the prices they charge I might give it a try. The question is how is the front element held in place? I can get the front bezel off and it looks as if the metal has been swaged over the glass. If anyone has tackled one of these before I'd appreciate some advice.
Branestawm:
Ask ARAX how to remove the element or check with them and send the entire lens. I had my CLA-ed while I was at it and am most satisfied.
Johne
Couple of rolls later, I am quite pleased with my refurbished lens!
johne
John Shriver
01-12-2006, 08:53
The Summar front element is indeed held in place with a metal rim bent over on the back side. You need a lathe to machine off the metal. See CRR Luton's website.
Most Summars are uncoated, so the scratches will be well into the glass. You're less likely to have a fully corrected lens when you're done, compared to lenses with wear only to the coating.
Point well taken! Thanks.
Johne
@All
I am still unable to believe how much this lens has improved! It is beyond any expectation I had after first looking on it with shock at its condition. See recent posts here and on gallery.swannsway.ch
Johne
Bingo! Viewers just passed 1,000
Johne
Anyone who has gone thru this refurbish have any pictures to share? Would love to see your outcome.
Johne
Kim Coxon
02-28-2006, 06:09
Standby! I have just got a Cron with a scratched front element. I will photo the process and write it up as soon as I can. I will probably take the element out and put it back so I can do the write up before sending the element away. Otherwise knowing my brain cell capacity, I will have forgotten how I did it by the time the glass comes back!
Kim
Anyone who has gone thru this refurbish have any pictures to share? Would love to see your outcome.
Johne
Kim,
Best of luck. Looking forward to seeing your progress. I feel confident you will be pleased as I was. I am thinking about trying this on a dog of lens I got from FSU.
Johne
I guess it would even be better to substitute the faulty front element but, in view of the results presented here, I decided to contact Arax for the CLA and polishing/recoating of my old 2.8/50 Elmar. Wish me luck!
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