Zorki 1E shutter problems

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POSTI-Tuomo

Level 1 Camera Repairman
Local time
10:59 PM
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Jan 8, 2007
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351
Greetings,

This would be my first post on these forums as I am stumped by some problems regarding the shutter operation on my recently-bought Zorki, so I thought this might be the place to ask :)

My problem is as follows: when operating the camera at lower shutter speeds, namely 1/25 and 1/50, the shutter curtain will not always retract as it should but indeed it works as if the shutter speed was set on "B", that is the curtain will only go back if you release the firing button. This usually happens when the camera hasn't been used for a while. This poses something of a problem because, well, you wouldn't want to waste frames if your camera was loaded now would you?

Apparently the shutter rights itself after some cocking - firing action and functions normally, which puzzles me because if the shutter mechanism was somehow broken wouldn't it act weird consistently?

I'm not all that familiar with the finer points of the mechanics involved in this particular type of camera, so I decided to snap a few photos of the shutter in the cocked and relaxed positions.

As you can see in the first picture, the curtain is smooth and apparently in order. This is the shutter in the relaxed position.

In the second picture it is cocked. You can clearly see this 'bump' or 'ridge' running vertically through the curtain. Could this be the culprit behind those pesky troubles? As far as I can reason, if the bump's too high maybe it causes some unwanted friction and therefore the shutter action remains incomplete.

Looks like a bad start for me with these Russian Rangefinders, so I would be grateful for any assistance you can give.

Picture #1: http://www.kolumbus.fi/~w427831/kuvat/imagedump/uncocked.jpg

Picture #2: http://www.kolumbus.fi/~w427831/kuvat/imagedump/cocked.jpg
 
If you have a warranty it may be better to send it back. Otherwise it is strip and remove old lub which may be wax...

Lots of instruction on site. Odles of people will respond...

Noel
 
I'd say that there's been a film jam sometime in the cameras past as I have a Zorki 1 with similar creases in the second curtain after I jammed it on my first attempt to bottom load :eek: .That said , It may just be the usual crud and dirt in the curtain rails and wind on gears as my Zorki works fine . Try cocking and firing the camera for two or three minutes , This will free up the grease the early Zorki,s are lubed with which does tend to dry out , Also one trick I use if I suspect dry or thickened grease is to leave the camera above a warm radiator for 20 or 30 minutes then cock and fire the shutter a few times , It sometimes works but not always . Failing all that you will either have to have a go at stripping and cleaning it yourself or send it away for the work to be done I'm afraid .

oh and welcome to the RFF :cool:
Paul
 
Tried the continuous recock thing to no avail. So I guess the problem's not with the lubes, maybe a film jam then? How would you go about clearing that? Is it something you can do with a set of tools and a weekend to spare?

Thanks for the welcomes, by the way :)

Well, I'll try warming up the camera, to see what happens...
 
The failure at the slow speeds points to the lube being wax. A week end should be ok but you need a deep tray to catch the (small) parts and a note book or dig cam to photo the strip sequence.

Search the forum for posts by 'Zorkicat' he maintains a workshop manual on line...

Noel
 
Is the crease present in the curtain as you wind on slowly, that is, before you get to the end of the winding action? I'm wondering if this is a permanent crease in the curtain rather than the "crumpling" of the curtain as it gets "pushed" further than it likes.
 
That crease looks very straight, deep and well defined! Not at all like a ripple.


Edit to say, Welcome to RRF.
(where's my manners??)
 
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If the crease is a permanent feature of the first curtain, (and you're not going to return it) I'd be tempted to iron and press the crease flat with appropriate lumps of metal. Only hand hot, don't want to strip the rubberised coating off it. Speaking of this, I wonder if that is OK, partial strip to see, I suppose.
Dave...
 
The crease is permanent, it appears exactly the same every time, at the same spot.
Maybe the curtain has gotten rigid over time?
 
The drama continues.

So I went back to the store (luckily only 50 meters away from my apt.) and told the guy behind the counter about that malfunctioning shutter curtain. He readily admitted his oversight in the matter, having said yesterday that the camera was ok and functional. We pondered on several options on how to correct the situation, including refund, repair and replacement.

He didn't recommend having it fixed by an outsider saying that he wouldn't trust repairmen here in Helsinki...I didn't ask why, but no matter because I wasn't keen on having to wait too long to get it fixed.

Refund was, and still is an option, but the ultimate goal is still to get a working piece of equipment. So he offered to bring another camera of the same type for me.

So it looks like I'm off to his shop again tomorrow and then we'll be wiser as to wheter the replacement is in better shape or not...

Stay tuned, to be continued.

Thanks for all the tips so far though, since this is a great chance to learn about the inner workings of this beautiful baby. :)

EDIT: By the way, fidget, the seller recommended the same cure as you did but I just told him that I don't have the time or tools
to fix the curtain by myself... He did mention that moisturising the curtain a bit prior to ironing & flattening it would be a good idea, what do you think about that?
 
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POSTI-Tuomo said:
Stay tuned, to be continued.

Thanks for all the tips so far though, since this is a great chance to learn about the inner workings of this beautiful baby. :)

EDIT: By the way, fidget, the seller recommended the same cure as you did but I just told him that I don't have the time or tools
to fix the curtain by myself... He did mention that moisturising the curtain a bit prior to ironing & flattening it would be a good idea, what do you think about that?
Click to expand...

Would that be a steam ironing job then?
The crease seen may not have been the cause of the sticking shutter, as others have replied, but was so much of a problem that you would really have to attend to it anyway. I was concerned that as these curtains should be fairly flexible normally, something had happened to the rubberised coating to make it hold that shape. So repairing it might have been a temporary thing.
So now, your duty is to go back after he has fixed you up with a better camera, and offer him a few pennies for the clapped out zorki as um..."spares". New DIY curtains and .......... (my wife says, 'ya can't buy em all!!!'; I know, but I NEED that model!)(please help me..........:rolleyes: )
 
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Dave

The 1e is nice but not rare, lots on e-bay or at UK fairs, shipping it from Finland would be expensive?

They all have wax on the shutters and/or cracks on the blinds, (all mine do). POSTI's (parts or project) camera is his and the dealer may already have it in the bin, unless he moves quickly.

We need new blood to rebuild cameras dont we?

What is this NEED verb you mention...

Noel
 
LOL, I didn't mean that I wanted to buy that one, although it looks like I wrote that doesn't it?
The general FSU rf GAS (from which I am cured, I am assured, now I want more expensive stuff:D ) may have claimed POSTI as its latest victim, these were words of support for the time when other purchases loom. Just recalling the words still ringing in my ears from the time my last purchase (which was ages ago) arrived.
 
Incidentally, I've got a Zorki 1, don't know what version. It's a little beauty, maybe a tad firm to wind and it jammed up when I offered it a bulk load cassette, so waiting for the day....or for sale, I dunno. It seems to suit the collapsing lens on it, so much that a I61 or I26 or J8 or even my CV35 (forgive me, I've dipped my toe in the Voigtlander pool, nice too!!!!) looks completely out of place, so it waits....
Is this a ramble? I'll stop now, I feel much better now.....
 
EDIT: Damn it, managed to time out twice while typing a reply and all that text was lost, had to rewrite all this twice. :D

Heh, yeah, spare parts or a completely new 'project' sounds good, but I'm really keen on just laying my grubby hands on a working Zorki and start shooting. :) I'll find some cameras lying around unused when the need arises. Actually, right now there are 4 Zorki/FEDs on sale on this Finnish online auction site...

All this brings back this story my father told me last weekend. It was about my granddad and his photography hobby and the camera he was using. Dad mentioned that the camera was Russian made, and since his hobby started back in the 40s and 50s, it most likely could have been a Zorki/FED. There are numerous pictures taken by him in our possession.

Being expensive pieces of equipment, even more so in the Finland of that time, my granddad was forced to borrow some money from his future fiancee to buy that camera. So he wrote a letter, a romantic way to coax someone to give money for a hobby. :) And he got the money, too :cool:

But the story continues. The Winter War forced my granddad's family to move from the Karelian Isthmus as it was overrun by Soviet forces. That led him to a rather mobile lifestyle, moving around Finland until settling down in this small village in Kainuu region, which is located in the geographical center point of Finland. Coincidentally, this village he settled in had been on the Soviet list of objectives to conquer in the Winter War. Securing that area was pivotal in the plans to cut Finland in half and advancing all the way to the Swedish border.

Anyway, he was a teacher by profession, so he teached in the small village school built there in the mid-50s. Dad spent most of his childhood there wandering around in the dense woods and whatnot. Since grandmother's death we have been renovating the place to keep it in shape for another 50 years.

And that led us to wonder if granddad's old camera could be found in some of those boxes just lying around in the attic. As far as I know, they haven't been touched for who knows how long. Furthermore, finding it would be cool in itself, but the idea of making it work again is certainly intriguing... Some project, eh? ;)

I'll keep you updated.

Oh and by the way, you may call me Tuomo if you wish (my first name). POSTI is just a reference to my work as I am an employee of the Finnish Postal Service. :cool:
 
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A nice story Tuomo. I would be so nice if you found your graddads camera. Good luck. Good luck too with the replacement for the Zorki, I have no doubt that you will be shooting film on one very soon.

Dave....
 
Tuomo,

Indeed a sad story, thank you for telling it. Dave and I would have searched the loft several times over. As unless the storage is dry and temperate the lens may have fungus damage.

Posty is what we might call a postman here, affectionately, and Posti is a phonetic spelling, of the venacular pronouncation.

The adolecents write 'Posty Posty dont be slow be like Elvis go man go' on Valentine Day card envelopes here.

Both Dave and I would try to get the dealer to sell the 1st Zorki as a project camera, we have a large collection of project cameras, none of which work. And worringly my Zorki 1e has exactly the same symptoms as yours had. These were temperature dependent, indoors the 2nd blind is intermittently slow on slow speeds, out of doors there is no exposure at all the second follows the 1st blind. I think I need to replace the lubricant.

Noel
 
Several of my FSUs have creased curtains similar to the appearance in your photo. I think they just get like that if they've been left unused for years, as most have at some point. It doesn't affect the operation of any of mine one bit. I think the problem is more likely dried-up lube. A thorough CLA would probably bring it back to life. The Zorki 1 is not rare, but (IMO) such a lovely camera that it'd be a shame not to see it working again.
 
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